State of Florida. report on anchoring & Mooring fields

[BrentB]

that is a good report!

[localboy]

[drbridge]

I have been following along with this thread and there are some very interesting points that have been made.
On the subject of raw sewage being discharged in to ocean and inland waterways, It is a fact that the greater metropolitan area of Victoria BC on Vancouver Island, Canada (population of over 300,000) has been discharging all of their untreated raw sewage in to the strait of Juan DeFuca for ever since anyone can remember and is still doing so to this day. They do have plans to build a treatment plant someday, but who knows how long it will take.
http://www.victoriasewagealliance.org/index_files/FactsVictoriaSewageAlliance.htm

While I am not saying that this is a good thing, in comparison to what we are talking about here it makes you wonder.

[Will-C]

It's pretty amazing these countries worry about boater porta potties and let a whole cities dump all it's crap via straight pipe right into the water. I was reading a cruising guide for Cuba and they don't have boat pump outs there either. They say that your not supposed to discharge in the marina but some do. Just another reason I don't think I'll be going there. I can't even imagine pumping out the turd tank right in the marina. That's down right offensive. That would make for a very funny commercial for pushing an Airhead composting toilet. No wonder I did not see any Orcas up there in B.C. They're probably all are sick with cholera. If urine isn't so bad it sure gets pretty funky if you leave it around in a container for a day or two. Diapers are so gross, and what about diaper rash. I'm done!
D.D.

[Foggy]

We're talking Florida anchoring and mooring fields here - where folks swing on
the hook, swim, maybe fish - not open ocean.

It makes a difference discharging effluent in close quarters where people
congregate opposed to the open sea.

Aye.

[starcrafttom]

So as stated the problem here in the PNW is not really a problem except in harbors that have low flow or the boats never move. Same in Florida but they have less water movement. We have to remember that yesterday here was 13FT tide change in the whole PS and BC coast, and that happens all the time. a small tide change in this area is 6ft. A really big tide change in Florida is ?? what 3 ft maybe?? Which is why the whole " big movement" issue comes up. If it good for 2 sq ft some where it must be the answer for everywhere. I get that but in reality land dumping you waste over out int he change or the straits is not a problem at all. Its a non issue. I have asked BC lodges if I could dump my PP in there systems and told not no but f no, go out in the channel like everyone else.

Glad that some one brought up Victoria so I dont have to but its not just victoria , there are NO city systems that I am aware of. If thats wrong please tell me.

What this law ans those like it should be targeting, I know a very bad word to use as far as the all knowing BGovernement type go, is the floating homeless. There I said it. If these local city and county government could easily condemn, tow, remove or sink the crappy old non functional floating shit holes that are present at every harbor in the PNW and I assume Florida with out the ACLU, go fund me, bleeding heart, Its a life style choice, NON boaters getting involved and making it 1) to expensive and 2) to time consuming to get rid of the BAD APPLES with out effecting the rest of us we would not have to put up with BS laws like this that should TARGET the guilty and leave the rest of us alone.

stepping off horse so it can get off the soap box and walk away from the key board, he hates to type.

[thataway]

There are thousands of pages of prelude, including several law suits and depositions which are behind some of the report the FFWC wrote.

Tom is correct, that much of the whole scenario is due to "homeless" boaters. Some are very responsible. Some are not. This is one reason that most of the rules include proving twice a year that the boat can move under its own power.

Certainly for those who live on the semi derelict boats will not be going to pump out stations, or using porti potty--they dump sewage into the bay. But it may not even be boaters. For example, all of a sudden we had a coliform spike in the bayou behind our home. A person bought a lot, and illegally put a travel trailer on the lot, claiming he was about to build a house about 18 months ago. The trailer has no sewage hook up of any sort....guess where that sewage goes?

Sewage issues along waterfront--especially in Florida--is often related to older septic tanks, and sand where the sewage material perks directly into the water.

Tom is correct--except a storm even, 2 feet is a high tidal change, often it is less than a foot--and only once a day...

I only mentioned the sewage issue because it was strange to put it in a report on mooring fields. (experimental at that). The issue was more that some homeowners did not want tacky boats (even those well kept, or those which only anchored for one night) anchoring in front of their homes. If you read the report, the home owners were in effect some ways chastised. Also if 'home rule" was to be allowed, FFWC suggested that it not be at the city level, but be a county enforcement issue.

You take away anchoring rights in one area--eventually it will impact other areas. Many reports of problems in the Carolinas, got into this report--because they have the same "homeless" boaters there...

