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Composting toilets vs. regulations
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ssobol



Joined: 27 Oct 2012
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City/Region: SW Michigan
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Vessel Name: SoBELLE
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 19, 2016 10:40 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

There is a whole bunch of stuff that may be present in human urine. Sterile is something that it is not. It also can include excess drugs, vitamins, and minerals excreted from the body. Everything else that comes out of the human body is treated as a bio-hazard. It defies logic to think that urine is somehow exempt.

Further, like some other shoreline cities Victoria, BC dumped the city sewage pretty much untreated into the Juan de Fuca Straight for a very long time. Only relatively recently did the environmentalists get so wound up that they forced the city to built a massive sewage treatment facility.

However, deep dumping of sewage allows it to be "processed" naturally before it reaches the surface/shore. The effect of dumping a porta-potti over the side in/near a popular spot is much different.
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journey on



Joined: 03 Mar 2005
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City/Region: Valley Centre
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 19, 2016 11:30 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

BC is not interested in pumping out your head and disposing of its contents safely. To be specific, we were at Ganges several years ago and traveling with an ecologicaly minded couple. They insisted that we both pump our boat's heads. So we proceeded to the pump-out station, had to find the proper authority, waited, waited, waited, paid the fee, they unlocked the pump, we pumped. Lesson learned: the pump-out station may be there but Canadians are discouraging its use.

Contrast that with our visit to San Francisco Bay where every gas dock has its own pump-out, free, easily accessible and self- service.

So in each case we followed what seemed the local practice.

And to slow down the Canadian response, we absolutely loved cruising in Canada, especially BC.

Boris
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hardee



Joined: 30 Oct 2006
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City/Region: Sequim
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 19, 2016 12:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I saw some of the same when traveling in BC, (and I love it up there), but I believe the pump outs had fees, and you had to have a marina staff available, and I witnessed on several occasions, frustrated folks feigning patience through that process.

At one point, a long ways from a pump out, (I was in Rough Bay, past Kenneth Passage on MacKinzie Inlet) when a 40 something came into the bay, passed me and went on to the end of the bay. They were nice enough to give me a couple of gallons of drinking water, and were planning to stay for a couple of days. Later as I was pout rowing in the inflatable I went by with a treat and "thank you" for the water, when I learned they were having "Head trouble". Apparently, the overboard discharge pump had quit, and the tank was full. I noticed they had a couple of round plastic 5 gallon buckets up top, and offered that I was using a "bag and bucket" system and had plenty of bags if they wanted to try that until they got back to where they could get fixed.

On board were 3 teenage girls, their Mom, an adolescent brother, and the boat owners Grandma and Grandpa. They were absolutely shocked and abhorrent that such a system could be used, and instead chose to leave the anchorage at 8PM and run 40 miles to Port Hardy for service. That was going to be a 4-6 hour trip, making a fair portion an after dark run.

I was surprised and ticked off that they were going to dump 100 gallons of "stuff (sewage) into Rough Bay, which is a very closed bay with little tidal flushing. Funny part, the had 3 crab traps set out around their boat. Shocked Disgust

If I had room, I would have an "AirHead System", and think it is about the best system available.

Harvey
SleepyC Moon


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Foggy



Joined: 01 Aug 2013
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 19, 2016 1:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I see freighters from all over the world in the Great Lakes. Never have I seen
a freighter at a marina pump out dock. Nor have I ever heard of a freighter
having, or being required to have, a locked "Y" valve to assure no waste is pumped
in our treasured Great Lakes waters.

Worse yet, shoreside sewage waste facilities, and/or water treatment plants, up
river from our Lakes often spill over after heavy rains dumping tons of raw
sewage into our Lakes. One specifically I have witnessed many times is the
Grand River and its spills - all the way from Lansing and Grand Rapids - into
Lake Michigan at Grand Haven. Local State Park beaches are then closed to
swimming as the nauseating brown sludge effluent enters the lake at the mouth
mixing with the clear blue unsalted water which can be seen for miles.

These pollution sources are several orders of magnitude greater than our
cumulative recreational boaters could ever be.

Yet we, the "little guys", are nit picked for our small (by comparison) recreational
MSD while the "big boys" seemingly have carte blanche to dump their chit willy
nilly.

Aye.
Grandpa used to say, "When you've had enough, call Dr Kavorkian."

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Marco Flamingo



Joined: 09 Jul 2015
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 19, 2016 2:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

When I worked on a NOAA research vessel, we would detour into a discharge zone (a certain number of miles offshore) and everything would go overboard. This included plastic trash bags of waste. And oily bilge water. I still remember stuff floating in a miles-long trail behind the ship with the albatross landing to inspect for possible food. And we were supposedly the good guys.

Once again I think that the only solution to pollution is population.

Mark
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thataway



Joined: 02 Nov 2003
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 19, 2016 3:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Foggy: MARPOL has relatively stringent regulations about sewage discharge. I believe that you will find that the vast majority of these commercial ships will have holding tanks and / or sewage treatment plants aboard.
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Larry H



Joined: 02 Nov 2003
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 19, 2016 4:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The problem in BC waters is that many places do not have the sewage systems to deal with the pumped-out sewage. A lot of small towns still have a long pipe that goes out into the water to discharge the towns sewage with no or minimal treatment.

A small marina on an island will only have a local septic tank and drain field for their own toilets. They cannot afford to install a pump out for the summer boats. Also, any chemicals that have been put into the holding tanks could kill the bacteria in the septic tank and stop its working.

If there are no pump-outs available, the official British Columbia instructions are to pump (dump) your holding tank in the middle of large salt water channels, while traveling at cruising speed. This dilutes the sewage in a large volume of water. This does NOT apply when in cities that have pump-outs. No dumping is allowed in marinas, 'no discharge zones' or small bays, or near shellfish beaches.

Remember that the more remote parts of BC only have tourist boats in the two or three months of summer. Except for large cities, boater sewage is not a big problem in BC.

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Larry H

A C-Brat since Nov 1, 2003
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Foggy



Joined: 01 Aug 2013
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City/Region: Traverse City; Northern Lake Michigan
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 19, 2016 4:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I used to do some ocean sailing, fishing as we sailed.
When I thought I had hooked a huge (HUUGE) lunker,
it turned out to be a barnacle encrusted 8 x 10 carpet.
Amazed at the amount of flotsam all across the Atlantic.
The big concern was hitting a large container that had fallen
off a ship (had reports of same).
Even space in near earth orbits is full of crap, they say.

Aye.
PS: Grandpa used to say, "We have seen the enemy. It is us."

PS2: Bob, 5:7 odds MARPOL hasn't been around very long; a lot
of dumping before and in spite of.
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thataway



Joined: 02 Nov 2003
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 19, 2016 5:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

"
Quote:
("MARPOL" is short for marine pollution and 73/78 short for the years 1973 and 1978.) MARPOL 73/78 is one of the most important international marine environmental conventions."


So, no MARPOL has only been around for slightly over 40 years.....

But It has been a huge step in stopping some of the pollution.

Ships really causing major pollution has only been around about 100 years at the most...Titanic 1912! Weren't a lot of steamers before then polluting the oceans.

Although we have seen a lot of debris in the ocean--my fishing luck has been far better--on the other hand, I have been on a boat with an encounter with a container...
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Foggy



Joined: 01 Aug 2013
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City/Region: Traverse City; Northern Lake Michigan
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 19, 2016 7:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks.
I'll change my odds.

Aye.
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