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C-Dawg



Joined: 31 Aug 2007
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 26, 2015 1:00 am    Post subject: Bad stuff in BC Reply with quote

Whale watching boat sinks off Canadian coast

I'm interested in knowing the exact cause of the sinking.

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Sea Wolf



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PostPosted: Mon Oct 26, 2015 1:16 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

A 9.8 to 13 feet sea (swell) isn't much for a 65 foot boat if they're spaced a ways apart, but if a steep wave in shallow water were to drop the boat from 10-13 feet onto a rock quickly, anything could happen, IMHO.

Too bad it happened. Hope most everyone else is OK.

Joe. Teeth Thumbs Up

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hardee



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PostPosted: Mon Oct 26, 2015 3:03 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I just saw this on the news. 5 dead so far. Search called off for tonight. Whale watch boat out of Tofino. Sad to see this, for any reason.

Harvey
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Sunbeam



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PostPosted: Mon Oct 26, 2015 4:03 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

A gut-wrenching photo:


"This photograph of the MV Leviathan II was shot by Albert Titian as Ahousaht First Nation boats scrambled to help those forced into the water as the ship sank. (Albert Titian/Facebook) "

From this news article, which has more information and photos of the vessel in better times:

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/british-columbia/tour-vessel-sinks-off-tofino-with-fatalities-1.3288191
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Marco Flamingo



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PostPosted: Mon Oct 26, 2015 9:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The photo of the vessel upright is also a little troubling. "Seaworthy" isn't the first thing that comes to mind when looking at the Leviathan II. Everybody runs to one side to look at something, the boat takes a wave broadside, and it flops over. I'm not saying that's what happened, it's just that the concept of a sight-seeing boat operating in the graveyard of the Pacific bothers me a little.

Mark
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thataway



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PostPosted: Mon Oct 26, 2015 10:25 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

In tragedies we should wait until all studies by the responsible organization (I believe in this case Transport Canada) are in, and the reports are issued, before coming to any conclusion.

Looking at the videos the seas were not unusual, in that area. These whale watching boats go out frequently.

I am sure some of our Canadian brethren can tell us if this vessel was subject to stability tests (both by naval architect and real time testing, as in the US,) but I suspect that this vessel was. In the US, the average passenger weight was changed from 150 to 175 lbs after the capsize of a passenger vessel a few years back. However, to say that a capsize was the cause of this tragedy is a bit premature, unless someone has concrete evidence that is what happened.

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AstoriaDave



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PostPosted: Mon Oct 26, 2015 10:53 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Those whale watch skippers have a lot of hours operating off Tofino, all westhers and conditions. I'll wait for something definitive before commenting.

I am impressed that 21 folks were whisked from the water and are safe. In a train wreck situation like that, it had to be tough to find and rescue the folks in the water. The Ahousat village is about 4 or 5 miles from the sinking site, allowing for a quick response by the natives.

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rogerbum



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PostPosted: Mon Oct 26, 2015 11:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

All reports from the area and the videos seem to show relatively calm (but large seas). Fairly long period, low winds. The boat capsized near Plover reefs just west of Vargas Island. That's a fairly large and shallow reef system with many parts of it above water. Sea lions congregate in the area on the rocks and it is likely that the boat was in the area to look at sea lions. One local fishing guide who participated in the rescue speculates that the boat got too close to the reef. That boat would have been required to have stability testing done (even small guide boats must meet stability requirements in BC).
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localboy



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PostPosted: Mon Oct 26, 2015 1:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

http://mynorthwest.com/17/2834009/5-dead-after-whale-watching-boat-sinks-off-Vancouver-Island
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thataway



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PostPosted: Mon Oct 26, 2015 2:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

We have to remember that in all boats, C Dory included, that once the boat takes on water, all of the stability curves, and past experience of stability is gone. If the vessel is in shallow water, she will be inspected, and if no penetration of the hull, or failure of sea cocks etc, most likely she will have new stability tests done. One always hopes that lessons are learned from a tragedy, so they are not repeated.
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C-Val



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PostPosted: Tue Oct 27, 2015 12:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I also have been following this story so close as I used to work in the area and know it fairly well. I just have a sick feeling inside thinking about it
What amazes me is how fast things can happen on the water !
How often do you hear "there just was no time..."

My son just got accepted into the local coast guard volunteer unit
We must do everything we can to prevent trajedies like this before they happen.

All praise to the First Nations people and everyone who assisted in the rescue
Prayers to those families who have suffered loss

David and Val

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RobLL



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PostPosted: Tue Oct 27, 2015 11:03 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Just a few points of interest:

It was an old fashion flare that alerted fishermen to come to the rescue. (lessen, LED lights may not have gone high enough to be seen, have a high shooting flare)

One of the rescued persons reports a sudden wave swamped the boat. (eye witnesses reports are very important but often not complete, why was the boat vulnerable to sudden swamping?)

