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colbysmith
Joined: 02 Oct 2011 Posts: 4550 City/Region: Madison
State or Province: WI
C-Dory Year: 2009
C-Dory Model: 25 Cruiser
Vessel Name: C-Traveler
Photos: C-Traveler and Midnight-Flyer
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Posted: Fri Aug 28, 2020 12:19 am Post subject: Trouble Shooting |
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Before leaving home my kicker, a Yamaha 9.9hp, was giving me some trouble stalling and only running for a short time. I assumed maybe it was due to low fuel in the tank. When we launched at Lake Powell the main, a Yamaha 150, started up and ran fine as usual. However pulling into the dock at the marina, a very short distance from the launch ramp, it stalled. It started back up after I pumped the fuel hose bulb and seemed to run fine again. I left it running while going to the marina store. By the time we came back it had stalled. I got it running again and we headed across the way from Halls Crossing to Bullfrog Bay. The main Outboard stalled again. Thinking perhaps a main fuel filter issue, I changed that. Started it back up and got on plane but then the engine sputtered a few times. Figured I’d be looking for a mechanic in Bullfrog. But then the motor started running fine again. I did several back and forths in Bullfrog Bay and the motor continued to run fine so we pressed on to Moki Canyon at planning speed. I had tried the kicker again while in Bullfrog Bay and I continued to have problems with it. Since I had filled the fuel tank back in Iowa ($1.75/gal, best gas price on route.) I prayed I didn’t have bad gas. Arriving at a nice beach stop for the evening the main outboard started acting up again as I was idling in gear. Once tied up secure for the evening I started trouble shooting again. I found fuel leaking out of the kicker’s small inline fuel filter when I pumped its fuel hose bulb. In the end I found a small split in the seam that had caused the trouble on both engines. Both run off the same main fuel filter so apparently enough air was being drawn thru the split in the kickers inline filter to also effect the main!
Moral of the story, the tiniest fuel leak in the system can cause havoc with all engines in the system!
Colby |
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alainP
Joined: 07 Oct 2016 Posts: 195 City/Region: TUCSON
State or Province: AZ
C-Dory Year: 2011
C-Dory Model: 25 Cruiser
Vessel Name: deja la
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Posted: Fri Aug 28, 2020 11:48 am Post subject: |
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Glad you figured it out, it could have put a big dent in the enjoyment of the trip.
Another "Moral Of the Story": keep fuel supply separate for kicker and Main
How is it up there? I am thinking of heading up in a couple weeks or so.
Keep track of the good spots and share.
Alain |
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jennykatz
Joined: 15 Dec 2003 Posts: 1678 City/Region: naples
State or Province: FL
C-Dory Year: 2006
C-Dory Model: 23 Venture
Vessel Name: Little Treasurer
Photos: Jennykatz
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Posted: Fri Aug 28, 2020 6:11 pm Post subject: Engine trouble |
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Colby doesn’t your Yamaha have a fuel filter built in that can be changed Also do you have a water / gas separator filter That filter looks like a fuel filter for a car or truck engine Was that the filter for the kicker motor ?
We have had similar problems and replaced our water fuel separates filter and she then ran fine
Glad everything worked out _________________ retired 8/08 from UAL, still working pt tm
Duck c-22 cruiser sold 6/23/08
06 Venture Cruiser with merc115CT
00 cd16 cruiser honda 40 sold 3/12 |
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colbysmith
Joined: 02 Oct 2011 Posts: 4550 City/Region: Madison
State or Province: WI
C-Dory Year: 2009
C-Dory Model: 25 Cruiser
Vessel Name: C-Traveler
Photos: C-Traveler and Midnight-Flyer
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Posted: Fri Aug 28, 2020 10:40 pm Post subject: |
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Quote: | Glad you figured it out, it could have put a big dent in the enjoyment of the trip.
Another "Moral Of the Story": keep fuel supply separate for kicker and Main Wink
How is it up there? I am thinking of heading up in a couple weeks or so.
