Clear the air CD ~ CC

[Mark Toland]

Hi everyone

My name is Mark Toland and I am the president of C-Dory Inc., the company that developed the C-Dory line of boats and built them until October of 2000. Boats built by C-Dory Inc. have the DOR prefix to their
serial numbers.

I have been following the discussion on the manufacture of C-Dory boats and feel that too many "rumors" are being circulated so I must speak up and inform the members of this group as to what I sold to The C-Dory Marine Company and what I did not sell them.

When I placed the company up for sale I offered the stock of the company for a specified price. Purchasing the company's stock would have given the buyer ALL assets of the company. Scot Reynolds and his father did not want to buy all assets of the company so they offered a partial assets sale where only some of the C-Dory Inc. assets would be sold at a reduced price. This left the original company still in existence with many assets and few liabilities.

What I sold them was listed on the sales agreement and bill of sale as follows:

"Purchaser hereby agrees to purchase and seller agrees to sell business
fixtures and equipment, (list attached hereto as exhibit 'A' and by
reference
incorporated herein), leasehold improvements, inventory and supplies, trade
name, covenant not to compete, phone and fax numbers, and goodwill of the
business known as C-Dory located at 25028 Pacific Highway South, Kent
Washington 98032" and then added by pen and initialed was the line "Sale includes
all rights to the trade name 'Tomcat.' "

Exhibit "A" showed that only the molds for the following models were sold:

Row boats 10' 12' & 16'
Open skiffs 14' & 17'
14', 16' and 19' Angler, 16' Cruiser, 22' Cruiser, 24' Tomcat

It is the understanding of C-Dory, Inc. that these are the only C-Dory Inc. designs that C-Dory Mariner Inc. has production rights to. Not sold were design rights of any of the other models developed by C-Dory Inc over the years. These remained the property of C-Dory Inc. The only restriction to the use of this property was that C-Dory Inc could not compete within 150 miles of the original factory location. C-Dory Inc could have moved to Spokane and produced the same models purchased by C-Dory Marine Inc. Or it could have sold the design rights to others to produce anywhere.

Over the past five years since the sale to C-Dory Marine Inc. I have sold all of the remaining assets of the original C Dory Inc. company including the design rights to all C-Dory Inc. models not sold to C-Dory Marine, Inc. Some of these assets, including design rights, were purchased by Cape Cruiser Boats.

We honored our non-compete agreement. Other than selling assets and honoring warranties, C-Dory Inc. has had no dealings of any kind in the marine industry during the past five years, nor have any of its stockholders.

Not stockholders in C-Dory Inc were my brother Ben Toland and my father Roy Toland, designers of the C-Dory Inc. line. Like most companies C-Dory Inc used outside help to design new models. All of their designs have common elements that give that salty look, whether they were for me, themselves or others. When I acquired a design from the designers I was not entitled to the look exclusively, just the design of the version I was going to produce. Neither did C-Dory Marine, Inc. purchase any exclusive right to the C-Dory look. It was never mine to sell.

The design that has become known as the 23' Cape Cruiser was designed by Ben Toland. It represents a cumulative effort to convert "user comment" from over 30 years of experience. Ben didn't just say one day this is how it should be designed. The boat design evolved over 20 years until someone wanted to use it. The hull is a variant of the excellent C-Dory Inc. 26' "V" hull design, which was not purchased by C-Dory Marine, Inc.

A major difference between the C-Dory 22' design and the Cape Cruiser 23' design is the way the boat naturally trims out. The C-Dory was designed over 20 years ago before the four stroke motors became available. It was designed to trim naturally with a 250 lb motor and 36 gallons of fuel. Today's most popular motor packages are much heavier and boats with these packages carry a lot more fuel. The 22' was a great hull design and could be updated easily to handle the added weight.

There has been a lot of debate about how to react to the Cape Cruiser which was also designed by Ben Toland. The way I see it you should consider the "designer lineage" of the boat as much as its maker. After all there is already a difference as to whether your boat was built by the original C-Dory Inc. company or by the company that has built them these past five years. A little competition is good and a little variety is even better. Buy the one that suits your tastes and needs and have fun with it.

