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Suzuki DF90A Stalling
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Two Bears



Joined: 07 Nov 2009
Posts: 296
City/Region: Orofino
State or Province: ID
C-Dory Year: 2006
C-Dory Model: 22 Cruiser
Vessel Name: Two Bears
Photos: Two Bears
PostPosted: Wed Sep 03, 2014 3:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I posted this a few weeks ago but no one commented so it dropped off the forum. I wonder if it's not the same thing. I'm using a lot of the suggestions above, but still have not found a clear thing as the "problem."

Last fall (2013) before winter I attached a fuel pump to the outlet of the "kicker" motor and drained both tanks. I did not change the fuel filter, thinking that I'd put a few hours on the motor in the spring and then change, so than any "junk" kicked up by the draining or spring refueling would be caught in the old filter. I put about 15 gallons in each tank in the spring, ran the motor about 1 hr on the local lake, but our planned trips to the Salish Sea got scrapped and the boat did not receive any other use until early August.
In early August I took the boat to a Convention in Richland, WA. The marina in front of the convention hotel was $5.50/ night, a lot less than the $119/ night for the hotel. Great convention. I put the boat in the water and just in idle forward & reverse to a dock for 5 nights. Day temperatures reached 3 digits. With the convention over I started the motor and "idled" to the boat ramp. Motor died as I reached ramp. Started, but would not "rev" up. Acted "fuel starved." Maybe time to change fuel filter, but could not budge filter cartridge by hand and had left filter wrench at home. Finally winched boat on trailer and headed to Salish Sea. I had made appointment to a Marina for electronic check up, arrived on time and had them look at motor also. They changed filter and when removed it was only half full of fuel. They put motor on a "muff" and it idled fine for half an hour. OK, problem solved!

Headed to Bellingham, launched boat about 6 pm, idled to visitor dock, spent night, shopped for groceries in morning. About 11 headed for islands. Cleared visitor dock, headed for harbor entrance and applied power and motor died. Restarted, it would idle and then die. Kicker did same. Drifted into some parked boats and they helped tie us up. With some experimentation I could keep kicker motor going by pumping bulb, but could not keep main motor going that way. Used kicker to get to boat ramp, winched on trailer. It was then 1:30 pm on a Friday afternoon. Where do you find a mechanic on a Friday afternoon or would we have to wait to Monday. So we came home.
At home, I attached fuel pump I use to empty tanks to Kicker motor line and pumped into a spare gas can. Fuel came slowly at first, then fast.
I check breather inlets. We have wasp problems here and they often plug up small holes. They looked good and clean to me. I looked at everything I could think of, could find nothing, so took boat up to reservoir and ran it. big motor started rough but quickly smoothed out. I ran around the lake in circle at 20 knots for an hour (afraid to get too far from the dock). Motor ran fine, no hesitation after first start.

So, it is cured? Dare I trust it? What else could it be?

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Chuck & Penny Raddon
Orofino, Idaho
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easternshore22



Joined: 12 Jun 2010
Posts: 40
City/Region: Eastern Shore
State or Province: MD
C-Dory Year: 1996
C-Dory Model: 22 Angler
Vessel Name: Hunky Dory
Photos: Hunky Dory
PostPosted: Wed Sep 03, 2014 9:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Two Bears wrote:
Fuel came slowly at first, then fast.


Probably you solved the issue there. If you sucked the obstruction out of the tank, it is probably a permanent solution, if the obstruction fall back to the tank, you will need to clean the tank.

That is what I will do with mine once I take the boat out of the water since part of the pickup is in the tank, and who knows what else.

Franco

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1996 C-Dory Angler 22'
Choptank River
Eastern Shore, MD
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easternshore22



Joined: 12 Jun 2010
Posts: 40
City/Region: Eastern Shore
State or Province: MD
C-Dory Year: 1996
C-Dory Model: 22 Angler
Vessel Name: Hunky Dory
Photos: Hunky Dory
PostPosted: Mon Sep 08, 2014 1:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Update:
I connected an external tank directly to the low pressure filter using the bulb of that tank (no components in common with the boat's fuel supply setup). I did not run it like this for long since I did not want to run without the 10 micron filter. It run fine.

