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Getting Daydream on a Plane on the Loop
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Pat Anderson



Joined: 02 Nov 2003
Posts: 8551
City/Region: Birch Bay, WA
State or Province: WA
C-Dory Year: 2005
C-Dory Model: 25 Cruiser
Vessel Name: Daydream
Photos: Daydream and Crabby Lou
PostPosted: Mon Jun 19, 2017 2:13 pm    Post subject: Getting Daydream on a Plane on the Loop Reply with quote

A fellow Looper here at Little Falls made a suggestion to get Daydream on plane. ALL our heavy stuff - AC, Aquatainer with 7 gallons of water, bar stock bin, Pelican Cooler, spare parts bin and pet food/composting toilet supplies are across the back of the cockpit. He suggested that when we need to get on a plane, we should move the heaviest stuff to the vee-berth, or as far forward as we can get it. He thought this would help the BF150 push the bow up over the bow wake and get on plane. Agree? I am going to give it a try on Lake Oneida, and if it works, it will really cut down our time and exposure on Lake Ontario!
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DAYDREAM - CD25 Cruiser
CRABBY LOU - CD16 Angler (sold 2020)
Pat & Patty Anderson, C-Brat #62!
http://daydreamsloop.blogspot.com

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rogerbum



Joined: 21 Nov 2004
Posts: 5922
City/Region: Kenmore
State or Province: WA
C-Dory Year: 2008
C-Dory Model: 255 Tomcat
Vessel Name: Meant to be
Photos: SeaDNA
PostPosted: Mon Jun 19, 2017 2:27 pm    Post subject: Re: Getting Daydream on a Plane on the Loop Reply with quote

Pat Anderson wrote:
A fellow Looper here at Little Falls made a suggestion to get Daydream on plane. ALL our heavy stuff - AC, Aquatainer with 7 gallons of water, bar stock bin, Pelican Cooler, spare parts bin and pet food/composting toilet supplies are across the back of the cockpit. He suggested that when we need to get on a plane, we should move the heaviest stuff to the vee-berth, or as far forward as we can get it. He thought this would help the BF150 push the bow up over the bow wake and get on plane. Agree? I am going to give it a try on Lake Oneida, and if it works, it will really cut down our time and exposure on Lake Ontario!

Definitely agree. With a lot of weight to stern, the boat will tend to wallow more. I'm still surprised that you can get on plane at all though.

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nordicstallion



Joined: 16 Dec 2007
Posts: 380
City/Region: Crescent City
State or Province: CA
C-Dory Year: 2004
C-Dory Model: 19 Angler
Vessel Name: Rylee Rose
Photos: Rylee Rose
PostPosted: Mon Jun 19, 2017 3:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Everyone has heard of the problems with weight distribution associated with the design flaws of the 19.i like to keep my fuel tanks full to sidestep condensation problems but that compounds stern weight concerns. I like to keep about 100 lbs plus,of lead in the bottom of my anchor locker to compensate for the stern heavy characteristics of the 19. Life has been better since. Larger c-Dorys present different problems, being waterborne campers,with far more gear& weight farther astern. Life is better with weight forward...to an extent!!! Experiment incrementally because too much forward can get spooky! Scarey spooky!!!
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Pat Anderson



Joined: 02 Nov 2003
Posts: 8551
City/Region: Birch Bay, WA
State or Province: WA
C-Dory Year: 2005
C-Dory Model: 25 Cruiser
Vessel Name: Daydream
Photos: Daydream and Crabby Lou
PostPosted: Mon Jun 19, 2017 4:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks, will give redistribution of the weight a try! But we sure don't need scary spooky, so we'll try it a little at a time!
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BTDT



Joined: 07 Jan 2011
Posts: 322
City/Region: Grand Lake Oklahoma
State or Province: OK
C-Dory Year: 2007
C-Dory Model: 255 Tomcat
Vessel Name: C- Lark Wine Down
Photos: C-Lark
PostPosted: Mon Jun 19, 2017 4:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I agree with your fellow 'looper'. In my past experience with single engine boats I found moving 'stuff' forward really helped in getting on plane faster. On Lake Powell it saved me from buying a new prop given the high altitude power loss.

