The C-Brats Forum Index
HomeForumsMy TopicsCalendarEvent SignupsMemberlistOur C-DorysThe Brat MapPhotos

Wallas stove fuel
Goto page 1, 2  Next
 
Post new topic   Reply to topic    The C-Brats Forum Index -> General Chat
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
Pelican



Joined: 13 Aug 2021
Posts: 11
City/Region: Port Townsend
State or Province: WA
PostPosted: Sat Jan 22, 2022 8:54 pm    Post subject: Wallas stove fuel Reply with quote

I bet this has been discussed before but either I didnít see it or donít remember seeing it. So here it is: my new to me C-Dory came with about a gallon reservoir under tje sink. I think itís kerosene because of its color and smell. Itís now less than half-full and Iím wondering what fuel I should refill with - diesel or kero. Any thoughts? Iíd empty out whatís there and start new with any new fuel.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
Salmon Fisher



Joined: 07 Aug 2009
Posts: 713
City/Region: Arlington
State or Province: WA
C-Dory Year: 2015
C-Dory Model: R-27 Tug
Vessel Name: Kim Christine
Photos: Kim Christine
PostPosted: Sat Jan 22, 2022 9:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Your best bet is to call Scan Marine in Seattle and ask.
Give them the model number of your Wallas and they will happily tell you.
You're correct to safely dispose of the remaining fuel in the jug and put in fresh.
Your Wallas will thank you Smile

_________________
Patrick and Kim Walker
2000 22 Cruiser 2009-2014 (Sold)
2006 25 Cruiser 2014-2019 (Sold)
1985 22 Classic -2019 (Sold)
1991 19 Arima Sea Ranger-2019-2021 (Sold)

1987 22 Cruiser -Present
2015 27 Ranger Tug-Present

Honey, this REALLY will be my last boat, honest!
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
C-Wolfe



Joined: 16 Sep 2020
Posts: 124
City/Region: Anchorage
State or Province: AK
C-Dory Year: 2006
C-Dory Model: 22 Cruiser
Vessel Name: C-Wolfe
Photos: C-Wolfe
PostPosted: Sat Jan 22, 2022 9:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I second the previous post in calling scan marine. They have the best customer service and last I talk to them they explain that different model year where designed to use different fuel for peak performance.
_________________
C-Wolfe 22 C-Dory cruiser 2020- present
No Name; Bayliner explorer 26 2012-2015
sparkle; Ericson 25 CB 2008-2012
Sculpin; Drascombe Drifter 2005-2008
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
kennharriet



Joined: 22 Jan 2009
Posts: 480
City/Region: Grangeville
State or Province: ID
C-Dory Year: 1999
C-Dory Model: 22 Cruiser
Vessel Name: Lochsa
Photos: Lochsa
PostPosted: Sat Jan 22, 2022 10:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I installed the Wallas 1300 last year. I have been using Jet A fuel after talking with Scan Marine. I get it at the pump at the local airport and it is half the cost of kerosine.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
NORO LIM



Joined: 24 Apr 2008
Posts: 834
City/Region: Olympia
State or Province: WA
C-Dory Year: 2006
C-Dory Model: 23 Venture
Vessel Name: NORO LIM (sold 12/12/14)
Photos: NORO LIM
PostPosted: Sat Jan 22, 2022 10:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

You have to know what model you have before you can know what fuel to use. Call Scan Marine.
_________________
Bill, Formerly on NORO LIM
2001 CD 16, 2001-2006
2006 CC 23, 2006-2014
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Pelican



Joined: 13 Aug 2021
Posts: 11
City/Region: Port Townsend
State or Province: WA
PostPosted: Sat Jan 22, 2022 11:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks, everyone. Iíll call Scan Marine with the model #. Itís working like a charm now, but the starboard engine has to running for it to start up. Iím guessing the alternator gives the electrical system an extra boost to get it started. Iíve heard thereís a real problem if I let the reservoir run dry.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
Salmon Fisher



Joined: 07 Aug 2009
Posts: 713
City/Region: Arlington
State or Province: WA
C-Dory Year: 2015
C-Dory Model: R-27 Tug
Vessel Name: Kim Christine
Photos: Kim Christine
PostPosted: Sun Jan 23, 2022 8:42 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yes, it is very important that the Wallas get enough electricity to fire up like it should.

You may want to look at your electrical system to make sure that either engine is wired so that your stove gets adequate juice to start. Do you have an (ACR) Automatic Charging Relay? This is very helpful if you have a Start battery.
What is your battery configuration? Do you have one Start battery and one House? Or do you have two deep cycle batteries? This what I run on my current 22 and it is fine. As an example, on our 2000 22 Cruiser with twin 40s, each had its own single pole Blue Seas On/Off switch wired to its own Group 24 battery. I modifed it to a Blue Seas Battery 1/2/1+2/Off so that both motors were charging one battery. I would start the trip on Battery 1. When I shut down motors at dock or mid trip, I would switch over to Battery 2 so it would get a charge. If I had installed an ACR, maybe I wouldn't have had to go through that sequence.
As discussed on this forum, you never want to select "1+2" because your outboard(s) do not have the capacity to charge both batteries.

