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Wandering Sagebrush
Joined: 21 Jan 2005
Posts: 2770
City/Region: Northeast Oregon
State or Province: OR
C-Dory Year: 2005
C-Dory Model: 22 Cruiser
Vessel Name: Constant Craving
Photos: Constant Craving
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 Posted: Tue Jun 29, 2021 8:45 am Post subject: Re: post topic |
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| easy does it wrote: | | It seems you are suggesting I use non eth gas. considerably more expensive. Well ok but my engine manuals say up to 10% eth is ok...so which is it? |
Use non ethanol, your boat will thank you for it.
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"And in the end, it's not the years in your life that count. It's the life in your years." - Abraham Lincoln |
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hardee
Joined: 30 Oct 2006
Posts: 12632
City/Region: Sequim
State or Province: WA
C-Dory Year: 2005
C-Dory Model: 22 Cruiser
Vessel Name: Sleepy-C
Photos: SleepyC
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| Posted: Tue Jun 29, 2021 9:51 am Post subject: Re: non ethanol fuel choice. |
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| Dan McNally wrote: | | Interesting take on fuel choices here. I just had my carbs cleaned and restored 10 months ago *#A because of a slight stumble at about 2200 rpms. I brought the boat home and parked it added some fuel stabilizer and let it sit for ten months *#B. Fired it up to play and it was all messed up, the only way it would run is with the choke being used. Took it back to the shop and talked with them and they stated that there are issues with either type of fuel you use. If you use non ethanol fuel you need to do that consistently *#3 and he stated that their recommendation is to run ethanol fuel with lots of stabilizer and to keep the tanks full and the fuel lines hooked up. *#4 I will take him at his word he has always been good to me for the past fifteen years servicing my 22 footer. He stated that their recommendations have evolved as the understanding of fuel types *#5 have changed in the recent past. |
I see lots of questions and issues here.
*#A Were the jets replaced with new, or just "cleaned"?
*#B Was all the previous Gas used, diluted or disposed of? Was the stabilizer run through the engines after it was added to the tank?
*#3 Nice idea but seriously impractical, and in my belief, a bunch of baloney. (I have mixed gas types for 15 years with NO problem using my (stated here) methods.
*#4 Finally something that actually makes sense. And it has worked in my practice for 15 years.
*#5 Yes, both fuels AND additives have changed over time, Additives much more so.
I bought my boat with 80 hours on brand new engines and then it sat for several months, outside, summer into late fall, before I found it. When I first ran it, it stuttered and would not run near mid throttle. Don't know for sure but most likely had untreated, ethanol gas. Took it into the mechanics, Yamaha Certified and under warrantee, and the carbs were all gunked up.
  
My mechanic said to do this:
1. Add Marine Stabil at every fill UNLESS I was on a cruise and would be running that fuel out FOR SURE in less than the next week.
2. When returning to home port, ADD Marine Stabil treatment for a full tank at whatever level the gas was currently, so that that could be running through the engines before shutting them down.
3. Fill the tanks on the way home and add the Marine Stable for the amount (gallons put in), of the fill.
4. Store the boat with full tanks, and the added Stabil.
5. IF it sits for several months, like over the winter, ADD Startron (to boost the octane) when launching for the first of the season.
6. In the Spring, the first fill might be only half or less, of a tank. That first fill gets the next fuel octane step up from the usual octane which is 87 or 88. That is the only time I use other than "regular" octane.
Doing this practice, and nothing else fuel wise I have not, since the Carb rebuild, had a single fuel issue. In the last 5 years I have added using the Yamaha RingFree additive with each fill, or every other if I am doing cruising where I am filling frequently. On my last fill on a cruise, that gas is coming from a marina pump, and in most cases that will be non-ethanol. When I fill the tanks on the way home that will be non-ethanol for sure. I have nearly 1800 hours and fully expect to get up to 3000 before repowering. The OBs are professionally maintained twice a year. My belief is that if I take care of my twins, they well take care of me. Has worked perfectly so far.
Harvey
SleepyC 
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Though in our sleep we are not conscious of our activity or surroundings, we should not, in our wakefulness, be unconscious of our sleep. |
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thataway
Joined: 02 Nov 2003
Posts: 20808
City/Region: Pensacola
State or Province: FL
C-Dory Year: 2007
C-Dory Model: 25 Cruiser
Vessel Name: thataway
Photos: Thataway
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| Posted: Tue Jun 29, 2021 9:26 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: | ADD Startron (to boost the octane) when launching for the first of the season.
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Startron (known by other names in various parts of the World) is a "magic" material which claims to use enzymes to keep fuel in best condition. The original tests are really marginal--but I have seen old diesel fuel which had gelled, and Startron was added, and after 3000 miles of sailing the diesel was liquid again, which allowed it to be pumped out of tanks.
No where have I see Startron proof that it increases octane. Even in their add, Star write (the US dealer for Startron--and their name for the material) they say it "restores or preserves" octane. It will not make 87 octane fuel into 89 octane fuel.
