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09/19 - 10/01 - Lake Powell 2015
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jkidd



Joined: 23 Oct 2006
Posts: 1609
City/Region: Northern, Utah
State or Province: UT
C-Dory Year: 2007
C-Dory Model: 22 Cruiser
Vessel Name: Voyager
Photos: Voyager (JK)
PostPosted: Thu Sep 24, 2015 12:05 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

A ride through Secret Canyon in the Mokai with Jay in the front.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gb_ySbSq2gM&feature=youtu.be

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Jody Kidd
KE7WNG
Northern, Utah

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Discovery



Joined: 08 Dec 2003
Posts: 1239
City/Region: LOA, UTAH
State or Province: UT
C-Dory Year: 2006
C-Dory Model: 255 Tomcat
Vessel Name: Discovery
Photos: Discovery
PostPosted: Thu Sep 24, 2015 10:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote





A couple of shots of the Medivac at Oak Canyon. The Ranger and the Air Crew were true professionals.

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Brent and Dixie,
1984 22' Classic sold 2003
2003 24' TomCat sold 2005
2006 TC255 Discovery Sold 2020
2006 CD 22' Angler Sold 2014
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hardee



Joined: 30 Oct 2006
Posts: 12632
City/Region: Sequim
State or Province: WA
C-Dory Year: 2005
C-Dory Model: 22 Cruiser
Vessel Name: Sleepy-C
Photos: SleepyC
PostPosted: Thu Sep 24, 2015 2:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

jkidd wrote:
A ride through Secret Canyon in the Mokai with Jay in the front.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gb_ySbSq2gM&feature=youtu.be


Nice. Thanks for sharing the ride.

Hope John is doing OK now. Have to be thankful for the modern medical services.

Harvey
SleepyC Moon


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Wandering Sagebrush



Joined: 21 Jan 2005
Posts: 2768
City/Region: Northeast Oregon
State or Province: OR
C-Dory Year: 2005
C-Dory Model: 22 Cruiser
Vessel Name: Constant Craving
Photos: Constant Craving
PostPosted: Sat Sep 26, 2015 3:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Off the lake yesterday, wandering home starting tomorrow.

More on the Medivac of John. In addition to wonderful work by Ranger Eden Wynd of the NPS, great kudos to Dr Bob for a timely intervention, and appropriate call for John's evacuation to the regional medical center in Flagstaff.

I will write up a trip report once home, but I'll ask in advance that Eden be given highest kudos to the NPS chain of command, and to our elected officials.

Email addresses to follow once home.

Other than John's illness, it was a great trip! Good to see old friends and meet new!

Steve

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Wandering Sagebrush



Joined: 21 Jan 2005
Posts: 2768
City/Region: Northeast Oregon
State or Province: OR
C-Dory Year: 2005
C-Dory Model: 22 Cruiser
Vessel Name: Constant Craving
Photos: Constant Craving
PostPosted: Sat Sep 26, 2015 4:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Eden's email: eden_Wynd@nps.gov

His Supervisor: Shawn_mcnally@nps.gov

GCNRA Superintendent: todd_Brindle@nps.gov


Please send our thanks to Eden's Mgmt!! And to your elected officials to support the NPS.
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Lost Petrel



Joined: 10 Aug 2014
Posts: 138
City/Region: Potter Valley
State or Province: CA
C-Dory Year: 2007
C-Dory Model: 25 Cruiser
Vessel Name: Wild Blue
Photos: Wild Blue
PostPosted: Sat Sep 26, 2015 10:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

We just got back home after pulling out a little earlier than I thought we would. We had planned to pull out Monday after the weekend mayhem at the Wahweap ramp. But yesterday morning the pee stream from the motor was so weak when we left Dungeon Canyon to head downstream I decided it would be prudent to get down and out ASAP. I had been noticing a decrease two days prior after being up in the muddy water at the head of the Escalante and am assuming a correlation. The engine never heated up on the way back, so I don't know whether it is just a plugged pee hole or worn impeller.

