The C-Brats Forum Index
HomeForumsMy TopicsCalendarEvent SignupsMemberlistOur C-DorysThe Brat MapPhotos

Trouble shooting the honda 225 and repair at the dock.

 
Post new topic   Reply to topic    The C-Brats Forum Index -> General Chat
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
starcrafttom



Joined: 07 Nov 2003
Posts: 7878
City/Region: marysville
State or Province: WA
C-Dory Year: 1984
C-Dory Model: 27 Cruiser
Vessel Name: to be decided later
Photos: Susan E
PostPosted: Mon Jul 21, 2014 1:16 pm    Post subject: Trouble shooting the honda 225 and repair at the dock. Reply with quote

Well I had trouble with my honda 225 this weekend and it was a mystery figuring it out that took me down the wrong road at first and made me waste a lot of time. In the end I was able to fix it with a few tools and part I had on the boat. I did have to get one piece of wire but I could have done it with what I had to get home.

So while running to FH I kept getting a alarm followed by the engine shutting down. Looked like a over heat alarm. I would restart and idle just fine but as soon as we took off the alarm would sound and the engine die's again. No blockage of the piss water, no seed weed on the lower unit and no hot motor????? Well I could not figure it out in SJ channel with the ferry coming at me so I fired up the kicker and we crawled into port. Every time I think about getting a sail boat I should do this to remind me that going that slow is just nut's.

So I figure that I have one of two problems 1) stuck thermostat or 2) a bad sensor on one of the heads. I have a v6 225 Honda which has two sensor and two thermostats. So after a little polling and soul searching I pulled the sensor connector and tested then with a volt meter set for continuity. The sensor should close when the right temp is meet. So if sensor is good I should NOT get a beep or tone when I touch the probes to the two connector prongs on the sensor right???? Yeah right. So after finding both sensors to be good I moved on to the thermostats. Easy to pull. It's just 5 screws for the cover and three bolts for each thermostat. Get them out and boil then on the stove to see if both open. Which they did. Now cool to see if they close and they do and then repeat 5 times for good measure. Ok so now I am out of ideas and day light. Put it all back together and start it up and it runs fine??? Well that is at idle so lets tie the rope's a little tighter to the dock and but it in gear and run it to 1500 rpm to generate some heat in both forward and reverse... all good with out any shut downs. Must have been a stuck thermostat and boiling it unstuck it. Ok off to bed for some early ( well kind of early) fishing..................

Get up start up turn the wheel so I can back out and the engine die's.......WTF OVER..................

Well lets do that again. Engine on? Fine, warms up? Fine turn the wheel right ....fine turn wheel left?.......died. The repeatable action was turning the wheel left and the engine dies ever time. Not some thing I was paying attention to while the ferry was heading my way. Better part of valor in the channel is running like hell on your kicker while you can.

So after thinking for a while I started to take the covers and holders for the wiring and fuel line harness where it enters the motor because that moves away from the engine as you turn left????

Ok 200 more screws and bolts later I find that the secondary positive power cable ( there is one for the starter and one that goes to a fuse panel that powers everything else on the motor) had pulled apart inside the rubber casing. The wire was not in two parts , to be clear, but the copper strains inside the rubber casing were broken and separating when I turned left but pushed together when the engine was straight or turned right. No outward sign of the brake. You had to feel it with your fingers inside the casing. Well I cut it open and used my stores of parts and toos I keep on board to splice in ( wire crimps with heat shrink) 4 inches of new wire so there is enough wire so the movement would not pinch and pull the wire apart again. Re-installed the 200 screws and bolts that honda finds just sufficient to hold this all in place and went fishing around Noon. End the day with a 17lbs king for a visiting family member and ended a great trip. I hope this may help some one in the future that has a similar problem that they can not figure out.

