Converting to a Wallas

Dora~Jean · Posted: Fri Mar 17, 2006 3:05 am Post subject:

Well I was just about ready to make the move and order a Wallas 125DU stove with heater lid when I found the Wallas 1300 model last night on the Scan Marine site -- and the 1800 model on the Wallas site tonight.

Called Scan Marine today, they said the 1300 should work fine for my boat. But, it has a 'fixed' 4000 BTU output (1500W electric equivalent), which I think'll toast me out of my boat with Boris and Judy's remark that the stove/heater gets the 25 cabin a bit warm even on low at 2000 BTU's.

Plus, they said it wouldn't be good to cycle it on/off, too much current, not good on the unit particularly, said to "open a window" if it gets too warm. They said it has about the same fuel delivery mechanism as their stove.

The 1800 appears to not only be adjustable to lower settings, but is thermostat capable. I'll call for pricing tomorrow. Both units are quite compact at 14.5"Lx8.5"Hx4.5"D so it could mount inside the galley cabinet, combo exhaust/inlet tube to the hull wall (w/8" riser) and duct to a remote register to the isle area.

This would solve my problem of wanting to keep my double-burner alcohol stove (yes, I actually like that stove) and if there's problems with the Wallas (some say never) then not only would I still have a stove (and make-shift heat source with ventilation) but I wouldn't have to use the knife that comes with the stove that Joel has suggested a usage for...!

More to come. Anyone else use either of these Wallas heaters?

Steve

MOOSE · Posted: Fri Mar 17, 2006 10:23 am Post subject:

If it were me (which of course, it's not), I'd lose the alcohol stove and go with the 125 DU. I have no knowledge of the other models you reference, but I feel that the 125 is far superior to cook on than alcohol, and will do everything you need it to do to heat the cabin. In a confined space, there is nothing better than getting double duty out of one piece of equipment - heater and cooktop.
Al

digger · Posted: Fri Mar 17, 2006 10:30 am Post subject: Yup, 1300 Wallas

Got the 1300 heater on Snoopy-C.

Works great. I use kerosene with it, and have never had a problem. Venting is through the roof, and the air intake is the same stack. It has a dual tube with the intake coming through the outside tube and the exhaust going through the center tube. Regards, Ron

DodgeRam · Posted: Fri Mar 17, 2006 8:38 pm Post subject:

When using a 1300 heather , can you still put a dinghy on the roof? Or that stack outside would be to hot?

Gary SEARAM

Dora~Jean · Posted: Fri Mar 17, 2006 10:18 pm Post subject:

Thanks all for your information. Al, I here ya, but I REALLY like my alcohol stove. I've been cooking multi-course meals for 16+ years on the identical model on 3 different boats, so I guess you'd say I've gotten use to its quirks. The 125DU, like all the double-burner Wallas', have 1 hot burner/side and 1 med/hot side -- I could get used to that. I like the simple, instant startup of the alcohol, if batteries are low it still works. No electronics or pumps to screw up and deny me of a hot meal. I like the idea of separating the functions of stove and heat in case one fails on a long trip -- would rather have the stove available.

Ron, glad to hear at least 1 other person has used the 1300. I plan to mount it under the counter, run the combo exhaust/intake tube out the side of the hull near the sink drain, maintaining an 8" min gooseneck. But it's a whopping 2" hole to drill -- ouch! Then I'll route the ducting within the cabinet to a low placed register towards the isle. I'll also remote the on/off switch and make it lighted to see when it's ON or OFF. BTW, 4000 BTU's is more like 1200W equivalent electric heat, not 1500W as Scan provided.

Called Scan Marine, the 1300 is what they sell, said the 1800 is considerably more expensive and must order from the Finland factory direct. No thanks. The 1300 base unit sells for $850 + $150 or so in accessories needed for full installation. I think I'm gonna love Wallaland!

Steve

digger · Posted: Sat Mar 18, 2006 12:26 pm Post subject: Wallas 1300

The Wallas stack cap is a pop-up affair that can be locked down to seal the unit for trips,etc. I've never bothered. It is extremely weather tite, and leaks no water in a pouring rain. Also, when the stove is operating, the cap portion (i.e. the center of the exhaust stack) gets as hot as an iron. Rain, etc. will sizzle when it hits, so the answer is "no" to a dingy if it were place on the cap. The surroundings however are cool, so the radiant heat travels no more than a couple of inches. Smile

Ron

Dora~Jean · Posted: Sat Mar 18, 2006 1:37 pm Post subject:

The Wallas 1300 has two optional venting feed-thru's, through the roof or a side-thru, I plan to go with the side-thru to keep everything under the counter and out of sight. I will have to look at how it's sealed for sea-water intrusion although I plan to keep it as high above the waterline as the 8" inside gooseneck allows. One advantage of the combo exhaust/intake venting is that the hot exhaust pipe is contained within the cooler intake air flow. Disadvantage -- large hole.

