Handheld VHFs with GPS/DSC

letitride · Posted: Sun Jan 02, 2022 1:58 am Post subject:

I have been waiting for many years for a handheld VHF radio to get the added AIS feature.

I will be purchasing the new DSC+GPS+AIS ICOM M94D VHF Marine Radio, I think this is a real game changer for added safety. Its not perfect but you would be much happier in the water floating with a VHF radio that had (DSC+GPS+AIS).

There are too many pros to list having the AIS receiver and only 2 Cons that I have, $299 and need to learn how to use the AIS feature.

Having had my fixed AIS receiver VHF radio for many years linked thru NEMA to my Raymarine chart plotter I can clearly see the benefits of having an AIS receiver especially in a emergency situation the ability to know that an AIS ship is close to your position and you can call them directly for assistance would be priceless.....during an emergency.

I'm just so excited been waiting a long time for this added feature and hope it will save many lives.

hardee · Posted: Sun Jan 02, 2022 11:49 am Post subject:

letitride,

I agree with you. I have had AIS on my boat since it was first available (almost) and use it there constantly. I can see the nicety of having that AIS info available, however, I have had very poor results with making DSC calls from my boat radio most of the time. On some, when I tried that first, and then a bit later did a ch 16 call to the boat by name, I learned that yes, their radio sounded some kind of an alarm, but they didn't know what it was or how to respond. It is a sad scenario that we have such good capability but are not savvy enough to understand or use it. The knowledge you would get from the AIS (proximity) would be very useful, then call by name.

Just wondering about the situation. If you are in the water, I would think a general Mayday call would be more effective than trying to call a boat by name or DSC.

Harvey
SleepyC Moon

colbysmith · Posted: Sun Jan 02, 2022 1:15 pm Post subject:

I just looked at the information on this handheld, as it sort of caught my interest after letitride's comments. However, unless I read the specs wrong, I don't believe this handheld can transmit AIS, but only receive. While I would like the idea of the AIS sending out my position, in retrospect that's what the DSC Emergency button will do. And quite frankly, I'm not sure how other boats with DSC will be notified. As Harvey stated, most folks know their radio is making a weird sound, but don't know why or how to communicate with the boat sending them the call. While having an AIS receiver available while floating in the water without a functioning boat may make you feel good seeing another vessel that transmits AIS near you, I'm not sure paying extra for AIS on a handheld is worth it. Having the DSC and it's emergency transmissions is definitely worthwhile. Colby

ssobol · Posted: Sun Jan 02, 2022 6:12 pm Post subject:

Marco Flamingo · Posted: Sun Jan 02, 2022 8:03 pm Post subject:

Transmitting AIS from a handheld VHF would be difficult. For the main boat, an antenna splitter or, better yet, differently tuned antennas are needed. Because of the different frequencies, the little rubber antenna on a handheld probably could not transmit both VHF and AIS effectively. Which would you want to have priority? VHF for me.

I've often wondered how effective just a regular handheld VHF is for a MOB in 5 foot seas.

letitride · Posted: Sun Jan 02, 2022 9:00 pm Post subject:

Harvey,

I agree with all your comments.

I would assume that if you tried calling a very large vessel (Cargo ship ect) they should be capable and able to respond...but who knows if anyone is on watch at the time your trying to call.

I'll share a story & try & make it short & to the point, pls bare with me:

I had to rescue one of my buddy's in the water at night once 18 miles off shore crossing from Santa Cruz Island to Oxnard.

Luckily (we were crossing together, 2 boats) I saw him fly off the 2nd boat on a full moon night when there boat (very large RIB) hit a very steep large swell, he didn't have any lights, but had his wet suit still on from night diving. (He got lucky)

I was also very lucky stopped the boat quickly & turned around & found him only because he was yelling at me, honestly it was SCARY it took what felt like forever to find him in the water at night, it was probably around 5-10mins.....

The boat he fell out of turned around but was so far away they where basically useless at that point and they searched in a different area.

Next dive trip he had so many lights on him at night he looked like a Christmas tree he was better prepared, live an learn....

All of us can be better prepared.

Just image its at night, I would happily try calling every boat close to me all night long, but you have to know there is a boat around your position to call else your wasting your time and battery power on nothing...

hardee · Posted: Mon Jan 03, 2022 11:03 pm Post subject:

First off: The Handheld VHF's DO NOT transmit an AIS signal. (*)
They are AIS receive only. So you can look at the screen and see where the closest AIS transmission is coming from so you can determine the distance, but there is no guarantee with that, whether they will answer, or respond. AS there is no guarantee with the DSC transmission, except with that -- given you have an MMSI installed -- the USCG will recognize your call, determine you location and respond to that location. (That may take some time, in my location a response to a call from the mid Juan de Fuca would be a minimum of 30-45 minutes.