The filter maintained the level of gas at different RPMs. I also kinked the hose to block the supply and saw the level go down and once unkinked the level went up. So I can say that the low pressure pump is working.

I repeated the test connecting the hose that connects to one of the tanks to the external tank. It also worked fine (if I kinked the hose, level goes down and after unkinking level rose).

I also depressurized the line after the high pressure pump and when setting the key to 'ON' I could feel (pinching the hose with the fingers) the high pressure buildup in the hose, so that system seems to be also ok.

So I can say that the hose, 10 micron filter, valve, etc are ok. Before the filter would just start getting empty.

One note is that after unkinking, the level rose very fast with the tank connected directly to the low pressure filter compared to connected to the hose that goes to the tank. I assume this is expected due to extra elements between filter and tank?

I am waiting for the replacement fuel pickups to replace and test with the tanks.

Couple of questions:
1 - The old pickups have a stainless mesh at the bottom of them. Is this ok? Why there would be a filtering element in a place not easy to inspect or replace. Both had many of the holes blocked with some black material (residue from the float of the sending unit?)

2 - Should I expect the bulbs to go flat after I block the supply of gas? That did not happen. Does this mean I still have some sort of air leak? I will use soapy water after I connect everything back to check for leaks.

Thanks,

Franco
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BrentB



Joined: 15 Jul 2006
Posts: 4419
City/Region: Greenwood
State or Province: IN
Photos: BrentB
PostPosted: Mon Sep 08, 2014 3:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I removed the fuel pickup tube screen and ball and spring in the ASV, checked the elbow fitting but no screens with present) and gas flows directly to the external fuel filter (RACOR, Yamaha, ....)
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Brent Barrett
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mdoug



Joined: 09 May 2006
Posts: 53
City/Region: Meredith
State or Province: NH
C-Dory Year: 2005
C-Dory Model: 22 Cruiser
Vessel Name: Mikey
PostPosted: Wed Sep 10, 2014 8:40 am    Post subject: DF90A Stalling Reply with quote

Had to replace my 2005 Suzy 90. My mechanic could not do a permanent fix. Got 1450 hrs on the old engine. Apparently a bad design. My mechanic says new DF90A is a much better engine. We shall see.
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Mikey
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jkidd



Joined: 23 Oct 2006
Posts: 1609
City/Region: Northern, Utah
State or Province: UT
C-Dory Year: 2007
C-Dory Model: 22 Cruiser
Vessel Name: Voyager
Photos: Voyager (JK)
PostPosted: Wed Sep 10, 2014 8:46 pm    Post subject: Re: DF90A Stalling Reply with quote

mdoug wrote:
Had to replace my 2005 Suzy 90. My mechanic could not do a permanent fix. Got 1450 hrs on the old engine. Apparently a bad design. My mechanic says new DF90A is a much better engine. We shall see.


Makes me want to buy a new mechanic. Laughing

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Jody Kidd
KE7WNG
Northern, Utah

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easternshore22



Joined: 12 Jun 2010
Posts: 40
City/Region: Eastern Shore
State or Province: MD
C-Dory Year: 1996
C-Dory Model: 22 Angler
Vessel Name: Hunky Dory
Photos: Hunky Dory
PostPosted: Thu Jun 18, 2015 9:16 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I want to give an update/closure on this. After replacing every component between the low pressure filter and the tank, it still stalled.

I decided to replace the low pressure fuel pump. That fixed it. It took less than 15 minutes and it is a $95 part (from iboats.com). Since I was replacing the pump, I also replaced the hose between the filter and pump.

I did an autopsy of the pump and found a small (2mm) rubber piece blocking one of the diaphragms. The questions is how that rubber piece got there. Probably from the hose between the filter and pump?

Thanks everyone,

Franco
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BrentB



Joined: 15 Jul 2006
Posts: 4419
City/Region: Greenwood
State or Province: IN
Photos: BrentB
PostPosted: Thu Jun 18, 2015 10:54 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

thanks for the update
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