The C-Brats Forum Index
HomeForumsMy TopicsCalendarEvent SignupsMemberlistOur C-DorysThe Brat MapPhotos

Why does my steering stiffen up at speed?
Goto page 1, 2  Next
 
Post new topic   Reply to topic    The C-Brats Forum Index -> Outboards and Systems
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
Roamad



Joined: 20 Jul 2021
Posts: 70
City/Region: Isleton
State or Province: CA
C-Dory Year: 1988
C-Dory Model: 16 Angler
Photos: Roamad
PostPosted: Sun Mar 27, 2022 7:07 pm    Post subject: Why does my steering stiffen up at speed? Reply with quote

My steering spins just fine at the dock and at low speeds. But once I open up the throttle, the wheel gets very hard to turn — two hands required! What’s going on and how do I fix this?
_________________
1988 16’ C-Dory Angler, 2007 Mercury 60hp EFI
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
srbaum



Joined: 30 Aug 2010
Posts: 875
City/Region: Portsmouth
State or Province: VA
C-Dory Year: 2007
C-Dory Model: 26 Venture
Vessel Name: Osprey
Photos: Osprey
PostPosted: Sun Mar 27, 2022 8:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Roamad,
Do you have push-pull cable steering, or hydraulic steering?

_________________
Steve Baum
Homeport of Portsmouth, VA
OSPREY (Ex Mister Sea) 2000 22 C-Dory 2010 - Sold 3/19
OSPREY (Ex ADITI) 2007 26 Cape Cruiser 2018
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
NORO LIM



Joined: 24 Apr 2008
Posts: 875
City/Region: Olympia
State or Province: WA
C-Dory Year: 2006
C-Dory Model: 23 Venture
Vessel Name: NORO LIM (sold 12/12/14)
Photos: NORO LIM
PostPosted: Sun Mar 27, 2022 8:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Is turning hard in both directions? Did the problem crop up suddenly? Had the boat been sitting for a while before the problem started?

You definitely want to look into this. Losing control, especially at higher speeds - YIKES!

_________________
Bill, Formerly on NORO LIM
2001 CD 16, 2001-2006
2006 CC 23, 2006-2014
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Roamad



Joined: 20 Jul 2021
Posts: 70
City/Region: Isleton
State or Province: CA
C-Dory Year: 1988
C-Dory Model: 16 Angler
Photos: Roamad
PostPosted: Sun Mar 27, 2022 10:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

It’s cable steering with a single cable mechanism behind the helm. Issue has been there since I bought the boat about six months ago. It had an ancient 2-stroke that I had a mechanic replace with a newer (used) 4-stroke. No change in the problem with the engine swap. Previous owner told me he put in a new steering cable, and it does look new. But yes, the boat had been sitting for a long time when I bought it.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
Almas Only



Joined: 09 Nov 2003
Posts: 362
City/Region: Richmond
State or Province: VA
C-Dory Year: 2003
C-Dory Model: 22 Cruiser
Vessel Name: Alma's Only
Photos: Alma's Only
PostPosted: Sun Mar 27, 2022 10:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

When's the last time the motor's swivel case was lubricated?
_________________
2003 CD22 Cruiser with Honda 90
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
JamesTXSD



Joined: 01 Mar 2005
Posts: 7444
City/Region: from island boy to desert dweller
State or Province: AZ
C-Dory Year: 2007
C-Dory Model: 25 Cruiser
Vessel Name: "Wild Blue" (sold 9/14)
Photos: Wild Blue
PostPosted: Mon Mar 28, 2022 12:09 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

On most of the boats I've owned, the steering got stiffer with speed. Try trimming the motor up (or down) to find the most efficient fuel burn, and that seemed to give me the most comfortable steering, as well.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
srbaum



Joined: 30 Aug 2010
Posts: 875
City/Region: Portsmouth
State or Province: VA
C-Dory Year: 2007
C-Dory Model: 26 Venture
Vessel Name: Osprey
Photos: Osprey
PostPosted: Mon Mar 28, 2022 10:27 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Roamad,
Do check the tips already suggested.
In my past experience, with older, well used mechanical steering systems, when the cable was worn out, the helm steering mechanism was also usually worn, so that a new cable did not improve the slop / and pressure in the system.
Also, most newer mechanical systems provide no-feedback alternatives
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
ssobol



Joined: 27 Oct 2012
Posts: 3361
City/Region: SW Michigan
State or Province: MI
C-Dory Year: 2008
C-Dory Model: 22 Cruiser
Vessel Name: SoBELLE
Photos: SoBelle
PostPosted: Mon Mar 28, 2022 12:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Is it harder to steer in one direction or the other? Maybe the trim tab needs adjustment.

Most systems get harder to steer with increasing speed due to the higher loads on the engine.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Roamad



Joined: 20 Jul 2021
Posts: 70
City/Region: Isleton
State or Province: CA
C-Dory Year: 1988
C-Dory Model: 16 Angler
Photos: Roamad
PostPosted: Mon Mar 28, 2022 12:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks for all the helpful replies. I sort of assumed the mechanic who installed the engine also lubricated all the steering swivel points on the motor and transom mount. He *was* very thorough, but I didn’t ask. So I guess I’ll start with that. I do know there are zerk fittings in a few places for that.

