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C-Dory 26 Venture vs. Lakes Michigan and Huron
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shloots



Joined: 19 Dec 2018
Posts: 12
City/Region: Leland
State or Province: MI
PostPosted: Thu Dec 27, 2018 9:28 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Fantastic feedback from everyone...thank you so much. I believe I will continue my search for the boat that will better handle the frequently bigger waters of the Great Lakes. However, there just might be a C-dory in our lives at some point when the long runs are behind us. Thanks again to all who took the time to respond.
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ken35216



Joined: 12 Mar 2013
Posts: 569
City/Region: Destin, Florida
State or Province: FL
C-Dory Year: 2017
C-Dory Model: 25 Cruiser
Vessel Name: Lady Onyx
Photos: ken35216
PostPosted: Thu Dec 27, 2018 11:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

PaulNBriannaLynn wrote:
look at brands like Steigercraft, Parker, Shamrock, Albin 28 tournament express, Skagit Orca, Seasport,


Well you just wasted over an hour of my time looking up all those boats. Xmas LOL

My personal favorite was the Skagit Orca 27' XLC Extended Cabin with twin Honda 200's.

That's said I'd wouldn't trade my 25 Very Happy

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shloots



Joined: 19 Dec 2018
Posts: 12
City/Region: Leland
State or Province: MI
PostPosted: Thu Dec 27, 2018 12:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sorry ken35216, I certainly appreciate your efforts and will buy you a beer if we ever meet...Smile All these great responses have helped me a great deal. Your Skagit recommendation looks like a great boat...haven't found any pricing yet on it, but I'm sure it's out there somewhere. Thanks again.
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ken35216



Joined: 12 Mar 2013
Posts: 569
City/Region: Destin, Florida
State or Province: FL
C-Dory Year: 2017
C-Dory Model: 25 Cruiser
Vessel Name: Lady Onyx
Photos: ken35216
PostPosted: Thu Dec 27, 2018 12:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

shloots wrote:
Sorry ken35216, I certainly appreciate your efforts and will buy you a beer if we ever meet...Smile All these great responses have helped me a great deal. Your Skagit recommendation looks like a great boat...haven't found any pricing yet on it, but I'm sure it's out there somewhere. Thanks again.


They are built by the NWI (same company that builds the C-Dory). I'd think because the extra size and motor $180's new?

If I lived in southeast Florida I'd love one to run over to the Bahamas in.

The Venture 26 dry weight is 4,120 and the Skagit Orca 27 XLC dry weight is 6,000.

"“The boat (Skagit Orca 27) handled
and rode superbly,
refusing to pound
at 24 knots crossing
2-3 footers .”
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hardee



Joined: 30 Oct 2006
Posts: 12632
City/Region: Sequim
State or Province: WA
C-Dory Year: 2005
C-Dory Model: 22 Cruiser
Vessel Name: Sleepy-C
Photos: SleepyC
PostPosted: Thu Dec 27, 2018 1:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
"The Venture 26 dry weight is 4,120 and the Skagit Orca 27 XLC dry weight is 6,000."


I would be ??? about those weights, especially the V-26. MY CD-22 is about 3500 dry. On the trailer it is right at 5000 pounds. I'm sure the CD-25 will be close to 6K, without going back and looking up those weights.

Harvey
SleepyCMoon


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westward



Joined: 18 Feb 2005
Posts: 718
City/Region: Seattle
State or Province: WA
C-Dory Year: 1985
C-Dory Model: 16 Angler
Vessel Name: TBD
Photos: Steady Eddy
PostPosted: Thu Dec 27, 2018 1:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Some clarification of mission would help steer this interesting discussion: Intended use (cruising, fishing, overnighting?), how fast do you want/need to go?, presumably it needs to be trailerable for your off-piste storage: tow vehicle, beam width constraints, height/length constraints, weight limitations?, budget in round numbers?, prefer used or new?, outboard/IO/inboard?, spartan or upscale interior?, bulkhead door required?, proper head vs. porta-potty? You've indicated a preference for a relatively large cockpit, comfort and safety in steep wind chop, a switch from sailing and the ability to store it on your property....though your post was specific to one particular (poorly suited) boat it triggers a wonderful discussion of the compromises every boat purchaser must make. You're wise to be thinking this one through before writing any checks. Cheers!
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ken35216



Joined: 12 Mar 2013
Posts: 569
City/Region: Destin, Florida
State or Province: FL
C-Dory Year: 2017
C-Dory Model: 25 Cruiser
Vessel Name: Lady Onyx
Photos: ken35216
PostPosted: Thu Dec 27, 2018 1:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

[quote="hardee"]
Quote:

I would be ??? about those weights, especially the V-26. MY CD-22 is about 3500 dry. On the trailer it is right at 5000 pounds. I'm sure the CD-25 will be close to 6K, without going back and looking up those weights.

]


I got both of the weights off the NWI's website for comparison of cost new. Not actual real life weights.
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hardee



Joined: 30 Oct 2006
Posts: 12632
City/Region: Sequim
State or Province: WA
C-Dory Year: 2005
C-Dory Model: 22 Cruiser
Vessel Name: Sleepy-C
Photos: SleepyC
PostPosted: Thu Dec 27, 2018 3:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

[quote="ken35216"]
hardee wrote:
Quote:

I would be ??? about those weights, especially the V-26. MY CD-22 is about 3500 dry. On the trailer it is right at 5000 pounds. I'm sure the CD-25 will be close to 6K, without going back and looking up those weights.