Keep track of the good spots and share. |
Hi Alain. Actually, I do have a small 3 gal tank hidden away in the bilge to run the kicker on, as I only put non-ethanol gas in that one. However, I still run both systems through the main water separating fuel filter. Regarding Powell, it was too damn hot, so we left there for cooler climates. 105 or so during the day bringing the boat up to 108 or so, and not cooling off less than 85 at night, and the boat not getting there until after midnight. Water temps were 82-84 degrees! However, we did find some good spots at the end of Moki and Forgotten canyons. Used Halls Crossing this time, and the launch worked out much better than what we've experienced at Bullfrog Bay. Came out of Goodyear (Phoenix area), as we visited my folks first. Really wanted to take the Moki Dugway out of Mexican Hat, but probably wisely chose to go around through Bluff. Maybe next time. lol. Colby |
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colbysmith
Joined: 02 Oct 2011 Posts: 4550 City/Region: Madison
State or Province: WI
C-Dory Year: 2009
C-Dory Model: 25 Cruiser
Vessel Name: C-Traveler
Photos: C-Traveler and Midnight-Flyer
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Posted: Fri Aug 28, 2020 10:48 pm Post subject: |
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Quote: | Colby doesn’t your Yamaha have a fuel filter built in that can be changed Also do you have a water / gas separator filter That filter looks like a fuel filter for a car or truck engine Was that the filter for the kicker motor ?
We have had similar problems and replaced our water fuel separates filter and she then ran fine
Glad everything worked out
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Hey Jim,
I'm not positive about my main's inline fuel filter. I thought it was just a cleanable one, but you may be right. I still haven't gotten all the spare parts I want to travel with, or even to do my first routine maintenance on it. Yes, I also have a larger water / gas separator filter. I don't remember the model right off the bat, but it's the one that has both the spin on filter and the plastic bowl. The boat came with a larger unit in the bilge that just had the spin on filter. I wanted the fuel bowl, and easier access, so I changed it out with the one I have now and mounted it in the splash well. The kicker had a small inline filter, and since I haven't found those shopping yet, I used one of the inline filters I kept from the main Merc on Midnight Flyer. Since changing out the split filter, I only had one more time the main stalled. That was after anchoring near Bullfrog to catch up on some internet while I could get some data on my cell phone, and I think the motor just got to hot sitting in the sun under that dark gray cover and may have vapor locked. Pumped the bulb, restarted it, and everything was fine again. Even the engine hated the heat! Think next time I go to Powell, it's going to be late September or October! Colby |
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gulfcoast john
Joined: 14 Dec 2012 Posts: 989 City/Region: PENSACOLA
State or Province: FL
C-Dory Year: 2010
C-Dory Model: 255 Tomcat
Vessel Name: Cat O' Mine
Photos: CAT O' MINE
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Posted: Sat Aug 29, 2020 7:00 pm Post subject: |
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Colby,
So it's not the humidity, it's the heat? You should have trailered to Florida. It's a refreshing 90 degrees and only 92% humidity.
The only thing better than a Yamaha F150 is twin F150's.
You really should DIY hack your engine onto your N2K backbone.
http://www.c-brats.com/viewtopic.php?t=25903
Happy Hacking!
John _________________ John and Eileen Highsmith
2010 Tom Cat 255, Cat O' Mine
Yamaha F150, LXF150 |
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colbysmith
Joined: 02 Oct 2011 Posts: 4550 City/Region: Madison
State or Province: WI
C-Dory Year: 2009
C-Dory Model: 25 Cruiser
Vessel Name: C-Traveler
Photos: C-Traveler and Midnight-Flyer
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Posted: Sat Aug 29, 2020 11:48 pm Post subject: |
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Oh, it's the heat. lol. Sometime I'd like to get the Yami on my network system... Just very briefly looked at the first paragraph in your thread linked above. I do have the command gauges now, as I prefer the main readout that way. But eventually I would like to also have access to the gauges via my combination plotter display. Maybe a way to just tap into the cables already behind my dash. Project for later... Colby |
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Peter & Judy
Joined: 03 Dec 2014 Posts: 550 City/Region: Olds
State or Province: AB
C-Dory Year: 2005
C-Dory Model: 22 Cruiser
Vessel Name: Mistaya
Photos: Mistaya
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Posted: Sun Aug 30, 2020 10:58 am Post subject: |
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Quote: | So it's not the humidity, it's the heat? You should have trailered to Florida. It's a refreshing 90 degrees and only 92% humidity. |
Here in Alberta Canada they put out a heat warning when the temperature is going to be over 28C (82F). We only hit 30C (86F) for two days this summer. I hid in the basement. This is why I only travel to the southern US between October and April. My nordic blood is more suited to snow and cold than it is to heat and humidity. _________________ Peter & Judy Haase
Buffalo Horn Ranch
HMCB Mistaya
"Mistaya" (Grizzly Bear in Cree)
HMCB (Her Majesties Cute Boat) |
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Foggy
Joined: 01 Aug 2013 Posts: 1521 City/Region: Traverse City; Northern Lake Michigan
State or Province: MI
C-Dory Year: 2014
C-Dory Model: 26 Venture
Vessel Name: Boatless in Boating Paradise
Photos: W B Nod
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Posted: Sun Aug 30, 2020 11:08 am Post subject: |
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Could be vapor lock - the bane of some OB engine/fuel problems in summer.
