Mystery electrical fault, help requested

Capital Sea

Capital Sea is outfitted with 2007 Honda 90 , two batteries , on board marine charger, also Honda 9.9 (not effected)
Issue: no power to helm, no tilt at helm, battery gauge at helm shows crank battery as dead though battery is fully charged, tilt switch on 90 also has no power.
Batteries are fully charged, crank battery is new.
Thermal circuit breaker has been replaced as had corrosion.
Battery 1,2 or 1&2 switch and managment modual inspected and clean tight w/ o corrosion.
All connections have been cleaned and inspected.
Fuses in the Honda have been inspected visually and with meter.
Controls at helm confirmed as in neutral.
Fuses at battery checked.
Ground at lazeret verified.
Power verified at silinoid
Ground to block verified

Help,please.

416rigby · Posted: Sat May 18, 2013 1:29 pm Post subject:

Our boat has a fuse back under the starboard gunnel just fwd of the laz. Depending on how your boat was rigged, there could be a hidden fuse lurking somewhere between the batteries and controls. If you haven't already done it, I'd start at the batteries and slowly work fwd looking for a fuse holder somewhere. Just an idea...

Rick

Big Mac · Posted: Sat May 18, 2013 2:06 pm Post subject: No power

After all the things you have tried, I would call and make an appointment with Tom's Outboard in Olympia. I have heard nothing but good about his work. I have bought parts there and they seem fair on their pricing. Good luck.

journey on · Posted: Sat May 18, 2013 2:24 pm Post subject:

The obvious problem, as you stated, is that power isn't getting from the battery to the right places.

My only suggestion is to get a voltmeter ($10 from Harbour Freight, a little more from Home Depot,) and starting at the battery, work towards the helm, measuring the voltage at each step. When you lose voltage, check between the last good and first bad reading.

Helps is you have a wiring diagram. And if you find a blown fuse, you might find out why it blew.

Boris

potter water · Posted: Sat May 18, 2013 3:20 pm Post subject:

These boats have no standard wiring approach. I'm sure there are as many different electrical configurations as there are C-Dorys.

The good news is that you don't seem to have an intermittent. You have a very easy trouble shooting job ahead of you with a simple voltmeter. Even if you have no particular skills, this is a good time to learn a lot about your boat that will save you later on the water where there may not be a mechanic around to get things turned back on.

Capital Sea · Posted: Sat May 18, 2013 5:45 pm Post subject:

Agreed a voltmeter would be a good investment and Tom's is a great shop. In fact I had Tom on the phone twice last week and he offered to come to my home after closing to work through the issue. As the boat is safe in my driveway I passed. My neighbor helped for a few hours with his voltmeter and at one time we had all the cowling off one side of the outboard checking connections.
On the hidden fuse, I do not think this is the issue but will trace the entire run from helm to the battery. Fact that I have power and ground to the outboard and still no tilt on the side of the outboard is the odd fact. Those tilt buttons work normally with the key in my pocket and with the battery switched to 1+2 if needed.
Learning while repairing is my intent, if I loose patience then I will manually raise the outboard and drive in to Tom's to resolve the problem.

Was full of hope that this issue sounded familiar to someone but oh well.

digger · Posted: Sat May 18, 2013 7:09 pm Post subject:

If you have power to the engine start solenoid, and a good ground and can see 12+ voltsacross the engine ground and the battery cable to the starter, --- check the wires attached to the starter--"bad connections there will stop voltage to the helm and to the trim switches, etc. usually there are 2 wires, in addition to the battery cable attached to the starter for power to get distributed. There may be a main breaker on the newer Hondas that is faulty. It would be either feeding the starter or exiting the starter, on the positive terminals. Check the engine electrical diagram -- it is often at the end of the owners manual.. Older evinrudes would have a fuse that would disable everything -- not sure of the Honda.

ghone · Posted: Sat May 18, 2013 7:10 pm Post subject:

Maybe a funny question but is the safety clip in place on the key panel? If the clip is gone no power provided as the plunger closes to kill the engine.