Sounds like you're on the way to having a dependable Wallas.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
ssobol



Joined: 27 Oct 2012
Posts: 2861
City/Region: SW Michigan
State or Province: MI
C-Dory Year: 2008
C-Dory Model: 22 Cruiser
Vessel Name: SoBELLE
Photos: SoBelle
PostPosted: Sun Jan 23, 2022 10:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Salmon Fisher wrote:
... As discussed on this forum, you never want to select "1+2" because your outboard(s) do not have the capacity to charge both batteries. ...


I suppose it depends on the engine(s), but I charge both my batteries (switch on Both) regularly with my single BF90D.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
kaelc



Joined: 19 Jul 2017
Posts: 372
City/Region: Saanich
State or Province: BC
C-Dory Year: 2007
C-Dory Model: 25 Cruiser
Vessel Name: Island Magic
Photos: Stil-Afloat
PostPosted: Sun Jan 23, 2022 10:55 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Start it with the lid up as well, the extra juice for the fan makes it hard to start on the older ones.

https://www.scanmarineusa.com/wp-content/uploads/Fuel-comments-December-20121.pdf
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
robhwa



Joined: 04 Dec 2013
Posts: 242
City/Region: Anderson Island
State or Province: WA
C-Dory Year: 2003
C-Dory Model: 22 Cruiser
Vessel Name: Marcia C
Photos: Problemadela
PostPosted: Sun Jan 23, 2022 11:13 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

ssobol wrote:
Salmon Fisher wrote:
... As discussed on this forum, you never want to select "1+2" because your outboard(s) do not have the capacity to charge both batteries. ...


I suppose it depends on the engine(s), but I charge both my batteries (switch on Both) regularly with my single BF90D.


Mostly it depends on the batteries. If you are running your engine so the alternator is charging, it is usually fine to have both batteries connected together (A + B), as long as you are generating more amps than you are using. This can be a problem with the older Honda BF90s, which only put out about 17 amps. When one becomes fully charged, charging will shift to the other. With both fully charged, no amps will flow. The problem comes with connecting mis-matched batteries where there is no net charging. Directly connected (i.e. A+B switch only) batteries will try and equalize charges, always with a heat loss (laws of thermodynamics). Ultimately, those heat losses can drain your system. As mentioned above, there are various automatic methods for accomplishing the disconnect, an ACR, or better yet, a DC-DC system. These take the requirement of the operator moving the switch away. The DC-DC system will prioritize charging the starting battery, and then the house. When the engine is not running, the systems are isolated. There are some hybrid systems, like the Renogy DC-DC+MPPT, that have a computer that analyzes voltages and battery types, and can also charge the starting battery with solar panels. I completely agree about the need for adequate voltage for the Wallas. I have had this problem with the Wallas stoves in my C-Dory, camper, and yurt. So far, running the Wallas with LiFePO4 batteries hasn't yielded a problem as they keep voltage higher longer in the duty cycle.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
hardee



Joined: 30 Oct 2006
Posts: 12498
City/Region: Sequim
State or Province: WA
C-Dory Year: 2005
C-Dory Model: 22 Cruiser
Vessel Name: Sleepy-C
Photos: SleepyC
PostPosted: Sun Jan 23, 2022 11:41 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Pelican,

Scan Marine is very helpful and they have a good website.
https://scanmarineusa.com

This is a post they have on fuels.
https://scanmarineusa.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/05/Fuel-comments-May-2020.pdf

I have been using Kleen Heat* for my Wallas. That and a specific protocol for starting and stopping has kept mine working every time I want it. So . . .
1. Burn Kleen Heet always, and never let the tank run below 1/4 full.
2. Always start it with the OB's running, and start it on HIGH and leave it there 15 minutes, at least.
3. Always run it on HIGH for the last 15 minutes before pushing the OFF button.

*Kleen Heet (Not sure of that spelling) may not be recommended by Scan on their website. I would ask them specifically about it for your specific stove. (I did).

If you don't know how old that fuel is, I would dump if an refill with fresh. (Henry's is a good source for the Kleen Heet.

See you on the water,

Harvey
SleepyC Moon


_________________
Though in our sleep we are not conscious of our activity or surroundings, we should not, in our wakefulness, be unconscious of our sleep.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
thataway



Joined: 02 Nov 2003
Posts: 19750
City/Region: Pensacola
State or Province: FL
C-Dory Year: 2007
C-Dory Model: 25 Cruiser
Vessel Name: thataway
Photos: Thataway
PostPosted: Sun Jan 23, 2022 11:54 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
As mentioned above, there are various automatic methods for accomplishing the disconnect, an ACR, or better yet, a DC-DC system.