Yes I have been using Startron for a number of years--I don't really know if it works or not. I also use Stabil, which also helps to preserve the fuel's properties. I have used 4 year old fuel, stabilized, in an injected engine. Not the best, but worked. Eventually I pumped that out--disposed of it, and put in new fuel.
I don't disagree with Harvey's way of handling fuel. But despite the claimed "magic". there is no real "Magic".
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Bob Austin
Thataway
Thataway (Ex Seaweed) 2007 25 C Dory May 2018 to Oct. 2021
Thisaway 2006 22' CDory November 2011 to May 2018
Caracal 18 140 Suzuki 2007 to present
Thataway TomCat 255 150 Suzukis June 2006 thru August 2011
C Pelican; 1992, 22 Cruiser, 2002 thru 2006
Frequent Sea; 2003 C D 25, 2007 thru 2009
KA6PKB
Home port: Pensacola FL |
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hardee
Joined: 30 Oct 2006
Posts: 12632
City/Region: Sequim
State or Province: WA
C-Dory Year: 2005
C-Dory Model: 22 Cruiser
Vessel Name: Sleepy-C
Photos: SleepyC
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| Posted: Wed Jun 30, 2021 4:28 am Post subject: |
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Agree that Startron does not boost octane, like from 88 to 94, but after the fuel sits over the winter it might have dropped from 88 to 86, and that is when I add the Startron. Maybe that is the "restore" function working. It has been working for 15 years, and I kind of go along with,
IF it ain't broke, don't fix it and if it's been working why change it.
I'm not a chemist or a mechanic, but I'm happy when my OBs are running. The "Magic" is being on the water.
Harvey
SleepyC
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T.R. Bauer
Joined: 17 Nov 2007
Posts: 1726
City/Region: Wasilla
State or Province: AK
C-Dory Year: 1993
C-Dory Model: 22 Cruiser
Vessel Name: C-Whisperer
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| Posted: Wed Jun 30, 2021 8:53 am Post subject: |
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| I think draining carbs works really well in general - tons of evidence on that. I have used stabil too, but now use Sea Foam Marine PRO because it cleans fuel systems and stabilizes the fuel. However, I really don't believe that any of these cleaners or stabilizer is really far different than the other. |
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starcrafttom
Joined: 07 Nov 2003
Posts: 7881
City/Region: marysville
State or Province: WA
C-Dory Year: 1984
C-Dory Model: 27 Cruiser
Vessel Name: to be decided later
Photos: Susan E
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| Posted: Wed Jun 30, 2021 12:11 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | ethanol fuels it is the damage to seals and o rings |
TRUE 20 years ago. Look the solution is to out law ethanol in the first place. Waste of good corn and tax dollars that does nothing for the enviroment. Just get rid of it.
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Thomas J Elliott
http://tomsfishinggear.blogspot.com/ |
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Marco Flamingo
Joined: 09 Jul 2015
Posts: 1155
City/Region: Seattle
State or Province: WA
C-Dory Year: 2004
C-Dory Model: 16 Cruiser
Vessel Name: Limpet
Photos: Limpet
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| Posted: Wed Jun 30, 2021 6:49 pm Post subject: |
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| starcrafttom wrote: | | I see things in this statement that make me say ???. |
One of the ??? that I see is the claim to fill up in the morning when the gas is cooler. The station's giant storage tank is 10' underground. That temperature changes a few degrees seasonally. That means that if you wait and fill up only in the winter you might save a few pennies. Price per gallon, not time of day, makes the difference.
Ethanol has become the boogie monster that gets all the blame. Boat US did a little study where they left a standard 6 gal. red plastic Moeller type gas can sitting around for a few months. When they measured it again, it was about 5.9 gallons. Some plastics are more permeable than others and it probably is the "good stuff" that passes through. Now, the gas in the tank does go through a daily expansion/contraction also the air through the vent.
Gas just doesn't like to stay put and the volitiles will leave first. I'm sure ethanol gets the blame. |
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localboy
Joined: 30 Sep 2006
Posts: 4656
City/Region: Lake Stevens via Honolulu
State or Province: WA
C-Dory Year: 2007
C-Dory Model: 25 Cruiser
Vessel Name: 'Au Kai (Ocean Traveler)
Photos: 'AU KAI
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| Posted: Wed Jun 30, 2021 8:38 pm Post subject: |
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For the last few years I’ve run E10. Real gas is too hard to find and when you do find it, you have to pay exorbitant prices. That is even worse now. We know who to “thank” for that!
I’ve been using the blue “Marine” Sta-bil at every fill up. Religiously. I change the fuel filter/water separator in the spring. Last year I filled the boat in the fall as I was afraid the COVID Armageddon was about to occur. 120 gallons on hand was better than the 20 I had in jerry cans. I doubled the Stabil ratios, as recommended in that fill. I have never had an issue. When I drain the filter at the end of the season, the amount of water in it is perhaps 1 tsp at the most, and that’s the large filters.
This year the boat started right up after sitting since October. Maybe I’m just lucky. Maybe the Stabil works as advertised. Maybe my maintenance allows it to be successful.