_________________
Thomas J Elliott
http://tomsfishinggear.blogspot.com/
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
Aurelia



Joined: 21 Aug 2009
Posts: 2331
City/Region: Gig Harbor
State or Province: WA
Photos: Aurelia
PostPosted: Mon Jul 21, 2014 1:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Nice Job Tom! Troubleshooting is fun and frustrating. I would not have initially connected the running issue to a turn direction either. I would have been adding battery and tiller to the Torqeedo at record speed.

Greg

_________________
Greg, Cindie & Aven
Gig Harbor
Aurelia - 25 Cruiser sold 2012
Ari - 19 Cruiser sold 2023
currently exploring with "Lia", 17 ft Bullfrog Supersport Pilothouse
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
redbaronace



Joined: 29 Aug 2012
Posts: 581
City/Region: Puget Sound
State or Province: WA
C-Dory Year: 2006
C-Dory Model: 255 Tomcat
Photos: redbaronace (Name TBD)
PostPosted: Mon Jul 21, 2014 4:27 pm    Post subject: Re: Trouble shooting the honda 225 and repair at the dock. Reply with quote

starcrafttom wrote:
Well I had trouble with my honda 225 this weekend and it was a mystery figuring it out that took me down the wrong road at first and made me waste a lot of time. In the end I was able to fix it with a few tools and part I had on the boat. I did have to get one piece of wire but I could have done it with what I had to get home.

So while running to FH I kept getting a alarm followed by the engine shutting down. Looked like a over heat alarm. I would restart and idle just fine but as soon as we took off the alarm would sound and the engine die's again. No blockage of the piss water, no seed weed on the lower unit and no hot motor????? Well I could not figure it out in SJ channel with the ferry coming at me so I fired up the kicker and we crawled into port. Every time I think about getting a sail boat I should do this to remind me that going that slow is just nut's.

So I figure that I have one of two problems 1) stuck thermostat or 2) a bad sensor on one of the heads. I have a v6 225 Honda which has two sensor and two thermostats. So after a little polling and soul searching I pulled the sensor connector and tested then with a volt meter set for continuity. The sensor should close when the right temp is meet. So if sensor is good I should NOT get a beep or tone when I touch the probes to the two connector prongs on the sensor right???? Yeah right. So after finding both sensors to be good I moved on to the thermostats. Easy to pull. It's just 5 screws for the cover and three bolts for each thermostat. Get them out and boil then on the stove to see if both open. Which they did. Now cool to see if they close and they do and then repeat 5 times for good measure. Ok so now I am out of ideas and day light. Put it all back together and start it up and it runs fine??? Well that is at idle so lets tie the rope's a little tighter to the dock and but it in gear and run it to 1500 rpm to generate some heat in both forward and reverse... all good with out any shut downs. Must have been a stuck thermostat and boiling it unstuck it. Ok off to bed for some early ( well kind of early) fishing..................

Get up start up turn the wheel so I can back out and the engine die's.......WTF OVER..................

Well lets do that again. Engine on? Fine, warms up? Fine turn the wheel right ....fine turn wheel left?.......died. The repeatable action was turning the wheel left and the engine dies ever time. Not some thing I was paying attention to while the ferry was heading my way. Better part of valor in the channel is running like hell on your kicker while you can.

So after thinking for a while I started to take the covers and holders for the wiring and fuel line harness where it enters the motor because that moves away from the engine as you turn left????

Ok 200 more screws and bolts later I find that the secondary positive power cable ( there is one for the starter and one that goes to a fuse panel that powers everything else on the motor) had pulled apart inside the rubber casing. The wire was not in two parts , to be clear, but the copper strains inside the rubber casing were broken and separating when I turned left but pushed together when the engine was straight or turned right. No outward sign of the brake. You had to feel it with your fingers inside the casing. Well I cut it open and used my stores of parts and toos I keep on board to splice in ( wire crimps with heat shrink) 4 inches of new wire so there is enough wire so the movement would not pinch and pull the wire apart again. Re-installed the 200 screws and bolts that honda finds just sufficient to hold this all in place and went fishing around Noon. End the day with a 17lbs king for a visiting family member and ended a great trip. I hope this may help some one in the future that has a similar problem that they can not figure out.