Granted a DC -DC system is a necessity with LiFePO4 batteries (which has a resting voltage at 13.5 volts rather than 12.7 Volts of a FLA battery). An ACR will serve most C Dorys as well as a DC - DC system. If using Flooded Lead Acid (FLA) or AGM batteries, there is no reason for a DC to DC charger. All of the batteries. will have a similar charging profile. It is best to have all FLA batteries of Same type, same size, and same age. The Li battery has a different charging profile, which necessitates a DC to DC charger.

IF a LiFePO4 battery is at 12.8 volts it is 80% discharged.

Maybe we are just lucky, but with over 16 years and 4 different boats where we had the Wallas stove, we never had to run the outboard to start the Wallas. The stove should be connected directly to the battery, and adequate size wire should be used,

I am going to disagree with this statement also:

Quote:
When one becomes fully charged, charging will shift to the other


When you have two batteries connected in parallel, and one has the charging leads directly to it, both batteries will be charging. Even with an ACR, the engine start battery will not be fully charged when the second battery begins to charge. The ACR will combine the batteries at about 13.6 volts. Most outboards charge in the 14 plus volts.

_________________
Bob Austin
Thataway
Thataway (Ex Seaweed) 2007 25 C Dory May 2018 to Oct. 2021
Thisaway 2006 22' CDory November 2011 to May 2018
Caracal 18 140 Suzuki 2007 to present
Thataway TomCat 255 150 Suzukis June 2006 thru August 2011
C Pelican; 1992, 22 Cruiser, 2002 thru 2006
Frequent Sea; 2003 C D 25, 2007 thru 2009
KA6PKB
Home port: Pensacola FL
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
hardee



Joined: 30 Oct 2006
Posts: 12498
City/Region: Sequim
State or Province: WA
C-Dory Year: 2005
C-Dory Model: 22 Cruiser
Vessel Name: Sleepy-C
Photos: SleepyC
PostPosted: Sun Jan 23, 2022 12:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
"Maybe we are just lucky, but with over 16 years and 4 different boats where we had the Wallas stove, we never had to run the outboard to start the Wallas. The stove should be connected directly to the battery, and adequate size wire should be used,"


I don't know that it has to be running, I do that as a precaution to save the battery, since I only have a DC volt level from my batteries, and it was suggested by one of the folks a Scan when I talked to them way back when I first started with the boat.

My Wallas is connected directly to the battery, and fused.

Harvey
SleepyC Moon

Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
C-Wolfe



Joined: 16 Sep 2020
Posts: 124
City/Region: Anchorage
State or Province: AK
C-Dory Year: 2006
C-Dory Model: 22 Cruiser
Vessel Name: C-Wolfe
Photos: C-Wolfe
PostPosted: Sun Jan 23, 2022 1:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Make sure to confirm you do not have any corrosion in your wiring to the Wallas, they seem to be very sensitive to this. On the plus side, they have simple wiring and are easy to replace.

Quote:
Salmon Fisher wrote:
... As discussed on this forum, you never want to select "1+2" because your outboard(s) do not have the capacity to charge both batteries. ...


I suppose it depends on the engine(s), but I charge both my batteries (switch on Both) regularly with my single BF90D.


That is more of an issue for twin engines when both are charging the same battery (or a battery bank in parallel is the same). The charger regulator will mess with each other and they will cycle at a fast pace and shorten their lifespan.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
TyBoo



Joined: 23 Oct 2003
Posts: 5248
City/Region: Warrenton
State or Province: OR
C-Dory Year: 1996
C-Dory Model: 25 Cruise Ship
Vessel Name: TyBoo
Photos: TyBoo
PostPosted: Sun Jan 23, 2022 6:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

When I had my Wallas 95D I asked Scan Marine about which fuel to use since at the time there were a lot of folks on here touting the Klean Heat stuff. The guy simply said that the D stood for diesel and that what it should be burning. I used diesel exclusively after that and it ran fine until the circuit board fried and the stove was replaced with an Espar.

The Klean Heat works well for people who use it and I am not saying there is anything wrong with using it. But I seem to recall it cost a whole lot more than the diesel and I would go broke keeping Lois warm for crabbing.

_________________
TyBoo Mike
1996 25' Cruise Ship
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic   Reply to topic    The C-Brats Forum Index -> General Chat All times are GMT - 6 Hours
Goto page 1, 2  Next
Page 1 of 2

 
     Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
You cannot attach files in this forum
You cannot download files in this forum



Page generation time: 0.0857s (PHP: 75% - SQL: 25%) - SQL queries: 32 - GZIP disabled - Debug on