One of the company's smaller boat was swamped and two persons died from a rogue wave several years ago. ( interesting, this boat was much larger, and assumptions are that it should not have suddenly swamped)

Because this was a larger boat (65 feet), people did not have to wear life jackets. (is this really a good idea, 65 feet is large, but not all that large )
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Lost Petrel



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PostPosted: Tue Oct 27, 2015 11:12 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

A few things I read this morning.

Company owner stated that the boat did not have time to call a MAYDAY only to shoot off flares.

Rescuers report engine still running when bow up bobbing in the water.

LIfejackets (they had plenty onboard) are not suggested when inside a cabin as it makes it hard to extricate in a flooded condition.

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thataway



Joined: 02 Nov 2003
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 27, 2015 4:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Lost Petrel wrote:

Company owner stated that the boat did not have time to call a MAYDAY only to shoot off flares.

Rescuers report engine still running when bow up bobbing in the water.

LIfejackets (they had plenty onboard) are not suggested when inside a cabin as it makes it hard to extricate in a flooded condition.


I question #1, especially with A DSC radio--and the vessel should have had DSC. All you have to do, is flip a piece of plastic, and hit the red button---less time and effort than to locate flares, and step outside of the wheel house. Every skipper should have a plan for each emergency. When we had multiple guests aboard for variable lengths of time, in various parts of the world, we had a set of laminated "emergency action" sheets by the companionway. Each new guest was to read these. An EPRIB was by the companionway, and a second also packed in the inflatable. A portable VHF was by the companionway, as well as a couple of good sharp knives. Even in the days before DSC it only took a few seconds to hit the mike on channel 16 (reason one radio should be on channel 16 at all times, and dual radios should be the norm). "Mayday, Mayday, Mayday, vessel XXXX, position atXXXX" Another person should be getting the flares, which should be in a handy place--in our case right by the EPRIB.

How would the diesel engine get air when the bow was the only part above water? Only explanation would be the engine in the forepeak--with a very long drive shaft, or hydraulic drive system. Although many diesels will run under water, others now have complicated electronics, and will not function if under water. Other issues concern a fuel on/ off solenoid, which may short out under salt water.
The skipper should always tell passengers where the life jackets are located, some one show hot to put them on.

Again--we have to wait on Transport Canada's Evaluation before we have answers.

Prevention==good question. Don't take risks. I have been on overcrowded ferry's in 3rd world countries , where I got on the top deck and put the life jacket on--the cockpit was taking on water, and the boat was less than stable. After an experience like that I can see how these passenger vessels take on water, and sink. Fortunately that ferry boat made it--but there would have been many lives lost if the boat had gone down--people could not get out of the cabin because of the crowding, and panic!
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rogerbum



Joined: 21 Nov 2004
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 27, 2015 5:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

thataway wrote:
Lost Petrel wrote:

Company owner stated that the boat did not have time to call a MAYDAY only to shoot off flares.

Rescuers report engine still running when bow up bobbing in the water.

LIfejackets (they had plenty onboard) are not suggested when inside a cabin as it makes it hard to extricate in a flooded condition.


I question #1, especially with A DSC radio--and the vessel should have had DSC. All you have to do, is flip a piece of plastic, and hit the red button---less time and effort than to locate flares, and step outside of the wheel house. Every skipper should have a plan for each emergency. When we had multiple guests aboard for variable lengths of time, in various parts of the world, we had a set of laminated "emergency action" sheets by the companionway. Each new guest was to read these. An EPRIB was by the companionway, and a second also packed in the inflatable. A portable VHF was by the companionway, as well as a couple of good sharp knives. Even in the days before DSC it only took a few seconds to hit the mike on channel 16 (reason one radio should be on channel 16 at all times, and dual radios should be the norm). "Mayday, Mayday, Mayday, vessel XXXX, position atXXXX" Another person should be getting the flares, which should be in a handy place--in our case right by the EPRIB.

I had the same thoughts but I have to wonder if DSC would be that useful in a sudden roll that would throw the captain around and perhaps wind up with the antennas in the water. If a roll occurs quickly, the fixed mount DSC radio will likely not be that useful. A well placed ditch bag (or more than one on a boat this size) with a handheld DSC radio would likely be the better plan in what appears to be a freak event.
thataway wrote:

How would the diesel engine get air when the bow was the only part above water? Only explanation would be the engine in the forepeak--with a very long drive shaft, or hydraulic drive system. Although many diesels will run under water, others now have complicated electronics, and will not function if under water. Other issues concern a fuel on/ off solenoid, which may short out under salt water. The skipper should always tell passengers where the life jackets are located, some one show hot to put them on.

I had the same question and haven't yet found anything that says the engine was still running. I have heard others on a BC fishing web board indicate that the transmission had failed but again this is (to my knowledge) unconfirmed rumor.

thataway wrote:


Again--we have to wait on Transport Canada's Evaluation before we have answers.

<stuff clipped>

Yep - I'll be interested in reading their report.
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