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Connecting Deployed Anchor Rode to Boat
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Yosef



Joined: 26 Apr 2022
Posts: 16
City/Region: Eastern Washington (state)
C-Dory Year: 1988
C-Dory Model: 22 Cruiser
Vessel Name: Heron
PostPosted: Thu May 25, 2023 6:02 pm    Post subject: Connecting Deployed Anchor Rode to Boat Reply with quote

Hi Everybody,

I've had Heron out on a couple overnight trips to Lake Roosevelt (the one in WA state).

When anchoring I let out my delta anchor with 30' of chain then 1/2" 3-strand rope. I tie the rope off to the (center line, behind windlass) bow cleat and call it good.

Reading here about anchoring I'm getting the impression I should be securing an extra line from the bow hook (where I attach the trailer's winch) to the anchor rope (using a "rolling hitch") so the anchor is yanking on the bow hook instead of pulling through the (Lewmar 66840007) bow roller to the bow cleat?

I get the impression the reason for this is the bow roller isn't intended to take the strain of anchoring.

Are my impressions correct?

TIA

-Joe Dowd
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ssobol



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PostPosted: Thu May 25, 2023 6:49 pm    Post subject: Re: Connecting Deployed Anchor Rode to Boat Reply with quote

Yosef wrote:
Hi Everybody,

I've had Heron out on a couple overnight trips to Lake Roosevelt (the one in WA state).

When anchoring I let out my delta anchor with 30' of chain then 1/2" 3-strand rope. I tie the rope off to the (center line, behind windlass) bow cleat and call it good.

Reading here about anchoring I'm getting the impression I should be securing an extra line from the bow hook (where I attach the trailer's winch) to the anchor rope (using a "rolling hitch") so the anchor is yanking on the bow hook instead of pulling through the (Lewmar 66840007) bow roller to the bow cleat?

I get the impression the reason for this is the bow roller isn't intended to take the strain of anchoring.

Are my impressions correct?

TIA

-Joe Dowd


Usually I secure my anchor as you do, through the bow roller and to the center cleat on the foredeck. I have put a line through the bow eye to a mooring though. Mostly because it was more convenient in that situation.

I never thought that going over the bow roller would be a problem. If you have the right scope, there should not be high loads on the roller.

I have used the "bounce" method to retrieve a stuck anchor through the roller without problems as well.
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Robert H. Wilkinson



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PostPosted: Thu May 25, 2023 7:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I secure the bitter end of my rode to the inner side of bow eye inside my anchor locker. I tie off at the desired length to the forward cleat then pull rode down to the bow eye. I do this to increase my scope with less rode deployed.

Rob

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smckean (Tosca)



Joined: 18 Jan 2014
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PostPosted: Thu May 25, 2023 7:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Personally I don't believe securing to the bow eyelet is necessary as long as the proper scope is used (as was mentioned). I can image an exception this (to which I've never had to resort). If I were securing for a violent storm, I might well use the bow eyelet. (Note on a CD25 you have to get in the dinghy to do this.)
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thataway



Joined: 02 Nov 2003
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PostPosted: Thu May 25, 2023 11:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

There is some risk of chafe on the bow roller and potentially the windlass We use two shock absorbing lines from extra cleats installed on each side of the foredeck". The snubber lines are attached to the rope rode with rolling hitches or Prusik knot. (with an eye splice.)


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Yosef



Joined: 26 Apr 2022
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City/Region: Eastern Washington (state)
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PostPosted: Fri May 26, 2023 6:06 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Bob,

How long are your 3/8" nylon snubber lines?

-Joe Dowd
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Foggy



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PostPosted: Fri May 26, 2023 11:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Kudos for bridle use at anchor.

A bridle and snubber are essentially the same albeit the former (as seen in Bob's
photo) is "Y" (or a "V" with a short tail) while the latter is "I".

These are essential, to most, using all chain anchor rode to reduce shock loads on
deck hardware and the boat. They can also reduce weight for those preferring all
chain by using a longer nylon bridle/snubber and somewhat less chain. Both can
be used as an extension of a chain/nylon rode to gain more scope.

Bridles are seen almost exclusively on multihulls but are also effective on smaller
monohulls. Compared to a single "I" snubber, bridles somewhat reduce bow yaw
in veering winds at anchor and may require additional deck cleats/chocks (one
port, one starboard) on a monohull.

When jury rigging your anchor "system", remember chafe protection.

Aye.

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thataway



Joined: 02 Nov 2003
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PostPosted: Fri May 26, 2023 9:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yosef wrote:
Bob,

How long are your 3/8" nylon snubber lines?

-Joe Dowd


The lines are 20 feet long--usually 10' to 15' deployed. Those in then photo are probably 5/16.

On my larger boats, I had different size of snubbers. For example for the 62' I had 1/2" and5/8" and depending on the anchor, used 3/4 to 1" rope rode. Loads on the larger boats can be substantial, and I have actually broken one of the 1/2" snubbers, but the 5/8 was there to back it up--and after the line was broken it was replaced.
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Foggy



Joined: 01 Aug 2013
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PostPosted: Sat May 27, 2023 7:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Tho helpful, not foolproof.

Consider Bob's above bridle set up in high winds and steepish wave action. The
bow will pitch and yaw. It doesn't take too much imagination to anticipate the
bridle becoming entangled or chafing thru on the anchor roller bracket.