I will be posting a trip report with some photos in a few days, but I just wanted to say right away what a great , friendly and helpful bunch of C-Brats were at the Lake Powell gathering. Mary and I felt so welcomed and had a great time.

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Tim

http://lostpetrel.blogspot.com/
Other boats;
Cape Dory Typhoon
Pearson Ariel
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Molly Brown



Joined: 02 Nov 2003
Posts: 404
City/Region: Punta Gorda
State or Province: FL
C-Dory Year: 2003
C-Dory Model: 24 Tomcat
Vessel Name: MOLLY BROWN
Photos: Molly Brown
PostPosted: Sun Sep 27, 2015 9:46 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

In relation to your pee....next time you run your engine take a thin wire and poke it up the pee hole. It will clear out and resume it's normal flow. The fact that your engine did not heat up indicates your cooling system is not the problem. That pee stream is just an indication that the water pump is pumping but most times low flow is an obstruction after the water pump on the branch to the pee hole. It is not an indicator of how much water is flowing thru the cooling passages of the engine. This type of event is usually related to running in shallow areas. We always carry a short piece of wire ever since this happened to us 15 years ago during a week long trip.

One of my favorite boating stories is about this. When we noticed almost no flow we went to the nearest ramp, raised the motor up and was I standing in the water checking the intake screens and thinking how in the world I was going to replace the pump impeller with the limited tools I had on board. I'd noticed an old man watching me and after a bit he hollers at me..."what you need is a wiaaarre". What's that you say? A "wiaaarre" he says! Uhh.....A "wiaare" and points to an overhead electric line. Oh, you mean WIRE!! Had a pipe cleaner on board, stuck it up the pee hole and all was well. Spent another 5 days on the water trouble free.

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Starting the Great American Loop 03/2024
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JamesTXSD



Joined: 01 Mar 2005
Posts: 7444
City/Region: from island boy to desert dweller
State or Province: AZ
C-Dory Year: 2007
C-Dory Model: 25 Cruiser
Vessel Name: "Wild Blue" (sold 9/14)
Photos: Wild Blue
PostPosted: Sun Sep 27, 2015 10:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi Tim,

Just a heads up that I replaced the impeller in late May of last year. Not a lot of hours on the boat since then, so it should be in good shape. Sorry to hear you departed Powell earlier than you intended, but hope you had plenty of time there to enjoy that great area.

Best wishes,
Jim
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Lost Petrel



Joined: 10 Aug 2014
Posts: 138
City/Region: Potter Valley
State or Province: CA
C-Dory Year: 2007
C-Dory Model: 25 Cruiser
Vessel Name: Wild Blue
Photos: Wild Blue
PostPosted: Sun Sep 27, 2015 11:13 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi Jim,

Yes I had remembered that the impeller had been replaced last year, and hopefully all it is the pee hole plugged. But we were at the end of the time there and DID have a great time so I elected to just get it back and deal with it in more controlled situation at home. I was not sure if the running in the muddy water could have hastened the wear of the impeller.

Tim
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jkidd



Joined: 23 Oct 2006
Posts: 1609
City/Region: Northern, Utah
State or Province: UT
C-Dory Year: 2007
C-Dory Model: 22 Cruiser
Vessel Name: Voyager
Photos: Voyager (JK)
PostPosted: Sun Sep 27, 2015 7:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Lost Petrel wrote:
Hi Jim,

Yes I had remembered that the impeller had been replaced last year, and hopefully all it is the pee hole plugged. But we were at the end of the time there and DID have a great time so I elected to just get it back and deal with it in more controlled situation at home. I was not sure if the running in the muddy water could have hastened the wear of the impeller.

Tim


It might have shorten it a little you might need to change it in another 2 or 3 years now. Very Happy
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Lost Petrel



Joined: 10 Aug 2014
Posts: 138
City/Region: Potter Valley
State or Province: CA
C-Dory Year: 2007
C-Dory Model: 25 Cruiser
Vessel Name: Wild Blue
Photos: Wild Blue
PostPosted: Sun Sep 27, 2015 7:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

jkidd wrote:
Lost Petrel wrote:
Hi Jim,

Yes I had remembered that the impeller had been replaced last year, and hopefully all it is the pee hole plugged. But we were at the end of the time there and DID have a great time so I elected to just get it back and deal with it in more controlled situation at home. I was not sure if the running in the muddy water could have hastened the wear of the impeller.

