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thataway



Joined: 02 Nov 2003
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City/Region: Pensacola
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C-Dory Model: 25 Cruiser
Vessel Name: thataway
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 28, 2020 9:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Also the two induction burners I have, will not work if there is a non ferrous material on the plate. Sometimes even a test with a magnet is not enough. It appears that there needs to be a critical mass of iron to heat properly. I have one pot which is labeled with the induction symbol. It works on the New Wave burner, but not on the Duxtop, similar to what TyBoo owns.

Quote:
Wish they made small inverters with lugs for the output not sockets


The Magnum I had used for many years in the RV had lugs, and the Victron I am currently use has lugs for the 110 V AC. I agree that they are large units, but also have large battery chargers but in--(110 and 80 amps respectively). Tight fit on the 25, but workable, with extra fans. Also the higher end inverters all have temperature sensors on the battery. This is an extra safety precaution.


Since the boat 110V wiring should be stranded wire, it is fairly easy to hook up the #12 wiring to a heavy duty 20 amp 110 V plug. Plug in those several plugs which you need. On my boat, the microwave and induction burners are on the inverter circuit. (The inverter has a built in transfer switch--it also adds power if the power from the dock is restricted and there is a voltage drop).

The water heater, battery charger and air conditioning circuits are not on the inverter circuit.

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Thataway
Thataway (Ex Seaweed) 2007 25 C Dory May 2018 to Oct. 2021
Thisaway 2006 22' CDory November 2011 to May 2018
Caracal 18 140 Suzuki 2007 to present
Thataway TomCat 255 150 Suzukis June 2006 thru August 2011
C Pelican; 1992, 22 Cruiser, 2002 thru 2006
Frequent Sea; 2003 C D 25, 2007 thru 2009
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TyBoo



Joined: 23 Oct 2003
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City/Region: Warrenton
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 30, 2020 8:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote







The inverter resides at the bottom of what was once a hanging closet. I added compartments and shelves to it over the years until it was almost useless as a closet, so the jumbo inverter dealt it the final blow. I will put a shelf above the inverter to protect it and another shelf above that and just wad the spare clothes up and stuff 'em somewhere.


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thataway



Joined: 02 Nov 2003
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City/Region: Pensacola
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 30, 2020 11:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Good looking--and a great use for the "closet"!
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colbysmith



Joined: 02 Oct 2011
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City/Region: Madison
State or Province: WI
C-Dory Year: 2009
C-Dory Model: 25 Cruiser
Vessel Name: C-Traveler
Photos: C-Traveler and Midnight-Flyer
PostPosted: Sat Dec 16, 2023 11:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Resurrecting this thread, as I'm now thinking of adding an inverter to C-Traveler. I still have my generator, even with my solar panels. But would be nice to run the small microwave once in a while without firing up the generator. Also, while I'm not a coffee drinker, Rosanne is, and I might get her a little 5 cup Mr. Coffee Maker, that I see uses 650 watts. I think my microwave might be 1000 watts, if that much. Actually, may be 900 watts. Guess I should look and see. Anyway, I'm not sure I see the need for 2000 watts, and believe I can get by with 1000-1500 watts. I don't plan to change my two group 29 house batteries, and not sure if I'll mount the inverter back over the batteries and run 12 or 14 gauge wire for the 110 vt output to the cabin, or run the appropriate size wire from the batteries to the cabin and then mount the inverter inside. Seems it'd be better to mount it inside the cabin to protect it from moisture and I'd also like to put a switch in the 12 vt wiring from the batteries to the inverter, to completely shut it off when not needed. Either case, I would add separate 110 vt outlets from those already installed with shore power. I'm kind of looking at the Ampeak 1200W Pure Sine Wave Inverter on Amazon for $153. Just wondering if anyone else is using this one, or has any advice for me? Thanks. Colby
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thataway



Joined: 02 Nov 2003
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City/Region: Pensacola
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Photos: Thataway
PostPosted: Sun Dec 17, 2023 1:14 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

My findings are that the cheap inverters are "difficult" for the microwave. The run time is longer and there often a "buzz" from the microwave. Generally microwave outputs are less than the amount of current needed. We have also switched to induction stoves in both the Boat and RV--cooler in Fl heat, plus uses less fuel for the stove.

On my boats I put extra batteries (in today's world that means 100 amp hour LiFePO4 one of which equals the output of 2 group 31 AGM batteries. I mount both the extra battery and the inverter in the cabin, which allows for short cable runs.