C-Dory Inc. will be folding its tent soon and will quietly fade away. It's been five years now since I retired from the marine industry and I don't miss the smell of fiberglass at all. If asked I may help out the guys at Cape Cruiser in some small way but they are talented and seasoned professionals that know their business so there would be little I could offer.


Mark Toland

[DaydreamC-26]

Very, Very interesting...and informative. Hmmmmmmmmm...

[gljjr]

Welcome to the site Mark!

[Zelpha]

Mr. Toland, I have the greatest respect for the straight forward manner in which you addressed this subject. An honest and complete presentation to which each individual can react as they feel.
The new boat is beautiful and its design goals make complete sense.
Good luck to you and your family.
Wallace Malone

[Butch]

Mark, as you so eloquently put it, competition brings out the best in competitors and technology. My hat goes off to you and C-Dory Marine along with a sincere thanks to what you all have introduced to the boating industry. I have been ribbed by my coworkers (the real nerds) for really extolling the very positive attributes to the CD 19, 22, and 25. They called them blue collar boats.
No matter what they say, once you get past the glitz and glitter of their small and large block v-8 cruisers, voluminous fuel tanks, and esoteric maintenance it all boils down to "form following function".
My buddy with his CD25 was on the water (not sitting in the slip because of fuel cost) 75% more that the show boats... Form follows function and once you get away from that it is not as enjoyable as it should be.
Butch

[Stuberg]

Hi Mark!

Very interesting. It's always fun to hear the rest of the story. Rumors have a way of getting out of control. Thanks so much for sharing your side of the story and good luck with your future endeavors.

I'm sure you are underestimating the contribution you can make to the industry should you decide to stay involved.



Robert Stuberg

[starcrafttom]

Mark thank you for clearing up how the agreement was strutored and who owned what . I would also like to thank your family for starting a line that ened up giving me my boat the "Susan E". We have used her pretty hard these last ten months by putting 380 hours on her. The Reynolds family at C-dory marine inc. have been a delight to work with as has been our dealer E.Q. marine. Everyone envolved with these fine boats has been great. I test drove the new Cape Cruiser last week and I think it is a great addittion to the boating world. I cant Wait to see the new 26 at the boat show this winter. I hope that when the Cape cruiser startes to appear on the water in the local area that the owners join us for events. Tom Elliott

[Sea Wolf]

Mark- Thanks for all the details! Too bad we didn't have more of these facts up front before all of the speculation. Your contribution to our C-Dory world is greatly appreciated, as are the those of the present owners and the many helpful C-Dory dealerships.

C-Brats- After Mark's post has had a chance to soak in and digest a bit, it is kind of interesting to read the threads regarding the CC over in light of these new details. Gradually, in time, the whole picture puzzle will fit together and we'll all have a better, more unified, and more comfortable understanding of the situation and how we can make the best of it for everyone. Joe.

[New Hampshire Guy]

Sorry, but other than being very interesting, I still don't feel I have the whole picture until I have inputs from all the players. ANY write-up that offers to "Clear the air..." and then points out as fact that the new product is better designed for 4-stroke weight-and-balance (implying the C-Dory is out-of-balance, I guess) loses the credibility it might have gotten from the title. Whether its a family discussion or a business discussion, taking one version and being satisfied seems to be something that will always leave you caught off guard when you get (as that famous radio personality says...) "the REST of the story".
I've read what C-Dory owners think and what at least one Toland thinks. I might wait for another input or two before thinking the story is complete.
I don't have a feel for who is running this new company except it seems they (Ben?) did not run the old company. From what I've read (yea, I'm getting my info here too) everyone was quite impressed because this Cape Cruiser is a TOLAND boat. Now it appears the Toland(s) who ran the C-Dory Inc are not the same ones who are part of this new CC venture.
There is no doubt on the BRAT website that this new product is getting all the credit for being equal to a C-Dory in the reliability and ruggedness catagories when it is, in fact, a new boat with a new company. Product, Service and Support are all touted by customers of any item. This, as with ANY BRAND NEW COMPANY, has proven nothing on these points. This is not a critique, but a fact-of-life for any new brand company and product. The claim for "30 years of improvements" is what makes the blood pressure go up if you are part of the C-Dory Marine team, and you have to hear this from, let's be honest, the competition.
I look forward to hearing about the test drives and I'm sure -in principle and in fact -that competition is a good thing. As a dealer I would love to be able to prove my (C-Dory) product is superior to any Cape Cruiser, but in this case I can't, because there is just not enough Cape Cruiser info (or actual boats) out there. For instance, although I don't know the actual weight of a CC, I did recently hear that the C-Dory I sell is out of balance for 4 strokes.
I hope this is taken in the spirit it is given. I think Sea Wolf/ Joe said it best when he said gradually over time the whole picture will present itself.
I'm willing to wager a beer at the next C-Dory get-together, there will be "...the rest of the story".