Tim


It might have shorten it a little you might need to change it in another 2 or 3 years now. Very Happy

Yes, I guess it is the price one pays for following the likes of you and Jay around. Wink
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hardee



Joined: 30 Oct 2006
Posts: 12632
City/Region: Sequim
State or Province: WA
C-Dory Year: 2005
C-Dory Model: 22 Cruiser
Vessel Name: Sleepy-C
Photos: SleepyC
PostPosted: Mon Sep 28, 2015 3:18 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

In another thread posting, there was an allusion to carbon monoxide poisoning, and a comment about propane. Curious if someone can fill us in on what happened, as much as possible anyway.

Reason for asking: I recently had an occurrence, where I was moving, quite slowly, cabin door open, and center window open, plus my side window open about 3 inches. I get a beeping alarm, check, no over heat or low oil pressure. Not the AIS, VHF's? No, Auto Pilot, not that either. Still beeping. Start shutting things down, AIS, AP, VHF's, finally both engines. Still beeping. Everything is off, still beeping. Go to the stern and turn the main power switch 1,2,Both and Off to "Off". Still beeping. OK now what's left, ... then I see the light on the CO alarm flashing. It is mounted, on the helm bulkhead, about the height of the V-birth pads. OK, got the alarm now. PPM level is 289. I never smelled the exhaust, but it had to be the OB exhaust that was drawing in from the aft. Glad I had the alarm as I was boating by myself and had been out for a couple of days and nobody was looking for me anytime soon.

Hope John is doing much better now.

Harvey
SleepyC Moon

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Sea Wolf



Joined: 01 Nov 2003
Posts: 8650
City/Region: Redding
State or Province: CA
C-Dory Year: 1987
C-Dory Model: 22 Cruiser
Vessel Name: Sea Wolf
Photos: Sea Wolf
PostPosted: Mon Sep 28, 2015 5:58 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Re: Carbon Monoxide poisoning. (Limited depth explanation)

Carbon monoxide poisoning occurs from incomplete combustion when not enough oxygen is available in the burning process, and instead of getting all carbon dioxide and water as combustion products, some carbon monoxide is produced, which then enters the bloodstream via the lungs and attaches to and ties up the hemoglobin in the red blood cells, thus rendering them unable to carry oxygen to the rest to the body.

When a diesel, kerosene, or similar fueled fuel stove burns without enough oxygen present, carbon particles are produced which is seen and smelled as soot, along with the usual combustion products of carbon dioxide and water. (Some unburned fuel may also be smelled.)

When a propane stove burns without an adequate supply of oxygen, carbon monoxide is produced along with the regular carbon dioxide and water, thus more commonly leading to carbon monoxide poisoning with this type of fuel.

Not only does propane (and it relative butane) produce more carbon monoxide with incomplete combustion, but the CO is odorless leading to an undetected poison in the air. (Again, some unburned fuel may also be smelled, but less commonly.)

Thus, a stove or other appliance using a diesel/kerosene/gasoline/ or even alcohol fuel that is burning without adequate oxygen is much more likely to be noticed and adjusted or turned off than a propane/butane stove producing an odorless poisonous carbon monoxide product.

Adding to this problem is the fact that some types of cooking and heating stoves of both types are not vented overboard via tubing and exhaust ports.

We all know of types of space heaters, cooking stoves, lamps, and the like that are commonly used without external vents.

This is, of course, why some appliances that use propane and butane have automatic shut-off devices built into them and carbon monoxide detectors and shut off valves/systems are required or recommended.

(Why the diesel/kerosene fuels produce proportionally more soot and the propane/butane fuels produce more carbon monoxide probably has to do with the higher percentage of carbon in their molecular make-up, and perhaps their combustion temperatures.)