This can present a significant and dangerous problem to deal with. Not to mention
needing to cut and run to a different place leaving your anchor system behind.
It begs anticipation of weather events, realizing what strong wind can do to water
with open fetch and careful selection of an anchorage location.

Be careful out there and have fun doing it.

Aye.
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thataway



Joined: 02 Nov 2003
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PostPosted: Sat May 27, 2023 11:54 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Foggy wrote:
Tho helpful, not foolproof.

Consider Bob's above bridle set up in high winds and steepish wave action. The
bow will pitch and yaw. It doesn't take too much imagination to anticipate the
bridle becoming entangled or chafing thru on the anchor roller bracket.

This can present a significant and dangerous problem to deal with. Not to mention
needing to cut and run to a different place leaving your anchor system behind.
It begs anticipation of weather events, realizing what strong wind can do to water
with open fetch and careful selection of an anchorage location.

Be careful out there and have fun doing it.

Aye.


Foggy makes good points: The bow roller/anchor pulpit SS piece is a potential chafe point. My added on cleats were specifically positioned so there is a fairlead off the body of the cleat and nothing to chafe against, except perhaps in a 3' + seas. I would not remain anchored in that situation--I would move and find a sheltered place or put to sea. I have done that on several occasions where holding was poor.

I have used the system noted above for several thousands of nights at anchor, and in winds up to 90 knots. However none of those were in areas of large swells or waves. The only situation that I have been personally involved with which had those conditions was the December 1982 Cabo San Lucas onshore wind storm.

We arrived about a week after the storm, carrying salvage gear and fiberglass repair materials. In the below photo I am second person from the bow of Vagabond. She was successfully salvaged. Anchors pulled loose, boats were caught in the surf, there were a number of boats which were bow toward the beach, in shallow water, and the squalls came from offshore.



Boats which survived were bow away from the beach or a canoe type stern, and had chafing gear on.

When I broke one of the snubbers, we were at Cuylar Harbor, San Miguel Island (Calif.) and I was practicing sailing off the anchor with my crew. I had hoisted the mizen and was getting ready to hoist the Genoa, when. 50+ mph gust hit us abeam. The crew and my self were focused on hanging on, as the boat went to rail down in a second or two. The smallest of the snubber lines (1/2") failed. The snubbers were to the anchor chain. The break was mid snubber--no point of chafe.

I should have commented on what we do with an all chain rode, and that I usually left a "belly" in the main rode, so it takes the load only if the snubbers are at their max load or break. Snubbers on that size boat had fire hose chafing gear attached where the rode went thru the hause pipe. (In this case, 6" x 4". oval bronze openings in the hull about a foot down from the gunnel forward.

With all chain rode, I have a permant thimble spliced with a shackle to a "chain hook" or "chain gripper plate"

Chain gripper plate

Chain Hook

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ggray



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PostPosted: Sun May 28, 2023 7:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

This must have been when Joshua was blown ashore?

thataway wrote:


The only situation that I have been personally involved with which had those conditions was the December 1982 Cabo San Lucas onshore wind storm.

We arrived about a week after the storm, carrying salvage gear and fiberglass repair materials. In the below photo I am second person from the bow of Vagabond. She was successfully salvaged. Anchors pulled loose, boats were caught in the surf, there were a number of boats which were bow toward the beach, in shallow water, and the squalls came from offshore.



Boats which survived were bow away from the beach or a canoe type stern, and had chafing gear on.
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thataway



Joined: 02 Nov 2003
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PostPosted: Sun May 28, 2023 9:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ggray wrote:
This must have been when Joshua was blown ashore?


Yes it was, we helped get her floating and she was taken to La Paz for refit and the eventual trip up North. She was pretty well banged up, and the interior was badly damaged. Rigging was shot etc.

There were heart breaks. There was a Valiant 40 which looked intact, but had a lot of sand inside. We helped dig her out--and then we found the entire port side was holed. A bull dozer came to crush the rest of the boat and scoop it up for a landfill! There were a few boats which were salvaged and went on to complete the cruise they started. (One was over 10 years later, The boat which had survived the Cabo Storm, was lost at Fiji and another boat was acquired for the rest of the circumnavigation.
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Peter & Judy



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PostPosted: Sun May 28, 2023 10:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have installed two extra cleats on my bow, as Dr. Bob has and then I attach a snubber line to take the pull off the anchor roller. This is where the strain and chaffing occur on the rode. I use use about 10 feet of line of a smaller diameter line and tie a "Prussic Knot" into the line and around the rode. I then tie this off on the side cleats and then loosen the rode so that it hangs slack, with the snubber line taking all the strain.
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flatfishfool



Joined: 11 Apr 2009
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PostPosted: Fri Jun 02, 2023 3:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I anchor over the bow roller and have done so on many vessels (CD or otherwise) in extreme tides and currents. Also pulling the anchor in currents via buoy/ring technique which can exert significant stress. No issues. I admire the more sophisticated riggings but I wouldn’t sweat it unless you’re leaving the boat in rigorous environments unattended. In that case I might take more precautions. I would not let the windlass carry the tension, but sounds like that’s not what you do.
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Yosef



Joined: 26 Apr 2022
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PostPosted: Fri Jun 02, 2023 10:11 am    Post subject: Re: Connecting Deployed Anchor Rode to Boat Reply with quote

ssobol wrote:

I have used the "bounce" method to retrieve a stuck anchor through the roller without problems as well.


What's the "bounce" method?

-Joe Dowd
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