(*) There are a few AIS transmitting MOB devices available. That discussion is beyo0nd the scope of this thread.

letitride Good story. Thanks. I was involved in a search for a capsized kayaker one time. He was using a handheld VHF. It was late morning, very heavy dense fog with viz about 50 - 100 feet. I had just turned south where Johnston Strait ends at Chatham Point and turns into Discovery Passage, North of Campbell River about 27 miles. I had been watching on AIS, a northbound tug (no tow) headed north. (Nice thing about AIS, it can see around corners and over land masses.) I came to the point, and corner about 5 minutes ahead of the tug so took my Starboard turn, on the inside, leaving him plenty of room, I was staying close to the Vancouver Island shore side. I had talked to the tug, and watched him pass my beam on the radar, but never actually saw him. ( I was doing about 3.5 knots water speed but about 6k over the ground.) He was doing about 10K going upstream and I saw his radar spot disappear behind the point. Within seconds of that I heard a MAYDAY call. Clear, succinct and desperate. "Capsized my kayak, unable to reboard, disoriented as to direction but just south of Chatham Point." And " . . . I heard a ship go by just now." There was no CG response immediately. The tug called that he was in the area and would respond. I relayed the call to the CCG, and that I was responding, about 6-8 min away.

The kayaker could hear the tug, and was trying to tell the tug which direction he was from him but he didn't really know which way was shore. I asked the kayaker if he could hear my fog horn, and by then he could. I told him I was down stream and south of him. ( I thought I could see him on the radar by then, and could see the tug.) He used me as south, and was able to direct the tug to essentially drift down on him. As I arrived he was getting pulled up onto the tug deck, and they took his kayak aboard too.

Obviously if that kayaker had not had a VHF he may not have survived but, having one, he was able to talk to the tug which he knew was close. IF he had AIS receive on his handheld he would have been able to vector that tug to him without the added help from my horn to provide a direction.

Often wondered if the tug wake was what put him in the water? The timing sure would fit.

Harvey
SleepyC Moon

hardee · Posted: Tue Jan 04, 2022 3:38 pm Post subject:

ssobol · Posted: Tue Jan 04, 2022 4:17 pm Post subject:

thataway · Posted: Tue Jan 04, 2022 7:30 pm Post subject:

That's OK Harvey, I have one very large Pensacola Bay Pelican being sent to you Fed Ex overnight. They go down best with the hottest of "Crystal" hot sauce. Be sure and drink a liter of beer (best at a Sequim Micro brewery) with each bite of the pelican. Be sure and thaw the bird before eating. Very Happy

Best regards--I figured some day you would find out... There has been a constant struggle on The Hull Truth to get folks to put in the MMSI number. The CG information officer has been a great addition to the forum in his official capacity. He also posts under his recreational boater moniker also.

I also read an aviation Blog--there was a recent crash of a French recreational plane in the Austrian Alps (Hit a power line which was at 9700 feet elevation). The pilot owed his life to: a good helmet (Think life jacket) and he was wearing a survival vest. In the vest he had a personal locator beacon which he activated as soon as he got clear of the wreckage--an Austrian chopper was on scene in about 15 minutes!. He also had a hand held air band (121.5 MHz) radio and could communicate with the chopper to co-ordinate a L Z and asses both he and his passengers back injuries. (He also had a second cell phone in the vest, so he was able to communicate with his family that he was alive. I consider this analogous to having a hand held water proof, DSC enabled with MMSI radio (should also have the Personal Locator beacon!) attached to one's life jacket or in a fanny pack etc.

I know Harvey to be an advocate of putting the MMSI number into the radio!!!

colbysmith · Posted: Tue Jan 04, 2022 8:14 pm Post subject:

I think I've worked with Juan once a while back as well with some stuff on my radio when it was new. Nice to see the guy is still there, and still responding. That to me is good customer service! Colby

hardee · Posted: Tue Jan 04, 2022 8:44 pm Post subject:

Yes Bob.

jkidd · Posted: Tue Jan 04, 2022 10:14 pm Post subject:

I learned the other day that you really want separate mmsi numbers in each radio. When you register one of the questions is it a boat or a person for the hand held you want to pick person. So the CG will know their looking for a person and not trying to find a boat. You also get the feature of being able to practice the dsc calling function so you know how to use it. Of course that won’t mean others will know to use it.

thataway · Posted: Tue Jan 04, 2022 11:42 pm Post subject:

hardee · Posted: Wed Jan 05, 2022 1:02 am Post subject:

I just started a thread regarding Emergency DSC MMSI use. It is here:

http://www.c-brats.com/viewtopic.php?t=30426&highlight=

I do have one station VHF without an MMSI assigned, It was the weakest of the 3, and I wanted one that would not be locked up with DSC activity which could take more than one minute, possibly 2, before I could get my radio "back". (That radio has a note on the red door advising "DO NOT USE in an EMERGENCY". The boat radios are on the same MMSI. And now the handhelds will be also, but my PLB (ACR ResQLink+) is registered via NOAA and it is registered to my person, not my boat. It had the option for "Notes" where I put in my Boat WA registration number, trailer Lic number, a brief description and then also of the motorcycle, it's Plate number and helmet and jacket info. The PLB goes where I go. It is 6 years old and I just replaced the battery.

Jody, I think the DSC testing function is available on the newer HH VHFs, but not on all. The PLB's do have some testing capability. Check before you do that, though.

Harvey
SleepyC Moon