Rule Automatic Bilge Pump

ccflyer · Posted: Tue Jul 03, 2012 1:30 pm Post subject: Rule Automatic Bilge Pump

I have a Rule Automatic 1100 GPM pump installed under the door. It works fine when I use the manual switch at the help. However, when it comes on automatically it doesn't seem to sense any bilge water. And, despite my pouring a bucketful next to it, it will not engage. So I go back to the helm, throw the manual switch and it does its job.
Since I see no exterior float switch mechanism, is there anything else to do before replacing it?
Thanks

localboy · Posted: Tue Jul 03, 2012 1:39 pm Post subject:

We have the same issue w/ the one in our bilge. It's supposed to have an auto internal switch, but despite even dropping it in a bucket of water, I've never seen it automatically go on. It's always been a mystery to me. I even replaced it and had the same outcome.

potter water · Posted: Tue Jul 03, 2012 1:57 pm Post subject:

As I read the instructions, the auto function of the pump will pulse on every 2.5 minutes to see if there is water there. When I put in my buckets of water for tests, the auto function didn't work unless I waited for over two minutes for the auto sensor to detect that there was a whole bunch of water in there then it fired off. So that MAY be the problem you are seeing as well. It would seem that the water level detect on the pump can suck electricity 25/7 without the pulse mode, so they built that in. What that pulsed peek at the water level means for unattended boats in terms of juice used from the direct wiring to the battery I haven't found out. But, the pulse is apparently mighty low current draw when it fires and so has little effect on boats on the trailer for long periods or in the slip.

If anyone can backup this understanding I have or shoot it down, let me know please.

Jack in Alaska · Posted: Tue Jul 03, 2012 3:00 pm Post subject:

My Rule 1100 automatic is way smarter than I am. But it keeps the bilge relatively dry and that is a good thing.

Last year I took it out and did the bucket of water test thing. It shot a big gob of water right into my face unannounced. I hate that.

I have another 1100 and am thinking of installing it also as a back-up but the discharge routing is a giant PITA.

ferret30 · Posted: Tue Jul 03, 2012 4:20 pm Post subject:

I believe there are Rule 1100s that use float switches, ones that use solid state devices (like the water level detectors in humidifiers and some espresso machines), and some are totally manual.

Our 1100 is a white body in a blue basket, and the body unclips from the basket which is attached to the bilge with epoxy. It is roughly pill shaped looking down from the top.

When I take it out of the basket I can see the impeller in a circular housing. If I remove the 2 screws, I have access to the impeller, and I also see the float. Doing this doesn't expose any water sensitive pump parts, FYI. The float is a loose white plastic part with a magnet in the top, that floats and sinks in a vertical channel. Inside the pump body above the top of the channel is (I presume) a reed switch that closes when the magnet gets close.

If this sounds like your pump, I'd recommend removing the 2 screws and checking if there's gunk that's making the float stick.

If you have a self-checking version that runs every N minutes, I'd replace it.

thataway · Posted: Tue Jul 03, 2012 6:07 pm Post subject:

There are at least 6 Rule 1100 pumps:

There is the Rule 1100 D (manual, to be used with a separate sensor or float switch

Rule 1100 S, the sensor (every 2.5 minutes comes on and checks to see if there is water,. (These use power and can drain batteries)

Rule 1100 Automatic, with a float switch

There is the Rulemate 1100 which is the oval which Ferret30 noted, and has a float switch.

there is also a square Rule 1100.

Of course there are other brands....Jabsco diaphragm, Atwood, Shurflo, and Johnson (which I think are better built than the Rule).

Probably it is wise to use a separate float switch which you can wire a light or counter to, so you know when the pump comes on. There are some switches which are better than others--but I hesitate to say that one is "best" since they are all subject to fail....

There is also a Rule Cartridge 1100

bcassal · Posted: Wed Jul 04, 2012 9:34 pm Post subject: Rule 1100 pumps

I recently installed 2 Rule Mate 1100 pumps on Carpy. These are the new ones with the solid state sensor which I hoped will be the solution to the recurring noise and battery drain of the old 1100's. To test them I turned a hose to the cockpit and waited as the water got much deeper than I was comfortable with. Eventually they came on and emptied the cockpit rather quickly. These pumps turn on when the water is 2.75 inches deep at the pump and turn off at .5 inch. I don't think a bucket or two of water will set them off. I was reassured that they did work well, and seemed to get more than that last half inch with the manual switch. I'll be interested to see how they behave in a heavy rain while on the water.

Bruce Cassal
"Carpy"

C-Nile · Posted: Thu Jul 05, 2012 2:00 am Post subject: Re: Rule Automatic Bilge Pump

ccflyer · Posted: Thu Jul 05, 2012 12:35 pm Post subject:

The pump does come on every several minutes, it just doesn't sense the water. It only pumps out water when I hit the manual switch. Later today I'm going to see if I can open it up and find "something stuck". Failing that I guess its off to get another at West Marine - ouch!
Thanks for all your responses
Phil

Captains Cat · Posted: Thu Jul 05, 2012 1:32 pm Post subject:

If you have the 1100S, it is supposed to come on every two minutes or so. If there isn't enough water to pump (a couple of inches or so) It will not stay on.

The manual setting causes it to stay on and pump until it gets down to a half inch or so and it loses suction. It sounds as if it is working correctly IMHO.

Charlie

rogerbum · Posted: Thu Jul 05, 2012 1:35 pm Post subject:

Will-C · Posted: Thu Jul 05, 2012 2:37 pm Post subject: Rule Automatic Bilge Pump

The new model number is a 27s which takes a 1 1/8 inch discharge hose. They only run for one second to sense if there is water every 2.5 minutes. Which sounds like maybe a newer version of the above described pump. The instructions say power use is minimal as it only use .25 amp hours per day in the checking mode. It also says that you start the pump anytime by turning off power for five minutes and then turn power back on the pump will start immediately and pump until the water is gone. The black wire goes to the negative side of the battery, the brown wire goes to the automatic side of the switch and the brown and white goes to the manual side of the switch. The pump needs a minimum of 10.5 volts to operate. They cost about 99 dollars from Defender Marine. You don't have to connect the the brown and white if you do not want the manual over ride option according to the directions sitting on my desk. Very Happy

D.D.

thataway · Posted: Thu Jul 05, 2012 6:52 pm Post subject:

I have two of the 27S on the Caracal--and had not been aware of any distraction--but I don't try and sleep aboard--from the cycling. It will run down the batteries over weeks if I leave it on. (I have not measured the draw).

ccflyer · Posted: Mon Jul 23, 2012 6:56 pm Post subject:

FYI: I found a number of mixed reviews on the "water sensing" vs float switch pumps.
I chose to stick with the present water sensing model.
I got my best price and West Marine matched it - $88.83.
If this one fails again I'm switching to the float switch type.

dread · Posted: Sun Jan 27, 2013 4:19 pm Post subject: 2006 Vintage Rule-Mate 1100

I think I have the same pump that Ferret 30 has. Is there any way to test whether the interior float switch is working other than by removing the two screws and seeing whether the float moves up and down?