Joe. Teeth Thumbs Up

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Lake Shasta, California

"Most of my money I spent on boats and women. The rest I squandered'. " -Annonymous
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hardee



Joined: 30 Oct 2006
Posts: 12632
City/Region: Sequim
State or Province: WA
C-Dory Year: 2005
C-Dory Model: 22 Cruiser
Vessel Name: Sleepy-C
Photos: SleepyC
PostPosted: Mon Sep 28, 2015 12:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks Joe. Good explanation of the production of CO (carbon monoxide)

Quote:
"... some carbon monoxide is produced, which then enters the bloodstream via the lungs and attaches to and ties up the hemoglobin in the red blood cells, thus rendering them unable to carry oxygen to the rest to the body. "


So for treatment, the CO poisoning is not a permanent situation, however, depending on the severity it is an emergency and is often life threatening.

The treatment requires 2 basic things, time and oxygen. The higher the oxygen supplement, the shorter the time of treatment. The diagnosis is confirmed via a blood test (arterial blood gas) that measures the carboxyhemoglobin level. Measurement with a pulse oximeter is not reliable because the oximeter actually measures blood color and in CO poisoning the carboxyhemoglobin replaces the oxygen and the cells appear red to the oximeter sensor. Initial treatment is a high concentration of inhaled O2. If available, a hyperbaric chamber will shorten the duration of treatment, and is preferable if the concentration of CO is extreme.

Quote:
At what level does carbon monoxide become toxic?
For healthy adults CO becomes toxic when it reaches a level higher than 35 ppm (parts per million) with continuous exposure over an eight hour period.. When the level of CO becomes higher than that a person will suffer from symptoms of exposure. Mild exposure over 2-3 hours (a CO level between 35 ppm and 200 ppm) will produce flu-like symptoms such as headaches, sore eyes and a runny nose. Medium exposure (a CO level between 200 ppm to 800 ppm) will produce dizziness, drowsiness and vomiting in as little as 1 hour. This level of exposure is deemed to be life threatening once three hours has passed. Extreme exposure (a CO level of 800 ppm and higher) will result in unconsciousness, brain damage and death in as little as a few minutes. OSHA guidelines state that the maximum exposure over an eight hour time period is 35 ppm.


It is important to have a working CO monitor on board, and it should be able to give you a reading of the current level, and the level over time. CO poisoning is dangerous. When my alarm went off, I had a 289 PPM. It was time to do something. I closed the cabin door, opened all the windows and the forward hatch and got the boat up on plane to flush the cabin of poison gas, opening the door slightly after I was up at 10 knots. I was lucky the alarm was functioning.

Harvey
SleepyC Moon

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Sea Wolf



Joined: 01 Nov 2003
Posts: 8650
City/Region: Redding
State or Province: CA
C-Dory Year: 1987
C-Dory Model: 22 Cruiser
Vessel Name: Sea Wolf
Photos: Sea Wolf
PostPosted: Mon Sep 28, 2015 1:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks, Harvey for the great fill-in and explanation!

As a side note, this thread illustrates a couple of minor problems with this site:

Sometimes very good discussions that should be accessible via Search functions are hidden within other topics. (e.g., CO poisoning within a Lake Powell thread.) The Search function will show this thread, but not where the discussion is within it.

Secondly, so many of the topics involve the same words/terms, that looking for them is like Searching for a "boat" when actually looking for a fishing boat to go albacore fishing. Too many unrelated hits to look through!

If I could live to be 100 (27 more years), I'd either cross-index all the topics within the threads or totally write a new summary book to re-organize the technical information available here. Fat chance on either happening!

Best bet on searching is to find a unique word to the topic you're looking for that cannot be found on any other discussion, and that often does not exist.

Yes, some of the problem happens because the discussion wander off-topic, but at the time, the comments seem germane.

Thanks for understanding my anticipated frustration! Ha! Laughing

Joe. Teeth Thumbs Up
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