Setting my anchor troubles

[South of Heaven]

I'm having a problem setting my anchor. I have a 16.5 lb plow style anchor and 25 feet of chain w/ 200 ft of rode (these measurements were from the previous owner, I never measured it).

So, the other day I was in maybe 10 feet of water or so. I dropped the anchor down until I thought it hit the seafloor and then let out about 20 feet or more of line. I then tied it off and went in reverse. Well, long story short I kept going in reverse for like 100 feet! I'm dragging the anchor...Why won't it set?

I'm aware that you're supposed to put out 6 times the depth of the water but I wasn't trying to setup anchorage overnight. I just wanted to test the anchor. Shouldn't 30 +feet of chain and line set me in 10 feet of water? The seafloor is weedy and sandy, no rocks.

What are most 25's using for their main anchor? Should I possibly upgrade my anchor or switch to a different style?

I also have a 8lb Danforth onboard for emergency's/backup.

[hardee]

If you are in 10 feet of water and put out 20 feet more, you don't have enough scope. You're forgetting that you have about 4-5 feet of distance from the water surface to the bow. so you really only have about a a 1:1.5 scope. You need to get the point of the anchor and the shaft laying on the bottom when you are backing down on the anchor. If you are backing slowly, maybe a 1:3 might work, but in a weedy bottom, I wouldn't expect a good hook up with less than a 1:5. Go back and try it again with 60 feet of chain out and you may have a different result.

And another thing, That "Plow anchor". Remember that a plow is designed to lift the substrate, lighten it and move through it. Yeah, I know the Delta has been around for a long time, but for this "old farm boy" the physics and logic of the "plow" never jibbed well for a rock solid sleep system. That is why I converted to a "spade".

Harvey
SleepyC

[ghone]

Ditto what Harvey said
Plus I'd move that anchor to a spare use. Way to small for you.
I run a 22 lb claw by Lewmar with 45 ft chain and 225 ft rode on a 22 and feel it's perfect, Many night's I'm anchored on chain
In our crowded anchorages I don't worry even at a 2-1 scope. Never more than 3 to one normally
We've sat thru 40 gusting 50 knots verified, in 20 ft deep with 75' out and not budged
One thing I like is not back down initially, figure depth plus height to roller times 2 or 3 and let that out, just coast back slowly in reverse and lay the gear out, snub it off and let everything sit never an issue unless I'm on rock so I move, in a bit add rode for expected tide change and be happy, at dark flip on the anchor light and snooze
If the owner picked the size of anchor out of a table in a marine store catalog, I assert it will be too small by at least one perhaps 3 sizes. If I had a 25 she'd run a 33lb Claw with 50 ft chain and 250 ft rode, she'll stay put mate. : George

[Kushtaka]

more rode. In 10' of water your rig will probably need about 55' of rode out if the bottom isn't ideal, and sand/grass is not the best holding.

Doubling the chain might make your present anchor work a lot better. Otherwise I'd get myself a heavier anchor. I'm not sure about the 22lb lewmar claw, but the Delta Fast Set (a lewmar anchor, maybe the same thing?) in that size would be a good one. A true Danforth might work well too, they hold well on a variety of bottoms. Finally, a Fortress anchor is about as much holding per pound as you can get. a 16lb fortress would hold where your current 16 lb anchor will not.

Finally, I don't always power down on my anchor to set it. Especially on loose mud, sand bottoms I'll let the boat's drift come to a stop and once the anchor has grabbed on it's own, I'll back down a bit to set it, but I won't try to get the anchor set initially under power. That can cause the anchor to skip across the substrate.

[South of Heaven]

Whattya guys think about this?? Seems like a good deal.

https://boston.craigslist.org/nos/bpo/5759103239.html

[hardee]

A CQR is a good and well respected anchor. You need more chain that the 18 feet there. The 9/16 might work in your windlass, that you would have to check on.

