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Rubber duck antenna x Smiley
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BrentB



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PostPosted: Sat Nov 30, 2019 8:50 am    Post subject: Rubber duck antenna x Smiley Reply with quote

I have a SH HX851 handheld VHF radio and last night , was shopping online and visited Smiley Antenna site which has a replacement antenna with 3db gain. I donít know the SH antenna specs and wondered if anyone has used a Smiley antenna and have any comments. I plan to contact SH and ask about their antenna specs.

https://www.smileyantenna.com/Default.asp[/i]

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hardee



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PostPosted: Sat Nov 30, 2019 9:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

That link did not work for me, "page not found" message.

I was able to get there with this:

https://www.smileyantenna.com/category-s/1514.htm

Hope that works.

Harvey
SleepyC Moon

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thataway



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PostPosted: Sun Dec 01, 2019 2:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have not used this antenna supplier. Brent asked the correct question--what is the gain of the standard Horizon antenna, which comes with the radio? My guess is that hit is 3 dB gain.

I have used several after market antennas, on 2 meter and 2 meter 440Mhz hand held ham radios. They seem slightly better than some of the antennas which come with the radios. One of the Smiley' has extensions to go from 1/4 wave to 5/8 wave so that the antenna is higher.

The radio is 6 watts, and limited by approximately line of site. No antenna, except one which gets it higher (maybe pick up one mile of range) will make a 6 watt radio on the deck, perform better than a 25 watt radio, with an antenna 10' above the deck.

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Thataway
Thataway (Ex Seaweed) 2007 25 C Dory May 2018
Thisaway 2006 22' CDory November 2011 to May 2018
Caracal 18 140 Suzuki 2007 to present
Thataway TomCat 255 150 Suzukis June 2006 thru August 2011
C Pelican; 1992, 22 Cruiser, 2002 thru 2006
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BrentB



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PostPosted: Mon Dec 02, 2019 10:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi Brent


Thank you for contacting us with your email. What comes with the marine radios is a no gain omni directional antenna. A +3 dB gain antenna will most certainly give you better performance. However the antenna will be more rigid to from the base to the tip. Any damage to that antenna will cause a decrease in performance vs the stock no gain antenna.

Best regards,
Juan Hernandez
j.hernandez@yaesu.com

Yaesu USA
Standard Horizon
6125 Phyllis Drive
Cypress, Ca 90630
Ph: 714-827-7600
Fx: 714-527-9472

www.yaesu.com
www.standardhorizon.com
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thataway



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PostPosted: Mon Dec 02, 2019 12:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks for finding out--I was wrong-- I apologize. O gain it is.
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journey on



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PostPosted: Mon Dec 02, 2019 2:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm not sure that the Smiley antenna covers the entire marine VHF band. The weather channels and some other operate at up to ~162.5 Mhz. The spec on the antenna is 150 to 160 Mhz. Depends on what the roll off of the gain is.

On the other hand, it does have a 3 db gain over the stock antenna, which would give added range. With the normal output of 5 watts, I understand that a 0 db antenna will get you 5 mi and 3 db more should increase that the 7.5 miles. At that range the horizon shouldn't be a problem.

They do offer a flexible 3 db antenna for $19. So they're cheap and should be worth a try.

Boris
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BrentB



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PostPosted: Mon Dec 02, 2019 3:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Antenna uses a SMA Male connector
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BrentB



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PostPosted: Mon Dec 02, 2019 3:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The radio frequencies used in the VHF marine band lie between 156 and 158 MHz with NOAA Weather stations available between 161 and 163 MHz.
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journey on



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PostPosted: Mon Dec 02, 2019 6:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Here's a list of the VHF channels: USA Marine VHF channels. All the public correspondence channels are above 160, plus channel 20, port ops, and AIS. Granted that one does not use ATS on a handheld, but the others might come in handy. That can be as much as 20% of the advertised bandwidth of 150 to 160 Mhz.