Motor trim doesn’t seem to affect the problem at all.

Also there are no obvious problems with the steering cable — no kinks or sharp bends or anything like that.

It’s just a bit puzzling that the problem remained after the engine swap, which suggests a problem with the steering mechanism and not the motor & transom mount. But if that is the case, why would it only occur at speed?
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
Barry Rietz



Joined: 21 Jun 2006
Posts: 409
City/Region: Sierra Vista
State or Province: AZ
PostPosted: Mon Mar 28, 2022 2:49 pm    Post subject: Hard to steer at speed Reply with quote

Since the original motor was removed and replaced with the 2007 model, the steering cable would have had to be disconnected. And since there is extreme force being applied to the motor pivot point when on plane, I would check to see if the steering cable may not have been tightened sufficiently. At least start your diagnosis at this point first and work forward. Please reply back with your findings.
_________________
Barry Rietz
N9DXC
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
journey on



Joined: 03 Mar 2005
Posts: 3593
City/Region: Valley Centre
State or Province: CA
C-Dory Year: 2005
C-Dory Model: 25 Cruiser
Vessel Name: journey on
Photos: Journey On
PostPosted: Mon Mar 28, 2022 2:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

As the speed increases, the dynamic pressure of the water increases as the square of the speed. This should make the steering stiffer, since it makes the motor/rudder harder to turn. One can overcome this with a balanced rudder, where the axis of rotation (steering axis) is divided, fore and aft. Outboard motors don't have this feature, so I would expect the motor is harder to turn at higher speeds.

Boris
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
tsturm



Joined: 01 Nov 2003
Posts: 1134
City/Region: Soldotna
State or Province: AK
C-Dory Year: 2003
C-Dory Model: 25 Cruiser
Vessel Name: JMR TOO
Photos: JMR-TOO
PostPosted: Mon Mar 28, 2022 2:56 pm    Post subject: Re: Why does my steering stiffen up at speed? Reply with quote

Roamad wrote:
My steering spins just fine at the dock and at low speeds. But once I open up the throttle, the wheel gets very hard to turn — two hands required! What’s going on and how do I fix this?


Trim the motor up.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
ssobol



Joined: 27 Oct 2012
Posts: 3361
City/Region: SW Michigan
State or Province: MI
C-Dory Year: 2008
C-Dory Model: 22 Cruiser
Vessel Name: SoBELLE
Photos: SoBelle
PostPosted: Mon Mar 28, 2022 3:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

There is something to be said for steering to stiffen as speed increases. This helps limit sudden large steering inputs that could have negative effects if done at speed. However, the stiffening should not result in the inability to actually steer the boat.

My boat has hydraulic steering and there is a definite increase in the helm wheel force as the speed increases. I expect this to happen and it helps keep the boat on course at higher speeds.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
T.R. Bauer



Joined: 17 Nov 2007
Posts: 1726
City/Region: Wasilla
State or Province: AK
C-Dory Year: 1993
C-Dory Model: 22 Cruiser
Vessel Name: C-Whisperer
PostPosted: Tue Mar 29, 2022 9:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Trimming the motor up sure does help as others noted. But something isn't right. What? Beats me...But if it did with 2 different motors, I'd be looking at the steering cable and it's casing very carefully.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
thataway



Joined: 02 Nov 2003
Posts: 20778
City/Region: Pensacola
State or Province: FL
C-Dory Year: 2007
C-Dory Model: 25 Cruiser
Vessel Name: thataway
Photos: Thataway
PostPosted: Tue Mar 29, 2022 5:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Check to be sure the new cable push pull steering is a "non feed back system". What this means is that the pressure on the cable is not pushed back on the helm. If you have a NF system, it will be much easier to steer. A motor that small should don't be an issue. The NF systems are a few dollars more expensive, but well worth it. The helm itself is less than $150.

There may be something binding when the boat comes up to speed, and pressure is on the steering tube. Even if greased--it may pay to put further grease, until if is oozing out of the end of the tube. Then with steering disconnected, try turning back and forth--see if any place is binding.

_________________
Bob Austin
Thataway
Thataway (Ex Seaweed) 2007 25 C Dory May 2018 to Oct. 2021
Thisaway 2006 22' CDory November 2011 to May 2018
Caracal 18 140 Suzuki 2007 to present
Thataway TomCat 255 150 Suzukis June 2006 thru August 2011
C Pelican; 1992, 22 Cruiser, 2002 thru 2006
Frequent Sea; 2003 C D 25, 2007 thru 2009
KA6PKB
Home port: Pensacola FL
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic   Reply to topic    The C-Brats Forum Index -> Outboards and Systems All times are GMT - 5 Hours
Goto page 1, 2  Next
Page 1 of 2

 
     Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
You cannot attach files in this forum
You cannot download files in this forum



Page generation time: 0.1319s (PHP: 88% - SQL: 12%) - SQL queries: 33 - GZIP disabled - Debug on