ShellBack · Posted: Sat May 18, 2013 7:36 pm Post subject:

A good point is the safety clip or strap or related items. I remember a couple of years ago heading to Port Renfrew with a buddy to fish for the long weekend. His boat was good to go before we left but launched on arrival and nothing worked. Spent hours trying to figure it out and conceded to sitting in the pub for the weekend. Back to the shop for him after the weekend, a broken wire inside the kill switch that was easy to spot but we thought major issue. Lesson learned , look for the easy fix first. Good luck and let us know the out come.

Skeeter · Posted: Sat May 18, 2013 10:54 pm Post subject:

It must be a missed fuse or point of corrosion in the motor circuits. Both trim switches get their power from the same point or node in the motor. Check the voltage at that point. It might be one of the multi pin connectors.
Good Luck.

Capital Sea · Posted: Sat May 18, 2013 11:07 pm Post subject:

Safety clip is in place also removed it and reinstalled it just as I ran the throttle fore and aft and back into neutral. Purchased a voltmeter and used it today. All of the connections at the starter are clean and tight.
Have power all the way through the main 30amp fuse on the 2007 Honda 90.
No power to the lower fuses. Checked the wires going in to the fuse box and all are clean and show now damage.
Am ready to let Tom's take a run at it. Problem is the motor is down and its a bunk trailer so cannot be driven with the motor down. Released the hydraulics and it dropped another two inches. Even with two of us, could not lift it and continue the pressure needed to force the oil into the reservoir.
After taking a long look at things it looks like I can hook a heavy tow line to the cleat on the bow, run it through the forward window and door and use a come along connected to the lifting brackets on top of the motor. One person lifting and the other keeping steady modest pressure.
Would rather be boating but at least will learn a few more tricks.

Skeeter · Posted: Sat May 18, 2013 11:20 pm Post subject:

If you have a schematic you could rig a jumper to put power to the lift side of the hydraulic motor. Be sure you know which is the negative and positive.

Captains Cat · Posted: Sun May 19, 2013 7:57 am Post subject:

There is also a lockout switch in the shift/throttle mechanism. If its not truly in neutral, it wont start. Wiggle the shift lever through neutral a few times and try again.

Charlie

thataway · Posted: Sun May 19, 2013 2:31 pm Post subject:

Not having power to the tilt (helm or motor cowl) is not related to the safety clip or the neutral detent. If you have power to the motor, you should have power to the trim/tilt. I don't know where the problem is on your boat. But I agree, I would rather power that the trim tilt selenoid directly. Check to see if there is any power to the trim tilt switch. I suspect there will not be. There probably will be power to the relay (?)--If you energize the center spade on the trim tilt switch of the cowl, it should allow the Up and down functions to work. I would try that first.

Sorry, I really don't like the idea of a come along thru the front window etc to the lifting brackings--that is a very poor mechanical advantage, and I would worry about safety issues.

A hydraulic jack under the lower unit, or even an "A" frame, with the come along would be safer. However, most outboards will allow you to lift the lower unit with the hyraulic lines in bypass mode. Is it possible that there is some problem with the pivot, which blew a fuse, and then no power to the various places you describe?

In any case have a piece of 2" closet rod ready to slip under the motor bracket when the engine is up!

Capital Sea · Posted: Mon May 20, 2013 12:17 pm Post subject:

Bob, the come along actually worked very well. I used 1" commercial green line (rated for several thousand pounds) from the bow cleat through the window and door with a loop in the end and heavy chain shackled to both lifting eyes (also capable of lifting the boat and trailer). Placed two 2x4s just forward of the hatch and just outside the forward windowsill. This delivered the line slightly above level with the lifting eyes and cleared all contact points. Come along hooked to the chain loop and line, between the transem and the doorway.
I proceeded slowly but the set up worked very well. I was able to lift the remaining 10" or so and set the tilt keepers and have retightened the hydroponic screw. Will transport the few miles to Tom's, nice and easy.