Steve

Not For Hire · Posted: Sat Mar 18, 2006 3:08 pm Post subject:

Steve, interesting project. I was contemplating putting a 1300 inside the stove/sink cabinet, running the "stack" vertically to the roof. Figured I would run two heat ducts, one to the windshield with a secondary duct to the v-berth and one to the floor area with a secondary duct to the helmsman's feet. For whatever reason (like lack of imagination or not reading the manual) I never thought of doing a through hull installation like you mention. Big hole that low? Keep us posted so we may continue schooling. I had looked at Espars and some others adapted from semi-truck style heaters kind of pricey, but seemed okay and lend themselves to hidden installations.

Thanks and regards,

Not For Hire · Posted: Sat Mar 18, 2006 3:21 pm Post subject:

Ron,
If you wanted to bother with ducting is there any reason you can see that the 1300 could not be installed inside the sink/stove cabinet? I looked at your album again hoping to see a pic of the exhaust stack next to your rod holders but no luck.

Al, darn right conserving space has to be a mantra on these boats. Down to about 18 inches of snow in my backyard and my driveway is mostly pavement, it's coming your way too. Figure about three weeks to getting her wet again if all goes well. They are catching nice steelhead in the Big Manistee on plugs.

Dora~Jean · Posted: Mon Mar 20, 2006 11:31 pm Post subject:

Ordered the Wallas 1300 heater today from Scan Marine. When I said I'll need 4ft of heat ducting to begin with, they shut me down, 3ft max! Seems the back-pressure to the tiny fan operation is too high beyond 3ft. But I'm figuring if that's the case, I could 'branch' off another duct a foot or two from the heater with say a smaller diameter to warm the V-berth, the back-pressure to the fan (and air flow) shouldn't be affected, if anything, should be less. That's my theory anyway. Will probably set it up per factory specs, then experiment later...

Steve

Sea Wolf · Posted: Tue Mar 21, 2006 5:44 am Post subject:

Steve-

Sounds like your branching idea will work. That fan must be pretty weak!

Another approach to aid the flow would be to go to the ends of your ducts and install booster fans to help pull the air to the outlets.

The small computer fans come in s myriad of different sizes and can be adapted to all kinds of uses.

Here's a photo of one I put in a duct to push air up a 4 ft tube:

The fan frame has been ground off to round it off to fit inside the plastic drain cap which is to be used as a vent grille.

The entire heater installation is here:

http://www.c-brats.com/modules.php?set_albumName=Cabin,Interior&id=Force_10_Cozy_Cabin_Heater_in_Sea_Wolf&op=modload&name=gallery&file=index&include=view_photo.php

Joe.

jennykatz · Posted: Tue Mar 21, 2006 9:40 am Post subject: heaters ??

what about putting an elec heater in the cabin and then using a honda or yami gen to power it just a thought any problems that i might incur ??

Sea Wolf · Posted: Tue Mar 21, 2006 1:04 pm Post subject:

jennykatz-

That generator-electric heater combo is just what several of us use, but usually as a back-up system. (See Red Fox's discussion of the New Yamaha generator on another current threaad.)

The only reasons it's used mostly as a back-up system are 1.) the noise of running the generator at night, 2.) the concern for carbon monoxide issues, and 3.) other considerations, including refueling, generator placement, and weather and salt water exposure.

Some people find the generator noice objectionable, while others would say you can't really hear it all that much over the fan noise of the electric heater. It just depends on what bothers you. If you''re on a dock, or ashore and alone, a long extension cord can get the noise source away from you as well as remove the source of carbon monoxide. Greg (RF) has been known to put the generator out afloat in the dinghy overnight with an extension cord led along the teather line to get it away from the boat.

This brings us to the next point. The generator must be positioned in such a way that the carbon monoxide is vented over the side and not into the cockpit and then into the cabin, usually by tying the generator down on the stern somewhere, like on one of the lazarettes or engine well. A carbon monoxide detector inside the cabin would be a must have accessory to this system.

Next, the generator is sensitive to rain and salt water and must be positioned accorddingly during transport and use. A little thought and perhaps a protective enclosure will solve these problems, however.

Refueling the generator is another issue, but can be done easily providing it's not raining, etc. Extended run tanks can be set up as well, and the generator can be coupled to the boat's main fuel system.

So, as you can see, the system can be made to work, but requires a little forethought and supervision. Most folks use it as a back up, but if you can find a good, permanent spot to mount the generator (which will solve most all the issues above except the noise problem), the electric heater/generator combo would be a natural, and the presence of the generator would open up a whole bunch of other possibilities for conveniences on the boat.

Joe.

Dora~Jean · Posted: Tue Mar 21, 2006 11:59 pm Post subject:

Joe, good idea on the push/pull fan-in-the-tube trick! I once did something like that to vent battery gases overboard in an enclosed battery compartment that was INSIDE the cabin -- couldn't believe the mfr got away with that for years. I used a 3" RV sewer hose (new of course...) and found a suitable computer fan that fit just right, worked great, no more fumes. Should work with the Wallas heater -- unless it is sensitive to TOO MUCH air flow as well. Heck, maybe just the one register output will work fine, might do that for a year before making mods -- got plenty of other mods on my list that continues to grow and grow and grow.

Steve

dogon dory · Posted: Wed Mar 22, 2006 12:40 am Post subject:

Sorry, Folks - Post Deleted By Author