If you want greater range or better reception, buy a smiley and and try it. You're only out $20.

Boris
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thataway



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PostPosted: Mon Dec 02, 2019 8:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The antenna will be at max "efficiency" where the SWR is the lowest--and if that is in the 157 MHz frequency area, this will be were most of the marine VHF frequency is located. 156.800 is Channel 16. Channel 70 DSC is 156.525 MHz.

The weather channels will come in fine and I doubt that you can tell the difference between the standard and any additional antenna. It is on transmit that any difference will be noticed.

AIS is slightly above this near 161 MHz--but that is not an issue with hand held antennas.

Boris, I am not sure where you are getting the 5 miles from 5 watts. But if the the conditions are good you can hit high repeaters or receivers from many miles away. If there is man made or natural interference, the radio with higher power will push thru better. But generally there is a "radio horizon" and that is slightly more than the optical horizon: For VHF radios held at 6' above the sea, this will be about 6 miles. Having 3 dB gain will not change that significantly. Now if the receiver is up 500 feet, then the range would be theoretically 35 miles, and you are more likely to get thru with a 3 or 6 dB gain antenna. But the radiation pattern is flattened with the increase of gain.

EPRIB or PLB transmitters are only 5 watts: Satellites are over 12,000 miles high. Their frequency is 406 MHz--also line of site.

Most of the information on VHF is from ham radio and military use. But the frequencies are close enough that it should be the same. In late Nov. of 1983, I was confined to our boat in Norfolk, VA. recovering from back surgery for a paralyzed leg. I had made contact with the local ham club on my 2 meter hand held (output 5 watts). Several members dropped by to visit. They decided it would be a news worthy if I could make contact with Owen Garriott (W5LFL) on STS 9, during his "open first ham in space" pass overhead. We had an acknowledgement of reception of my KA6PKB call. That was 155 nautical miles above our boat. In direct line of sight with 5 watts. I have worked repeaters 20 miles away with 5 watts on 2 meter ham radio a number of times.

There is an exception to the line of site with VHF frequencies; that is Tropospheric Ducting ducting. It is an atmospheric condition where the VHF radio waves are reflected back and forth between layers of atmosphere. I have talked clearly at a distance of over 325 miles at sea with a 25 watt VHF radio.

Now if you get the longer antenna, where you gain 2 feet, you probably will get mile or 2 miles more range. But then how "portable" is that radio-where does that antenna stick, when the radio is clipped onto the belt.
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BrentB



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PostPosted: Mon Dec 02, 2019 9:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

They recommended this antenna but it is 12 ď long
5/8 DUCK 155 MHZ

I am buying Regular Duck at 7.5 in
https://www.smileyantenna.com/product-p/15550.ht

Thanks!
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BrentB



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PostPosted: Mon Dec 02, 2019 9:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Alas not waterproof
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hardee



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PostPosted: Tue Dec 03, 2019 11:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

BrentB wrote:
Alas not waterproof


I was wondering about that. If the antenna is "rubber" all except the connection end, maybe a good coating of liquid tape, or Rescue tape would do the trick -- at least make it splash proof.

Harvey
SleepyC Moon

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journey on



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PostPosted: Tue Dec 03, 2019 11:58 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

BrentB, I will be fascinated to hear how that Smiley antenna works.

I would not expect a great increase in range. This article, Antenna Range says that two antennae 12' above sea level has a range of 4.5 mi. That's reasonable on 2 C-Dorys. Doubling the power (3 db) doesn't increase the line of sight, but might help in marginal cases. The power received decreases by the square root of the distance, since it's a surface. So one may assume your range is now ~7 1/2 mile. Or since it's LOS limited, it may stay at 4.5 mi, but with better communications.

Boris
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BrentB



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PostPosted: Tue Dec 03, 2019 12:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Boris

I will posy and update. I have no decided between 7.5 to 12 in antennas but the later seems too long.
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