Closing Lake Mead

[ssobol]

Apparently the NPS is talking about closing all the ramps at Lake Mead due to low water.

Local boaters are not amused.

https://www.reviewjournal.com/local/the-strip/dozens-of-boaters-take-to-strip-to-protest-possible-lake-mead-ramp-closures-2695686/amp/

[jkidd]

If they are going to close it then they should lay off the rangers and park employee's. If they told them that's what they were going to do I'm sure they would come up with some ideas like portable ramps or cranes to launch boats and keep there jobs.

[ssobol]

[jkidd]

A little more information

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WnIKHau6oTk

[colbysmith]

Very interesting video.

[Hunkydory]

Jody, good informative find, thanks for sharing.

Jay

[thataway]

Jody, very interesting video. Have you been paying your $400 a day fee to be taking any photo graphs in the National Recreational Areas? (This includes I phone.). Photographers are limited to 1 tripod and one backpack of camera gear. $200 of that fee is non refundable, even if you don't get your permit (which has to be applied for in advance to your arrival in the NRA.

If we don't get some very substantial snow pack this year, I see both Powell and Mead being shut down for boating?

[Pat Anderson]

One comment on the filming issue: either an iPhone or big professional gear could be used for "commercial" filming. It would seem to depend on the purpose. It would be a STRETCH to say videos for personal enjoyment of friends and family are "commercial" filming. However, even iPhone videos MONETIZED on YouTube could well be considered "commercial." But that seems to miss the point. The issue in my mind is whether the filming affects the use of streets, parks, or public property by the general public, or whether filming requires special services from police, fire or public works. That was our test in Snoqualmie. A lot of movies and commercials have been filmed in Snoqualmie, including most of "Twin Peaks"!

The lake water level issue seems to get worse and worse. I probably won't ever get back to Powell and I am glad we boated there in 2008, 2009, 2010, and 2014. As supply goes down, down down, year after year, demand goes UP. The growth and development in Arizona on I-10 between Phoenix and Tucson is insane. The same in Utah around Salt Lake City. The prospects long term for recovery of the reservoirs appear bleak.

[thataway]

Pat, I feel the same that we will never be able to return to Powell.

However the Western Waters have been a source of shortage and conflict thru the brief history of the United States and period of exploration. My college Class (1958 Pomona College) has monthly Zoom meetings of many of our living alumni. I am on the steering committee which meets weekly. One of the long range topics which we have had experts (both from our class and current professors) present, is on the water wars, rights and conflicts for Southern Calif. (We addressed the Owen's Valley, the Sacramento Delta, as well as the Colorado River and local water tables under the LA/Orange County basin.). More recently we have addressed the issues with desalination plants.

At some point, and no one knows when precisely, there will be enough snow pack and water run off to again fill the lakes at least part way. What we don't know is if Lakes Powell and Mead will be saved as both generating power and significant water storage. This brings up if the major dams should be destroyed and the Colorado river be allowed to freely flow. I doubt that the destruction of the dams will occur, but loss of generating power is certainly likely.

The issue of photography is not as clear cut as it might seem. Pat brings up a number of valid points. I would be very miffed if some ranger wanted to change me $400 a day for taking photos as we cruised Lake Powell.

[colbysmith]

With all the wild weather out west and current snow pack at least in the Sierra's (I know, wrong range for Lake's Powell and Mead), I would hope many of the western reservoirs will start to reverse the past cycle, and start filling again. Colby

[thataway]

Currently the snow pack in the Colorado River drainage basin is about 140% of normal. It appears that it may be a good year from that standpoint. But just that will not fill up the reservoirs.

[jkidd]

Lake Powell is in the process of moving Bullfrog marina to Stanton Creek on the main Channel and building a new ramp over there. I will be extended to dead pool as the lake goes down. it is a permanent location for the marina. The south end will extend their ramps as well. even if the lake reaches dead pool it will still be a big lake. The propaganda that is being spread right now is that when the lake reaches dead pool no more water will pass through the dam. The truth is any water coming down the Colorado will simple flow through the dam to lake Mead.

If both Lake Powell and Lake Mead were to reach dead pool they wouldn't be generating electricity and I don't think the southwest would like that much. They are going to half to start cutting back the water allocations so that they can maintain power pool. They need to set elevations in each lake so that when a lake reaches it's emergency level they have to ration the water until it recovers. Both dams need to be there in order to make things work as designed. If you want to understand the logic behind it find yourself a copy of the book called " A wild Red River Tamed " They do a good job of explaining why it all exists. If you were to dismantle it you would basically turn the whole southwest into a ghost town.

[jkidd]

[Schuster]

We have been spending our winters in Apache Junction, Arizona for the past 10 years. In our travels North to Puget Sound area every year we pass by either Lake Mead or Lake Powell and are amazed at the loss of water over just a few years. Lake Shasta is in the same or possibly worse condition judged merely by observations from I-5 on our journey south every year. I find it somewhat disturbing that the greater Phoenix area is growing by leaps and bounds. Which is partially do to all the Baby Boomers buying up properties down here. They are currently building entire neighborhoods all at the same time. Mind boggeling. It would seem that there is absolutely no concern for the effects of the demand for water. Golf courses all over the place watering like crazy. I don't excuse myself from being part of the problem as I enjoy being here in the winter. Just don't know where it's all headed. Hopefully the weather being cyclic, will fill the lakes and reservoirs once again.

[thataway]

Jody, I suspect that the SW would adapt rather than become a ghost area. Phoenix gets 36% of its water from Colorado River--its other sources: Verde and Salt River, plus ground water still are working. Phoenix has purchased land on other Western Water basins for their ground water resources. Tuscon does get water, but apparently does not use all of its allocation and has vast underground (deep) water. We drove across country many times along I 10, and there are multiple towns with minimal water supplies (ground water mostly) which continue to thrive (sort of). They serve the highway trade, but also the local ranchers who are not dependent on Colorado River in the SW.

Colorado River water shut down would certainly affect agriculture (some of which is not American owned.) Even Calif water from the Colorado River is mostly used for agriculture. (Consider the Imperial Valley).

If the dams were eliminated then there would be substantial power loss, but other renewables would be increased. Most of Las Vegas power comes from Natural Gas, in one of the areas optimal for solar power (issue of night time storage). Only about 20 % of Bolder dam power goes to Las Vegas. Las Vegas has aa very high % of recycling water. (And I suspect they would adjust to loss of Lake Mead water.) Southern Nevada has 8 years reserves of water according to one recent source.

Lets hope that we never find out what happens if the lakes reach dead pool. No more River Rafting (Maybe)--but still some boating.