What was paradoxical to me, is that one of the most highly regulated mooring areas: Marathon, has continued to allow one area to have a number of real derelict boats, yet a C Dory, fitted with proper holding tanks, was not allowed to anchor in an area way out of the mooring field area...

[TyBoo]

I don't have much to contribute to this discussion/argument. I always just follow the rules and use the many pump out docks on the river and do not pump overboard unless well beyond the three mile outside line. I even keep a padlock on the y-valve blocking the overboard pump as directed by the CG during an inspection a few years back.

I have only one time found a pump out station on the Columbia River that was out of order and it was promptly repaired. This past summer while using the dock at my marina I was interviewed by a student from Oregon State University doing inspections on stations in the area. She said the state is pretty adamant about requiring the pump outs to be in good shape.

I am personally in favor of these rules being the way they are in this part of the country and appreciate their intent and enforcement.

I also want to mention that I am pretty much in agreement with everything Foggy has said in this thread. I figure since I have been quick to point out past disagreements I owe it to him to compliment his reliance on the advice from his grandparents in this matter.

Aye.

[Larry Patrick]

Remember visiting boat house row in the keys years ago. Reading this reminded me of it. They need to keep all pump outs open and add more. Unreal if you weren't allowed to dump porta potties at home because you needed a receipt.

[kennharriet]

I am intrigued by the marine composting toilets. I don't know much about them other than it sounds like they are a fixed installation that is not practical for a CD 22'. Anyone know of an option for a composting porta-potty that would work on a 22'. The convenience of not haveing to empty overboard or in a marine dump station would be worth some expense.

[thataway]

TheC Head is the closest thing to a portable composting toilet. It is 18" high, so may or may not fit in the space. I believe all of the composting systems do require ventilation. In this unit's case, one might be able to have some type of mushroom vent, and use the flexible tubing provided.

In some counties in Fl there is requirement to have pump out facilities at each slip at homes and slips for "live a boards" who are docked there. Most houseboats are so designed which are in the communities.

There is another type of MSD which has not been mentioned, and that is the flow thru--Type one. This is legal in most areas, except "no discharge zones"--the only ones in Florida are city Key West, Destin Harbor and Florida Keys National Marine sanctuary. These treatment centers add ionized chlorine (from salt water) to the waste and macerate, then discharge. Now those who oppose pure urine, give it some thought...it is OK to put out the urine, fecal contact, and a bit of chlorine added it to pump this out in 99% of the waters of the US...!!! So is this mixture really better than plain urine?

SeeEPA no discharge zones.

While we are at it, we probably need to eliminate swimming in the waters. Consider the hundreds of species of bacteria, fungi, and numbers in the many thousands individual units over the average 1.8 sq meters of the average adult's body surface area...

[Foggy]

TyBoo, kudos not necessary as my skin is thick. But, thanks. I normally don't
preach but Grandma's toilet training won't let some of this stuff pass.

In my next life I may turn maverick, ignore the rules, disregard everyones
welfare, not care about anyone but me, dump anything anywhere....
You get the picture; not pretty. Why? Just for balance.

Oh, then my boat name will be "Bow Movement".

Aye.

[BrentB]

I didn't see funding and grants along with a gaggle of regulators and veto players - each with the power to block or to delay, and each with geographic location concerns


ha ha ha working too long as state governmental employee

[journey on]

If I remember right, this problem started when Florida built mega-mansions along the ICW and the adjoining harbours. The very rich didn't like boaters anchoring within their sight as we found out in Naples. And being rich, they got the local, county and state governments to listen, and that lead to prohibiting anchoring in front of those places.

Now the Fedral gov't claims a "Federal Constitutional Authority over Navigable Waters" so you can see where that lead: conflict between the Federal govt and the rich.

This report seems reasonable and addresses many pertinent issues: abandoned or other boats, discharge, etc, etc. It doesn't directly address the problem of anchoring for a day or week in front of the wealthy homes but is an effort to bound the problem.

I hope it does well for Florida, home of the floating snowbird.

A good reference as to what is state and federal is contained in Anchoring Away, Navigation in Florida . Note that the USA retains rights to navigation, others are for the state to regulate.

Boris

[journey on]

As Casey posted elsewhere, the Boat US magazine has an article on what is happening in Florida regarding anchoring: the causes of the problem and searching for a solution. Good and somewhat unbiased review of the Flordia problem.

One has to be a Boat US member but here it is in .pdf: Anchoring in Florida.

Boris