The C-Brats Forum Index
HomeForumsMy TopicsCalendarEvent SignupsMemberlistOur C-DorysThe Brat MapPhotos

Dreaded Click
Goto page 1, 2  Next
 
Post new topic   Reply to topic    The C-Brats Forum Index -> General Chat
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
ssobol



Joined: 27 Oct 2012
Posts: 2418
City/Region: Leesburg
State or Province: VA
C-Dory Year: 2008
C-Dory Model: 22 Cruiser
Vessel Name: SoBELLE
Photos: SoBelle
PostPosted: Mon Apr 05, 2021 6:08 pm    Post subject: Dreaded Click Reply with quote

I was getting my boat ready after winter storage today. I put the muffs on and tried to start the engine. All I got was a click. Following the service manual I've been led to believe that the starter motor is failed. The relay clicks, there's plenty of voltage, but no turning of the starter (engine not seized). All the other checks are OK (neutral switch, continuity, etc.).

Before I try to get another starter, is there anything else I should check? I haven't tried hooking the starter motor straight up to 12VDC yet.

It's a Honda BF90D.

Thanks.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
DayBreak



Joined: 16 Jul 2017
Posts: 433
City/Region: Monmouth, Or.
State or Province: OR
C-Dory Year: 2018
C-Dory Model: 23 Venture
Vessel Name: DayBreak
Photos: DayBreak
PostPosted: Mon Apr 05, 2021 6:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Even thought the starter battery may be OK, you may want to take off the cables, clean them up really good to bare metal, attach them really tight and try again. This has happened to me in various 12 volt battery start/electrical power issues in the non-boating world and it has worked many times for me.
_________________
Gary F
DayBreak, 23 Venture, 2018 - present
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
pcg



Joined: 31 Aug 2018
Posts: 199
City/Region: Sherwood
State or Province: OR
C-Dory Year: 1999
C-Dory Model: 22 Cruiser
Photos: pcg
PostPosted: Mon Apr 05, 2021 7:05 pm    Post subject: Re: Dreaded Click Reply with quote

What Gary said ^

Also,
ssobol wrote:
The relay clicks, there's plenty of voltage, but
... is there enough energy being delivered to the starter?

In other words, you may see 12V at the battery with no load, and the battery may be able to deliver enough energy to activate the relay, but it may be failing when called to deliver more energy than that. I would check the voltage at the battery with the starter switch on.

It seems unlikely that a starter motor would fail during storage. It seems more likely that a battery would fail during storage or, as Gary suggested, a connection has been compromised.

_________________
Paul
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
starcrafttom



Joined: 07 Nov 2003
Posts: 7551
City/Region: marysville
State or Province: WA
C-Dory Year: 1984
C-Dory Model: 27 Cruiser
Vessel Name: to be decided later
Photos: Susan E
PostPosted: Mon Apr 05, 2021 7:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Agree with both above commits but this is why I bought a load tester. Check water levels place of charger overnight and then load test. if thats bad then its time for a new battery. You can have 12 volts and a bad cell. It will drop to half under load. load tester
_________________
Thomas J Elliott
http://tomsfishinggear.blogspot.com/
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
gulfcoast john



Joined: 14 Dec 2012
Posts: 716
City/Region: PENSACOLA
State or Province: FL
C-Dory Year: 2010
C-Dory Model: 255 Tomcat
Vessel Name: Cat O' Mine
Photos: CAT O' MINE
PostPosted: Mon Apr 05, 2021 8:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

This exact same symptom that brought our Gulf Coast Florida Adventure to an early end turned out to be a failing engine Start relay ($150) on a Yamaha F150.

We also needed the rigging tubes replaced due to cracks.

It was in the shop from Aug 21 until late Nov 2020 due to supply chain delays, including getting the relay shipped from Japan for this simple repair.

Best of luck!