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"We can go over there...behind the 'little one'....."
Wife to her husband pointing @ us...from the bow of their 50-footer; Prideaux Haven 2013 |
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itiming
Joined: 28 Apr 2020
Posts: 51
City/Region: Iron River
State or Province: WI
C-Dory Year: 2008
C-Dory Model: 22 Cruiser
Vessel Name: Obsession
Photos: Obsession
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| Posted: Wed Jun 30, 2021 11:18 pm Post subject: |
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Last summer my starboard 2012 Honda 40 rpm's were not keeping pace with the port Honda 40 -- and topped out just under 4000 rpm's. My local marine engine mechanic suggested that instead of bringing it in for service; I should first run several tanks treated with SeaFoam though the motor.
To start, I added twice the recommended maintenance dose to one 23 gallon tank. The engine rpm's improved quickly. For the next tank, I reduced the SeaFoam additive to their recommended maintenance level (I can (20 oz) of SeaFoam marine to 30 gal fuel). Within 3 tanks the sluggish Honda ran smoothly and attained 5500-6000 rpm WOT.
FWIW, I only use non-ethanol fuel. I also use a single engine trolling for trout/salmon in Lake Superior. Prior to last year, I used Sta-Bil marine additive.
This season, I have continued the SeaFoam additive at 20 oz per 30 gallons. Both engines continue to run smoothly with rpms closely tracking. |
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-Waypoint-
Joined: 02 Nov 2019
Posts: 93
City/Region: Jensen Beach, Florida
State or Province: FL
C-Dory Year: 1998
C-Dory Model: 22 Cruiser
Vessel Name: Waypoint
Photos: Waypoint
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| Posted: Wed Jun 30, 2021 11:24 pm Post subject: |
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I buy REC89 (no ethanol) in Florida. I have one large aluminum fuel tank that is partitioned in the middle. Each side holds 20 gallons for a total of 40 gallons.
Never have drained the carbs, I use Sea Foam (standard) fuel treatment by the gallon at O'Reilly Auto Parts for $52.99 Each. I fill my boat with five gallon gas jugs using a syphon ball hose. Mix 4 oz. of SeaFoam to one 5 gallon jug of fuel, dump in the boat. Start once a week. The engines are 1998 40hp Hondas. Never had a fuel problem. Never taken the carburetors apart or had them serviced.
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Mark n' Yuka Elwell |
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colbysmith
Joined: 02 Oct 2011
Posts: 4547
City/Region: Madison
State or Province: WI
C-Dory Year: 2009
C-Dory Model: 25 Cruiser
Vessel Name: C-Traveler
Photos: C-Traveler and Midnight-Flyer
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| Posted: Wed Jun 30, 2021 11:40 pm Post subject: |
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| Been running regular gas (10% ethanol) forever with no problems. I do use premium, no ethanol, for the last fill of the season though. So the ethanol gas is never sitting in the tank for more than a month! However, I don't put ethanol in my small engines. (Mowers, snow blower, generator, etc.) Not really sure why, since they are all suppose to work ok on the E10 stuff. And gas doesn't sit in them more than a month or so either. |
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Molly Brown
Joined: 02 Nov 2003
Posts: 405
City/Region: Punta Gorda
State or Province: FL
C-Dory Year: 2003
C-Dory Model: 24 Tomcat
Vessel Name: MOLLY BROWN
Photos: Molly Brown
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| Posted: Thu Jul 01, 2021 6:29 am Post subject: |
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Dang Mark....Saw your post and decided to check out your pics. Nice job on the boat, and those C-Dory boat models are just awesome!!! Any chance I could commission a couple Molly Brown's? 
Sorry for the quick highjack, couldn't resist.
James
P.S. I should have looked you up as we passed Jensen Beach earlier this year, my bad.....
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 James, Betty, Luna cat and Moki dog on the TomCat Molly Brown
Started the Great American Loop 03/2024 |
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srbaum
Joined: 30 Aug 2010
Posts: 877
City/Region: Portsmouth
State or Province: VA
C-Dory Year: 2007
C-Dory Model: 26 Venture
Vessel Name: Osprey
Photos: Osprey
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| Posted: Thu Jul 01, 2021 6:32 pm Post subject: |
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Here is a video that is worth a moment of time, as it shows what happens in our boats, with ethanol fuel compared to non-ethanol fuel.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UOk65gstEKY
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Steve Baum
Homeport of Portsmouth, VA
OSPREY (Ex Mister Sea) 2000 22 C-Dory 2010 - Sold 3/19
OSPREY (Ex ADITI) 2007 26 Cape Cruiser 2018 |
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hardee
Joined: 30 Oct 2006
Posts: 12632
City/Region: Sequim
State or Province: WA
C-Dory Year: 2005
C-Dory Model: 22 Cruiser
Vessel Name: Sleepy-C
Photos: SleepyC
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| Posted: Fri Jul 02, 2021 1:30 am Post subject: |
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Thanks Steve. WOW, that seems like a lot of evaporation, but the message is clear. It is NASTY stuff.
Harvey
SleepyC
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