My last boat I went with a 2000 watt inverter/charger from Victron, It also had an 80 amp charger, a boost function of 50 amps (If the end of the line voltage from a dock has dropped to 90 volts, and consequently electrical appliances do not run well, that the inverter boost the voltage back to 120. Finally the inverter can be wired thru its own transfer switch, so you can energize the outlets. Mounting in the cabin also allows for short cables of a smaller size such as OO instead of 000 3/0 or 0000. 4/0
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Robert H. Wilkinson



Joined: 26 Jan 2011
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 17, 2023 10:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Colby, I agree with Thataway - quality is best. You don't need another anchor - guys have said that here re. cheap generators which is why you see most using the honda exclusively. His setup using an invertor/charger is ideal if starting from scratch but I imagine you already have a charger setup.

Get a true sign wave - many electronics do not work well or at all with the cheap square wave units. They can also damage expensive electronics.

Install a class T fast blow fuse in line close to the battery. Carry a spare and beware they are not cheap.

Regards.

Rob

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colbysmith



Joined: 02 Oct 2011
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 17, 2023 7:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I do appreciate your advice Bob and Rob, but... let me restate what I'm looking for. A VW Bug rather than a Camaro or Cadillac. Razz Again, I'm just looking to power up a small microwave for a few minutes, or a small coffee maker for however long it takes to make coffee, (one at a time), without the need to fire up my generator. I believe a 1200 watt pure sine wave inverter should be able to handle those power needs. And it looks like this one is decent: https://www.amazon.com/Ampeak-Pure-Sine-Wave-Inverter/dp/B09SZCWM8R/ref=sr_1_5?crid=3BIMCQT4XLR0&keywords=1200W+Pure+Sine+Wave+Inverter&qid=1702854296&sprefix=%2Caps%2C1179&sr=8-5&ufe=app_do%3Aamzn1.fos.18ed3cb5-28d5-4975-8bc7-93deae8f9840 Tell me if I'm wrong about the amount of wattage or the specific inverter.
Then, is it too wet/humid to mount an inverter next to the batteries in the aft cockpit compartment? IF mounted in the cabin, requiring a 12-15' run of battery cable, what size cable are folks using? The only inverters I have experience with are 100-200 watt ones that I have plugged into an accessory outlet, and then charged up my laptop or electric shaver, or my cpap, before getting a 12vt adaptive power cord for it. Colby
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thataway



Joined: 02 Nov 2003
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City/Region: Pensacola
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C-Dory Model: 25 Cruiser
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Photos: Thataway
PostPosted: Mon Dec 18, 2023 12:18 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

If you want to stay with the cheap "pure sine wave" inverters (which are not really pure sine wave, they just have more steps than the "Modified Sine wave". Go for the 2000 watt version instead of the marginal (for microwave) one of 1200 watts. The 2000 watt is only $20 more.
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colbysmith



Joined: 02 Oct 2011
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PostPosted: Mon Dec 18, 2023 4:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

thataway wrote:
If you want to stay with the cheap "pure sine wave" inverters (which are not really pure sine wave, they just have more steps than the "Modified Sine wave". Go for the 2000 watt version instead of the marginal (for microwave) one of 1200 watts. The 2000 watt is only $20 more.


I don't understand "steps", but the brand I'm looking at, the 2000 watt would be $100 more than the 1200. Also, the specs show the 1200 prefers a 200ah battery, the 2000 a 300. I believe my current battery bank has a capacity of 200ah, so that alone rules out going with a bigger inverter with my current battery setup. I am also aware that the 2000 would need larger battery wiring than the 1200, which would add more expense for additional power I would not need. Before I buy any inverter for this possible project, I will use one of those watt meters with the microwave to see what it's really pulling. I have read where inverters run most efficiently close to their rated power.
If I find out the microwave pulls more than 1000 watts, then I'm done considering this project. Just not willing to spend a lot on this.
I'd rather spend only what I need to have an operable system to meet my needs, and use the saved finances to buy more gas for more traveling. Wink I really do appreciate the comments above, as I learn more about inverters, just as I learned about solar panels with that install. I don't want to buy "junk", but at the same time I do believe technology is continuing to evolve, and looking more to see what issues others have run into. I've already learned I want pure sine wave as opposed to modified, and that induction will require more sophisticated inverters. Still wondering where folks mount their inverters, and what size battery wiring are they using for runs of 12' or more. Or are most installing additional batteries in the cabin, which is something I'm not willing to do right now. It probably matters too when the inverter would be in use. With the microwave, it would usually be around supper time for only a few minutes when the batteries have a full charge. A coffee maker would likely be in the morning, when the batteries are at 75-85%. And the coffee maker would likely need to run longer than the microwave. That may make a big difference rather it's even worth installing an inverter with my current battery set up. Colby
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ssobol