John

_________________
John and Eileen Highsmith
2010 Tom Cat 255, Cat O' Mine
Yamaha F150, LXF150
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
ssobol



Joined: 27 Oct 2012
Posts: 2418
City/Region: Leesburg
State or Province: VA
C-Dory Year: 2008
C-Dory Model: 22 Cruiser
Vessel Name: SoBELLE
Photos: SoBelle
PostPosted: Mon Apr 05, 2021 9:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

From what I saw, the voltage across the battery was 14+ with the charger on. When the key was set to start (click heard) the voltage dropped to 13.5+ (two batteries in parallel). So I'm guessing that the batteries are good or something has failed that prevents the full battery current from reaching the starter.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
T.R. Bauer



Joined: 17 Nov 2007
Posts: 1325
City/Region: Wasilla
State or Province: AK
C-Dory Year: 1993
C-Dory Model: 22 Cruiser
Vessel Name: C-Whisperer
PostPosted: Mon Apr 05, 2021 10:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

It's usually the connection at the battery. They're funny sometimes - they can look like crap and still work. Other times....they can look great and not do a dang thing. I like to start with free - meaning clean everything up and hope for the best. If you tap on your starter with a small hammer and suddenly it works, then it's time to buy a starter.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
starcrafttom



Joined: 07 Nov 2003
Posts: 7551
City/Region: marysville
State or Province: WA
C-Dory Year: 1984
C-Dory Model: 27 Cruiser
Vessel Name: to be decided later
Photos: Susan E
PostPosted: Tue Apr 06, 2021 12:16 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

On my 225 honda it was the main cable to the motor. Wear had cut into the main cable at some point and then corrosions ate threw. I ended up pulling extra cable thru and cutting off the bad section. I had about 4 ft extra which saved me about $900 dollars. I have pictures some place I will post later. I jumped cables from the battery to the starter and ground directly to test if it was the battery or the cable before looking at the solenoid. This problem arose after sitting for the winter.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
ssobol



Joined: 27 Oct 2012
Posts: 2418
City/Region: Leesburg
State or Province: VA
C-Dory Year: 2008
C-Dory Model: 22 Cruiser
Vessel Name: SoBELLE
Photos: SoBelle
PostPosted: Tue Apr 06, 2021 9:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Removed the starter motor. Connected it to a separate battery and activated the relay. Starter gear pops out of the housing, but the motor does not turn.

Ordered a replacement from Honda (~$700).
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
tsturm



Joined: 01 Nov 2003
Posts: 1042
City/Region: Soldotna
State or Province: AK
C-Dory Year: 2003
C-Dory Model: 25 Cruiser
Vessel Name: JMR TOO
Photos: JMR-TOO
PostPosted: Tue Apr 06, 2021 10:35 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

ssobol wrote:
Removed the starter motor. Connected it to a separate battery and activated the relay. Starter gear pops out of the housing, but the motor does not turn.

Ordered a replacement from Honda (~$700).


Take your old one to a automotive starter/alternator rebuilder? Thumbs Up
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
thataway



Joined: 02 Nov 2003
Posts: 18908
City/Region: Pensacola
State or Province: FL
C-Dory Year: 2007
C-Dory Model: 25 Cruiser
Vessel Name: thataway
Photos: Thataway
PostPosted: Tue Apr 06, 2021 11:11 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

One of our local businesses ARCO makes the starter motors and assembly as good or maybe better than EOM. A friend of mine used to own ARCO, but sold it a few years back. The new owners seem to be just as meticulous about making good products.

If there is a starter/alternator shop, most can rebuild any starter motor. But some may be reluctant to work on OB motor units.