Personally, the CQR is the same anchor as a Delta plow, except for the hinged shaft. They have been used well on cruising sailboats all over the world, but it is still a plow, the same physics as the farm plow. I'd be curious where it came from, and why it isn't hanging on a boat. Hummmmm, that owner just changed to a Vulcan or Rocna Why would I want his second best. An anchor is not boat jewelry, even if it is stainless or chromed. An anchor is insurance. No way around that. Not a place to skimp.

Best in your decisions.

Harvey
SleepyC

[South of Heaven]

Thanks everyone. Well, since the 2016 season in New England is winding the last corner I'll probably wait until over the winter to make my decision anyway. Lots of time to research and make a choice. The problem is that it seems that there's several good options out there.

[starcrafttom]

I would not go buy anything new yet. Not until you have tried to use your current equipment correctly. More rode out the better. I cant think of a reason you would not let out a 100ft everytime. Its just a 100 ft and you lose 5ft of that to the water and around ( JUST THROWING OUT A GUESS) another 10 in scope. So a 85 ft swing from center is nothing. I let out a 100 ft in any thing up to 20ft on my 22 which had 30 ft of chain. In the 27 I have 100ft of large chain. I just drop all of it and then back up real slow. never drag.

[MOOSE]

Depending upon the density of weedy bottom, that could be part of your problem as well. We have a delightful, protected anchorage on NW Lake Superior that we like to use. The water is 11-13' deep, but the bottom is covered in dense weeds that make it almost impossible to get a good anchor set. We have often dragged in the night, waking up very close to the rocky shores in morning.

[tsturm]

[South of Heaven]

[hardee]

[tsturm]

[quote

Yup, Ill let out more and try my current setup again. But it still seems like a 16.5lber is still small for a 25, right?[/quote]


In my opinion that is not enough anchor. I used to do just fine with 22# & 30' of chain. I added the 70' of chain so I could overnight in 10-20 feet of water on the chain only.
Have fun!!

[thataway]

Yes, as all of the others have said, in 10 feet of water, you need 15 x 7 to set reliably: Or about 100 feet of rode and chain.

The 16.5 is light for a C Dory 25. I used a genuine CQR (60 to 75#) to anchor my cruising sailboats. The rule of thumb for CQR (genuine) was that you needed at least 35# to get it to set. They are notoriously bad in grass. Best for grass is the old fisherman, or a Northill pattern. (The latter is one of the most common used anchors by fisherman thru the world.)

I stres "Genuine" because the copy of the CQR does not work as well by any means. The CQR is a older generation anchor--and today one is far better off picking one of the modern anchors--such as Manson Supreme or Ronca. I happen to be using a 10# "Boss" for an experiment, and it has worked very well--better than a Delta "Fast set" For your boat I would suggest one of two anchors, as the primary bow anchor, either the Manson Supreme in 25# or a Supermax (Probably the 22 would be OK--but the 33 is recommended for your size of boat.

Don't go "cheap" on anchors. There are many copies and variations of the common anchors. The only Danforth to buy is the High Test. Not the standard or the "hooker" etc The Fortress are copies of the original Danforth HT, and have the "T" shaped inner edge of the flukes and sharp blades of the flukes. This is what makes the difference.

You trust your life on an anchor in an emergency--and will pay accordingly.

If you have a windlass, then be sure that you have chain calibrated for that windlass. A 25 should have a windlass--every for a young guy like the OP. Must of the windlass fir the C Dory use High Test or G 4 1/4" chain. Most rodes are 1/2" 3 strand or 8 plait. The 8 plait will store in half the space of the 3 strand. I happen to carry 300' of 1/2" 8 plait and 50 feet of 1/4" HT chain in the C Dory22. You should have equal to that in the 25--you don't need larger rode until you are up to the 30 foot + range.

[Chester]

There is a fella with an epic anchor test thread with videos over at Sailing Anarchy.
http://forums.sailinganarchy.com/index.php?showtopic=169269&page=1

He has posted a compilation of his excellent videos that are very informative.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l59f-OjWoq0