]


I got both of the weights off the NWI's website for comparison of cost new. Not actual real life weights.


That is what I figured. A fair ways off from real world numbers. Just FYI.

Harvey
SleepyC Moon


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thataway



Joined: 02 Nov 2003
Posts: 20778
City/Region: Pensacola
State or Province: FL
C-Dory Year: 2007
C-Dory Model: 25 Cruiser
Vessel Name: thataway
Photos: Thataway
PostPosted: Thu Dec 27, 2018 3:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Many time the "dry" weight--may be just bare hull weight. No engines, as well as no fuel, water, accessories etc,

The factory gives 3950 as the "dry" weight (No motors), and 6340 lbs. (boat, motor, trailer, and fuel). Those of us who own the boats know that the boat motor and trailer is low--by at least 1000 lbs.

I think that almost all of the boats in consideration will be difficult in real 5' short steep chop. I am sure that any 31' sailboat would be basically stopped by each 5 foot wave, short and steep chop. But in sailboats one is not sailing directly into these waves 90% of the time--you are off at least 40* for the average cruising boat--and often 50 or more degrees.

Realistically what % of the time you are traveling across the lakes are the seas 3 to 5' steep chop?

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shloots



Joined: 19 Dec 2018
Posts: 12
City/Region: Leland
State or Province: MI
PostPosted: Thu Dec 27, 2018 4:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Our sailboat, a Hallberg-Rassy Monsun 31, pretty much handled everything that was thrown at it, and because of the big diesel engine, it muscled through significant waves. Because it was a sailboat with significant keel weight, I was never concerned about the boat. It was always the passengers that I had to keep an eye on...Smile. Although we could, we rarely went straight into anything because we were looking for optimal comfort. I believe the best design for us is going to be a deep-V lobster/down-east design. Most that I have looked at are 25-28 feet in length. It sounds like those of you who have had experience with the C-dory 25 or Venture all agree that it probably isn't the boat for what we see too frequently when cruising Lakes Michigan and Huron. I sure love the design of the C-dory 25 and Venture. As I learned a long time ago, hope for the best but prepare for the worst.
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Foggy



Joined: 01 Aug 2013
Posts: 1518
City/Region: Traverse City; Northern Lake Michigan
State or Province: MI
C-Dory Year: 2014
C-Dory Model: 26 Venture
Vessel Name: Boatless in Boating Paradise
Photos: W B Nod
PostPosted: Thu Dec 27, 2018 10:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I don't believe a deep-V hull is available on a down east lobster design boat.
Deep V and down east lobster style hulls are at loggerheads.

The deep V is usually for speed and takes lots of power. Lobster boats don't
need either. Down easters usually have a V'd bow to cut waves at slower
speeds then flatten out going astern. This shallower dead rise astern allows for
easier planing and efficiency. Two different critters. Bet your clams on it.

You may want a fast trawler, like a Nordic Tug or such which planes and cruises
in the mid to high teens and has a modified keel. Just expect to spend 2 -3
C Dory's cash for one (but you'll also gain 2 - 3 timse the cruising speed of
your Hallberg-Rassy). Lots of X-sailors go this route.

I still feel you are best off looking and chartering for a bit.

Aye.

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shloots



Joined: 19 Dec 2018
Posts: 12
City/Region: Leland
State or Province: MI
PostPosted: Fri Dec 28, 2018 5:55 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks for the feedback. I guess I was referring to the bow configuration of both of these designs. Your information helps. Here is a link to a design that I think would work well around here and still be affordable...used of course. Our budget will probably top out at around $100k which also limits our options. But there are some tremendous used boats out there if one just takes the time to look. I will be taking a couple of years off from boating because of (5) new grandchildren, so I'm in research mode which is almost as fun as buying...Smile

https://www.yachtworld.com/boats/1998/Ellis-Ext-H-T-Sedan-3227882/Annapolis/MD/United-States?refSource=standard%20listing#.W7AkYmhKi00
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san juanderer



Joined: 12 Aug 2014
Posts: 234
City/Region: Stanwood
State or Province: WA
C-Dory Year: 1990
C-Dory Model: 22 Angler
PostPosted: Fri Dec 28, 2018 12:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The Ellis looks like a Rosborough on steroids, may be a nice slow cruiser type. Many boaters have left the inboard market going to outboards. Primarily because of lower maintenance costs. I had two of those ad41's in the Commander I owned. They are a good engine, but parts are CRAZY expensive. A 12" long oil cooler is $ 4500 dollars ( this part has a corrossion history at the mounting flange) and the coolant heat exchanger is more money than the oil cooler ( unlike most exchangers can NOT be opened up and rebuilt). Just be aware how expensive some systems are to maintain.
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shloots



Joined: 19 Dec 2018
Posts: 12
City/Region: Leland
State or Province: MI
PostPosted: Fri Dec 28, 2018 1:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yep...engine maintenance has been one of those things caught in the back of my throat...and I am very aware of the maintenance cost difference, along with potential engine replacement, labor, etc., etc.. Thanks for reminding me...Smile Razz Razz
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C-Green



Joined: 12 Apr 2004
Posts: 310
City/Region: Houghton
State or Province: MI
C-Dory Year: 2002
C-Dory Model: 22 Cruiser
Vessel Name: C-Green
Photos: C-Green
PostPosted: Fri Dec 28, 2018 2:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

One big advantage of the Great Lakes is fresh cold water for little corrosion.
Great looking boat but engine compartment looks like tiny maintenance hands would be a big big plus.

Jay
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