Check out vapor lock.
Aye. _________________ "I don't want any cake" - said no one ever.
If someone tells you they don't eat cake, unfriend them. You don't need that kind of negativity in your life. |
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colbysmith
Joined: 02 Oct 2011 Posts: 4550 City/Region: Madison
State or Province: WI
C-Dory Year: 2009
C-Dory Model: 25 Cruiser
Vessel Name: C-Traveler
Photos: C-Traveler and Midnight-Flyer
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Posted: Mon Aug 31, 2020 6:56 pm Post subject: |
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Foggy, the big issue of both engines having problems was from the split in the kicker's fuel filter. I'm pretty sure after that was fixed, the very brief issue I had was due vapor lock. All is running well now, including here at Yellowstone Lake (national park). Wow, the altitude really sucks the power though. Even more so than the heat! Webasto heater is working great at night though. Little chill going thru here right now. Colby |
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dotnmarty
Joined: 03 Nov 2003 Posts: 4196 City/Region: Sammamish
State or Province: WA
C-Dory Year: 1993
C-Dory Model: 16 Angler
Vessel Name: LIZZIE II
Photos: Lizzie
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Posted: Mon Aug 31, 2020 7:16 pm Post subject: |
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If you get a chance, visit Jackson Lake Lodge In Teton national Park. . Beautiful architecture as will as a place for a good inexpensive meal. Hope the mosquitos aren't too bad _________________ MartyP
"...we're all in the same boat..." |
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thataway
Joined: 02 Nov 2003 Posts: 20812 City/Region: Pensacola
State or Province: FL
C-Dory Year: 2007
C-Dory Model: 25 Cruiser
Vessel Name: thataway
Photos: Thataway
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Posted: Mon Aug 31, 2020 7:27 pm Post subject: |
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dotnmarty wrote: | If you get a chance, visit Jackson Lake Lodge In Teton national Park. . Beautiful architecture as will as a place for a good inexpensive meal. Hope the mosquitos aren't too bad |
Agree a great place, but I believe it is all shut down currently.
Enjoy Yellowstone, and it looks like the Buffalo Bill Center of the West museum is open. Well worth a stop. Nice campground on the West part of Cody. _________________ Bob Austin
Thataway
Thataway (Ex Seaweed) 2007 25 C Dory May 2018 to Oct. 2021
Thisaway 2006 22' CDory November 2011 to May 2018
Caracal 18 140 Suzuki 2007 to present
Thataway TomCat 255 150 Suzukis June 2006 thru August 2011
C Pelican; 1992, 22 Cruiser, 2002 thru 2006
Frequent Sea; 2003 C D 25, 2007 thru 2009
KA6PKB
Home port: Pensacola FL |
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dgeorges
Joined: 04 Sep 2013 Posts: 182 City/Region: Highlands Ranch
State or Province: CO
C-Dory Year: 2006
C-Dory Model: 22 Cruiser
Vessel Name: FRESH FISH
Photos: FRESH FISH
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Posted: Mon Aug 31, 2020 11:06 pm Post subject: |
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Nice to see you are traveling around Colby. I'm sorry for your issues, but of all people, you are one to take em on and beat em. Been to many a boat show, and all the seminars put on by boating experts all say that fuel issues are usually the cause of most problems. good for you chasing it all down.
I was intrigued by your experience at elevation. As you know, I moved to away from IL, and to CO. All the lakes I fish here in CO are located between 8500 and 10000 ft elevation. I recently fished with another CD22 owner at Granby Rservoir here in CO, located at 8600 ft. He commented that Yellowstone was at only 7500 ft.
Thank goodness I had the means to trade in my good ol 90 HP 4 stroke carberated Honda for a new 115 Yama with fuel injection. The real trick was sizing the prop to the elevation. Turns out a 13.5 pitch works perfect at elevation and pushes my CD22 really efficiently at altitude. Kudos goes to the dealer who was a master at putting the right prop on that new Yamadog.
Good luck with your travels back home to WI. You know you and your bride always have a place to hang your hat here in CO if your passing throught he Denver area. _________________ "Ain't no nookie like Chinookie"---Ray Troll
CD 22 Cruiser "FRESH FISH: 2018 to present.
CD 16 Angler "OPA": 2013 to 2019. |
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