If I have four passengers in the rear of the cockpit of my Tomcat while getting on plane I can definitely tell the difference versus their sitting forward in the cabin.

That said, at some point you will be just too dam heavy to plane no matter where you put your stuff. If it were me I would experiment with less water, shipping the a/c and some spare stuff home, and/or leaving some stuff on the dock for testing. I would also be hesitant to move the heavy stuff too far forward for control reasons.

PS Medical supplies, aka bar-stock, is not to be considered as spare supplies Mr. Green

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C-Lark Wine Down
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Avidmagnum12



Joined: 23 Mar 2013
Posts: 668
City/Region: Ocklawaha
State or Province: FL
C-Dory Year: 2011
C-Dory Model: 25 Cruiser
Vessel Name: C-Otter
Photos: C-Otter
PostPosted: Mon Jun 19, 2017 7:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Pat..do you have a permatrim on your Honda? It sure helped my Honda 90 on the 22.
I also have one on my Yamaha 200 on the C-Otter. Even with a major load on an extended dive trip no problem. But then it has the extra HP.

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2011 CD 25 "C-Otter" 07/2015 to present
2011 CD 25 "My Girl" 06/2015 renamed C-Otter
2004 CD 22 Commuter "Out2C" 03/10 to 06/15
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Avidmagnum12



Joined: 23 Mar 2013
Posts: 668
City/Region: Ocklawaha
State or Province: FL
C-Dory Year: 2011
C-Dory Model: 25 Cruiser
Vessel Name: C-Otter
Photos: C-Otter
PostPosted: Mon Jun 19, 2017 7:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Pat..do you have a permatrim on your Honda? It sure helped my Honda 90 on the 22.
I also have one on my Yamaha 200 on the C-Otter. Even with a major load on an extended dive trip no problem. But then it has the extra HP.
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hardee



Joined: 30 Oct 2006
Posts: 12632
City/Region: Sequim
State or Province: WA
C-Dory Year: 2005
C-Dory Model: 22 Cruiser
Vessel Name: Sleepy-C
Photos: SleepyC
PostPosted: Mon Jun 19, 2017 7:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi Pat, I agree, Heavy stuff needs to be low, and midships, but some can sure go forward. Incremental may be a good approach. Permatrim may also help. I haven't had one, but I do move stuff forward and to the opposite side often.

Harvey
SleepyC Moon


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Robert H. Wilkinson



Joined: 26 Jan 2011
Posts: 1231
City/Region: Port Ryerse
State or Province: ON
Vessel Name: Romakeme IV
Photos: Romakeme IV
PostPosted: Mon Jun 19, 2017 8:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

hardee wrote:
Permatrim may also help. I haven't had one,
Harvey


Harvey - Maybe that's just one more advantage in having twice the sq. in. area of anti - cavitation plates Wink Cool

Pat - I went to a 4 blade prop which gives better stern lift with a heavy load aft. We do throw some stuff into the cuddy while under way both for weight distribution and to keep the cockpit clear for tending lines. I stuffed my bow in a following sea one day and it wasn't the most fun thing to do Shocked - so I am hesitant about adding too much weight too far forward.

Regards, Rob

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Pat Anderson



Joined: 02 Nov 2003
Posts: 8551
City/Region: Birch Bay, WA
State or Province: WA
C-Dory Year: 2005
C-Dory Model: 25 Cruiser
Vessel Name: Daydream
Photos: Daydream and Crabby Lou
PostPosted: Mon Jun 19, 2017 8:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Avidmagnum12 wrote:
Pat..do you have a permatrim on your Honda? It sure helped my Honda 90 on the 22.
I also have one on my Yamaha 200 on the C-Otter. Even with a major load on an extended dive trip no problem. But then it has the extra HP.