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PostPosted: Mon Dec 18, 2023 6:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

colbysmith wrote:
.... A coffee maker would likely be in the morning, when the batteries are at 75-85%. And the coffee maker would likely need to run longer than the microwave. That may make a big difference rather it's even worth installing an inverter with my current battery set up. Colby


Might be more efficient to use the induction cooker to heat water in a kettle for coffee than use the resistance heater in the coffee maker.
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Robert H. Wilkinson



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PostPosted: Mon Dec 18, 2023 8:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

For coffee I used a SS camp style perc on a butane burner for years but the grounds are a bit of a pain on a boat. Have switched to a single serve Keurig machine which works good on my 750 watt inverter. A bit more expensive per cup but it keeps the grounds contained and you only heat the exact amount of water for your mug. On my boat(not a Cdory) I mounted the inverter up under the gunwale where short of a swamping it never gets wet.
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colbysmith



Joined: 02 Oct 2011
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PostPosted: Mon Dec 18, 2023 8:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Robert H. Wilkinson wrote:
For coffee I used a SS camp style perc on a butane burner for years but the grounds are a bit of a pain on a boat. Have switched to a single serve Keurig machine which works good on my 750 watt inverter. A bit more expensive per cup but it keeps the grounds contained and you only heat the exact amount of water for your mug. On my boat(not a Cdory) I mounted the inverter up under the gunwale where short of a swamping it never gets wet.


Thanks. That's the kind of info I'm looking for. Colby
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smckean (Tosca)



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PostPosted: Mon Dec 18, 2023 9:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Colby,

I have a 1000 watt inverter mounted upside down under the splash well. It is handy for many things (computer charging, vacuum, coffee grinder, etc, etc). I would miss it a lot.

The biggest load I place on it is to use a 750 watt microwave to heat up my coffee without having to start the generator. I will say the resulting 60 amp load on my dual house AMG 60 amp-hr batteries used to scare me a bit (pulls about 60 amps out of the battery bank while running). I usually run for 30 seconds, sometimes 60 seconds (note: 60 amps for 1 minute is only 1 amp-hr). I did this every day, multiple times a day, for 2 months on my round Vancouver Island trip in 2022 with no apparent ill effects on my batteries, inverter, or any other electrical component. This allowed me to not run my generator in the peaceful, quiet mornings as I laid on the settee bunk watching the sky and the wildlife while sipping my coffee. BEST TIME OF THE DAY!

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colbysmith



Joined: 02 Oct 2011
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PostPosted: Mon Dec 18, 2023 10:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks Sandy. I was almost thinking myself out of starting this project as I did more reading on microwaves and thought about the amperage pull on my battery bank. But I may still go for it. I'm kind of on hold right now until I get the watt meter on the microwave to see what it really pulls. And then I may just get the $160 1200 watt pure sine wave inverter, mount it like you did, hook it up temporarily and then run an extension cord to try stuff out and see how much load is put on the batteries, before installing it more permanently. Colby
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smckean (Tosca)



Joined: 18 Jan 2014
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 19, 2023 4:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Colby, frankly I'd be thinking more about wires than battery load. As I mentioned, and as I'm sure you realize, an amp-hr or two out of a battery bank is nothing. Sure it comes out all at once, but I doubt the battery really cares. Even 120 amps for only 1 minute is only 2 amp-hrs (2% of my total amp-hr battery bank capacity of ~100 amp-hrs).

The splashwell location is great because the distance to the batteries is so short, so it's easy to deal with the large gauge wires required. BTW, I've installed a couple of normal 120v outlets in the cabin completely separate from the shore power driven system (fairly easy to do) -- one on each side of the boat so I don't need to run an extension cord across the cabin sole. I find these outlets extremely convenient.

P.S. I have rewired most of the backend of the boat including the inverter hook up, but it was the previous owner (David McKibben) who thought of mounting it under the splashwell.
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