Glad to see that you got that taken care of. You looked frustrated when I saw you at FH and after reading the diagnostics you went through to find the problem, I can see why.

Good to get that nice fish in the end.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Pedromo



Joined: 28 Apr 2013
Posts: 87
City/Region: Oxnard
State or Province: CA
C-Dory Year: 1989
C-Dory Model: 22 Cruiser
Vessel Name: C-Casa
Photos: C-Casa
PostPosted: Mon Jul 21, 2014 7:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Coincidental post... When I returned from a short cruise yesterday, I noticed the battery power cable deformed where it exits the rubber grommet at the motor and the upper part of the hydraulic ram in my 90HP Honda. Closer inspection revealed the negative wire had frayed at least 90% and was ready to break.
The damage was caused by me while trying to "beautify" the wires and cables on the splash well, at not taking in consideration the necessary slack and clearance required.
The cables have been replaced and we are ready to go again
[/img]
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
jennykatz



Joined: 15 Dec 2003
Posts: 1678
City/Region: naples
State or Province: FL
C-Dory Year: 2006
C-Dory Model: 23 Venture
Vessel Name: Little Treasurer
Photos: Jennykatz
PostPosted: Tue Jul 22, 2014 7:48 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Great Job and thanks for the heads up .trouble shooting is not always fun
_________________
retired 8/08 from UAL, still working pt tm
Duck c-22 cruiser sold 6/23/08
06 Venture Cruiser with merc115CT
00 cd16 cruiser honda 40 sold 3/12
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
Ray



Joined: 13 Dec 2011
Posts: 271
City/Region: Pamlico River
State or Province: NC
C-Dory Year: 2007
C-Dory Model: 25 Cruiser
Vessel Name: Seaweed
Photos: Seaweed
PostPosted: Tue Jul 22, 2014 8:11 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Funny -

I read a difference between "Trouble shooting..." and "Troubleshooting...."

I wondered, "why would you want to shoot your Honda 225? (not that I wouldn't have wanted to on some of my past outboards....)
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
rogerbum



Joined: 21 Nov 2004
Posts: 5922
City/Region: Kenmore
State or Province: WA
C-Dory Year: 2008
C-Dory Model: 255 Tomcat
Vessel Name: Meant to be
Photos: SeaDNA
PostPosted: Tue Jul 22, 2014 11:14 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ray wrote:
Funny -

I read a difference between "Trouble shooting..." and "Troubleshooting...."

I wondered, "why would you want to shoot your Honda 225? (not that I wouldn't have wanted to on some of my past outboards....)

Laughing

_________________
Roger on Meant to be
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message AIM Address
Sunbeam



Joined: 23 Feb 2012
Posts: 3990
City/Region: Out 'n' About
State or Province: Other
C-Dory Year: 2002
C-Dory Model: 22 Cruiser
Photos: Sunbeam
PostPosted: Tue Jul 22, 2014 11:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ha ha, I read it the same way at first glance. Then thought, "Well of all people, you wouldn't think Tom would be one to have any trouble shooting his engine." Bang. Done.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
starcrafttom



Joined: 07 Nov 2003
Posts: 7878
City/Region: marysville
State or Province: WA
C-Dory Year: 1984
C-Dory Model: 27 Cruiser
Vessel Name: to be decided later
Photos: Susan E
PostPosted: Tue Jul 22, 2014 4:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well with 8 years in the USMC and 3 on the range as a instructor, I don't have trouble shooting anything I feel like Wink
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic   Reply to topic    The C-Brats Forum Index -> General Chat All times are GMT - 5 Hours
Page 1 of 1

 
     Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
You cannot attach files in this forum
You cannot download files in this forum



Page generation time: 0.0648s (PHP: 79% - SQL: 21%) - SQL queries: 26 - GZIP disabled - Debug on