_________________
Bob Austin
Thataway
Thataway (Ex Seaweed) 2007 25 C Dory May 2018
Thisaway 2006 22' CDory November 2011 to May 2018
Caracal 18 140 Suzuki 2007 to present
Thataway TomCat 255 150 Suzukis June 2006 thru August 2011
C Pelican; 1992, 22 Cruiser, 2002 thru 2006
Frequent Sea; 2003 C D 25, 2007 thru 2009
KA6PKB
Home port: Pensacola FL
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
bobjarrard



Joined: 02 Oct 2010
Posts: 361
City/Region: Boulder City
State or Province: NV
PostPosted: Tue Apr 06, 2021 11:23 am    Post subject: Just curious? Reply with quote

How can it be that a little starter can cost $700? A starter for my 2006 V8 Tundra is $89. I can have it to my door with free shipping in 24 hours or less. I can drive to the dealer and pick it up in 20 minutes. Something not right and I an economist and understand scaled production and foreign supplier costs but the boating public gets hosed on all this. Good reason to avoid a Volvo engine at all costs and only buy a motor that has parts you can swap off a tractor in Iowa. There is a lot to be said about putting a Kodiak Marine motor (KEM) into your boat for less than 10K for the smaller blocks and you are talking over 200HP. I know that the C-Dory hull is not set up for fixed prop or I/O but there are more than a few Bartenders running inboards that are great boats. I see the posts here on dual 40/50's or a 115 and it takes my breath away when you add in tax, shipping, and rigging. Something to be said for being happy at 5-6 MPH cruise and 8-12 MPH max flat out. Oh well, my only boat motor is a 8hp merc. See ya. Bob Jarrard
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail AIM Address
ssobol



Joined: 27 Oct 2012
Posts: 2418
City/Region: Leesburg
State or Province: VA
C-Dory Year: 2008
C-Dory Model: 22 Cruiser
Vessel Name: SoBELLE
Photos: SoBelle
PostPosted: Tue Apr 06, 2021 12:44 pm    Post subject: Re: Just curious? Reply with quote

bobjarrard wrote:
How can it be that a little starter can cost $700? A starter for my 2006 V8 Tundra is $89. I can have it to my door with free shipping in 24 hours or less. I can drive to the dealer and pick it up in 20 minutes. Something not right and I an economist and understand scaled production and foreign supplier costs but the boating public gets hosed on all this. ....


Could be that the starter motor is not a common replacement item and volume can't make up the difference. Or it could be that you are paying for the quality. The shop that is getting the one for my engine says they sold 3 starters in the last 12 years and said it is unusual for it to fail. They asked if my motor had been underwater.

They also said that Honda does not remanufacture the starters. They said I can just toss it, or bring the bad one to them and they'll toss it.

There are 3rd party starters available online. You can get one from Amazon for ~$120.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
T.R. Bauer



Joined: 17 Nov 2007
Posts: 1325
City/Region: Wasilla
State or Province: AK
C-Dory Year: 1993
C-Dory Model: 22 Cruiser
Vessel Name: C-Whisperer
PostPosted: Tue Apr 06, 2021 7:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I hate to even suggest this, but does this engine turn over by hand? Nevermind....saw the gear motor does not turn.....around $100 bucks on Amazon....
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
localboy



Joined: 30 Sep 2006
Posts: 4482
City/Region: Lake Stevens via Honolulu
State or Province: WA
C-Dory Year: 2007
C-Dory Model: 25 Cruiser
Vessel Name: 'Au Kai (Ocean Traveler)
Photos: 'AU KAI
PostPosted: Wed Apr 07, 2021 2:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I had it happen exactly like that one year. First start up; nothing. Ended up being the starter battery connections needed cleaning and tightening after sitting months due to winter.
_________________
"We can go over there...behind the 'little one'....."
Wife to her husband pointing @ us...from the bow of their 50-footer; Prideaux Haven 2013
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic   Reply to topic    The C-Brats Forum Index -> General Chat All times are GMT - 6 Hours
Goto page 1, 2  Next
Page 1 of 2

 
     Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
You cannot attach files in this forum
You cannot download files in this forum



Page generation time: 0.0675s (PHP: 79% - SQL: 21%) - SQL queries: 32 - GZIP disabled - Debug on