Fair winds...
John
Y-Landing

PS Beer IS free at these get-togethers... RIGHT?

[flagold]

John:

Empty Wt. of C-Dory is 1975 lbs and max loaded wt is 4500 lbs. This was from my CD owners manual.
2500+ lb load . . .

The CC I was on (150 engine) had trim tabs . . .

To get a C-Dory economy, draft, etc. you'll still have to buy a C-Dory. I'm not forgetting that on our first thread that when the increased draft of the CC was noted the web-site suddenly listed less.

At the get-go a CD is going to be $10,000+ less to buy -- that's a lot of gasoline and I can have the factory floorboards or have the boat finished out any way I want from there (after all -- it is a utility boat (one you customize to your application) and have a lot of money to cruise.

[Mr. Fisherman]

Well, this sure has been a heated.

First I want to thank Mark for signing up and offering his side of the story.
I am delighted with the boat he and his family designed and built.
I feel he is an authority on the above mentioned issue regarding balance and I really like some of the features of the CC. I doubt I would be able to afford to get one and outfit it the way Sea Lion is set up, but I sure plan to give them a look if I am able to make the Seattle Boat Show.
I would absolutely love to go out for a day on one to see the difference.
This is not an us and them story and I don't think we need to be divided over it. They are different boats but I would like to see us all together at a C-Brat function someday. After all, we are C-BRATS... maybe the new guys will be CC-Brats.

In either case I do not plan on alienating either of these companies. I love my C-Dory and look forward to checking out a Cape Cruiser.

Mark, thanks again for going public and trying to clear the air.

[Stuberg]

Hi John!

Excellent points. If we are going to get the full story, we need someone from the C-Dory Marine, Inc. company to spill the beans. Paul Harvey will not put his name of this version of "The Rest of the Story" until all parties get their post with the C-Brats.



Earth calling Roy Toland. You started this whole thing by designing some really cool boats which means that you are our legendary leader emeritus. Have you left the star ship like Captain Kirk (a.k.a. William Shatner of Boston Legal) to become a lawyer? We're lost in the dessert and need your assistance. What's happening? Mark seems to want to get out of this industry. Didn't you pass on the genes like you were supposed to? It appears that only Ben got the bug?

And Scott Reynolds, what are your thoughts on what's happening? Aren't you and your dad supposed to be leading the charge?

And what about this new company building the Cape Cruiser that looks really cool and claims to be able to do warp 2? Do we have good stats on that bad boy?

Will the best boat please stand up? I just don't know what to buy?



Sorry for the tongue in cheek but we need to have some fun here don't we?

Robert Stuberg
Future C-Cruiser Cape Brat Dory Guy

[Leo Smith]

Hi Mark,
Thanks for presenting what took place with the sale of C-Dory Inc. assets to C-Dory Marine. This should clear up a lot of speculation and misinformation that we have read on these threads. You have probably figured out by now that we are passionate about the boats designed and built by your family and by Scot Reynold's company. In creating a well-designed, well-built, no- nonsense trailerable fishing/cruising boat, I dare say that C-Dory has become a boating icon, just as Airstream is an icon in the rv world.
Best Regards, Leo.

[Catman]

Kudos to Mr. Fisherman. I like his attitude and witty nickname for our eventual Cruiser cousins. CC-Brats. Gimme five, Ray.

[Leo Smith]

Hey Brock,
It is good to hear your virtual voice. Who is this Alexander Flemming guy? Does he own a C-Dory or a Cape Cruiser?
Best Regards, Leo.