We do not have a Permatrim, we do have trim tabs though. I never thought about putting the trim tabs down, that should help as well. For sure a Yamaha 200 would totally solve this issue! But that would be a pretty drastic solution for a problem of somewhat limited duration!
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hardee



Joined: 30 Oct 2006
Posts: 12632
City/Region: Sequim
State or Province: WA
C-Dory Year: 2005
C-Dory Model: 22 Cruiser
Vessel Name: Sleepy-C
Photos: SleepyC
PostPosted: Mon Jun 19, 2017 9:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
".... I stuffed my bow in a following sea one day and it wasn't the most fun thing to do Shocked - so I am hesitant about adding too much weight too far forward.

Regards, Rob"


Rob, it doesn't take very many of those episodes to learn that lesson. That is why I try to put heavy stuff midships and low. Feeling that bow dig in and turn can be scary for sure.

Harvey
SleepyC Moon

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Avidmagnum12



Joined: 23 Mar 2013
Posts: 668
City/Region: Ocklawaha
State or Province: FL
C-Dory Year: 2011
C-Dory Model: 25 Cruiser
Vessel Name: C-Otter
Photos: C-Otter
PostPosted: Mon Jun 19, 2017 9:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Pat.....the trim tabs will help get you on plane. In combination with the Permatrim you should seldom if ever have a problem getting your 25 up. We were out in some 2 foot waves today and are able to get the bow down enough to keep from pounding and still move along at 20mph or so. Had to use the Permatrim and trim tabs. No..you do not need a 200...but I really recommend a Permatrim. They do wonders on heavy C-Dorys. Keep having fun on your trip....Tom
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starcrafttom



Joined: 07 Nov 2003
Posts: 7878
City/Region: marysville
State or Province: WA
C-Dory Year: 1984
C-Dory Model: 27 Cruiser
Vessel Name: to be decided later
Photos: Susan E
PostPosted: Tue Jun 20, 2017 12:44 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Pat maybe if you stayed on the dock it would plane??? just a idea.
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localboy



Joined: 30 Sep 2006
Posts: 4656
City/Region: Lake Stevens via Honolulu
State or Province: WA
C-Dory Year: 2007
C-Dory Model: 25 Cruiser
Vessel Name: 'Au Kai (Ocean Traveler)
Photos: 'AU KAI
PostPosted: Tue Jun 20, 2017 10:27 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

25's are stern heavy. Fuel, water, batteries, cooler, main engine, kicker, etc, etc, etc...

We try to do the same; move as much forward as realistic. Not always easy and a PIA, but...

We try to keep it under the table and in the Admirals foot space (more mid-ship)...sometimes even in the walkway.

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Two Bears



Joined: 07 Nov 2009
Posts: 296
City/Region: Orofino
State or Province: ID
C-Dory Year: 2006
C-Dory Model: 22 Cruiser
Vessel Name: Two Bears
Photos: Two Bears
PostPosted: Tue Jun 20, 2017 8:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi Pat,
One of the things you mentioned was 7 gallons of water in an "aquatainer." Is that water a backup to the "standard" tank in the 25? If so, dump it. On the whole Loop you will never be more than a few hours from a water source. For the same reason look at your fuel tanks. Consider going "half" full and stopping more often. Only in two sections of the Great Loop will you not pass two or more fuel/ water sources each day. Those are: 1) the Mississippi River section between St Louis & Paducah, KY; and 2) the Big Bend crossing. Even the crossing of Lake Ontario from Oswego, NY to Kingston, ON is only a bit over 50 miles. To have a several day reserve of both water and fuel is unneeded extra weight.

I removed my water tank and put a smaller tank under the V berth in my CD-22. Before doing that I ran 60% perma-trim to make the boat feel "good" on plane. After installing the front tank it only takes 40% to reach the same point. Yes there is a difference between a 22 and a 25 but I think you will be pleased with the result of both lighting the boat and moving the gear.

Chuck

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Orofino, Idaho
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