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Seastar Hydraulic Cylinder Repair
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hardee



Joined: 30 Oct 2006
Posts: 12632
City/Region: Sequim
State or Province: WA
C-Dory Year: 2005
C-Dory Model: 22 Cruiser
Vessel Name: Sleepy-C
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 15, 2015 1:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Wandering Sagebrush wrote:
Here's a recent thread on the topic. I think Boris has got the best setup for bleeding a steering system...

http://www.c-brats.com/viewtopic.php?t=23370&highlight=


That thread was active while I was having my leak experience, and was very useful at that time. Thanks for the redirect. I am still curious about how others are doing as far as timing (1000 hours) goes.

Harvey
SleepyC Moon


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NORO LIM



Joined: 24 Apr 2008
Posts: 875
City/Region: Olympia
State or Province: WA
C-Dory Year: 2006
C-Dory Model: 23 Venture
Vessel Name: NORO LIM (sold 12/12/14)
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 15, 2015 8:04 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

With twin engines, twin helms, and autopilot, my SeaStar had lasted 8 years and 3K+ hours when I sold the boat. As far as I know it has still never leaked.
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BTDT



Joined: 07 Jan 2011
Posts: 322
City/Region: Grand Lake Oklahoma
State or Province: OK
C-Dory Year: 2007
C-Dory Model: 255 Tomcat
Vessel Name: C- Lark Wine Down
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PostPosted: Tue Nov 03, 2015 10:12 am    Post subject: Leaking Seastar on Tomcat Reply with quote

I replaced steering shaft seal but still experiencing intermittent leak. Trying to decide whether to replace internal o-rings myself or order new Seastar unit.
Has anyone upgraded to the Pro 2.0 model? If so, do does the quicker steering ratio make for turning the wheel too difficult?

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C-Lark Wine Down
Tomcat 255
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hardee



Joined: 30 Oct 2006
Posts: 12632
City/Region: Sequim
State or Province: WA
C-Dory Year: 2005
C-Dory Model: 22 Cruiser
Vessel Name: Sleepy-C
Photos: SleepyC
PostPosted: Wed Nov 04, 2015 1:13 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I took SleepyC in to the boat doctors to have the SeaStar steering operation. It appears that the internal seals have given up (no dog hair, not Lake Powell sand and no wiping with a micro fiber towel either). It was found that the nut on the end of the cylinder that goes over the shinny shaft, was loose, which I had tightened several times. I asked about having a jam nut placed on that when it was apart for the seals but was told that was not necessary. OK so maybe Loctite is.

The less than good news, because of the way the SeaStar is set between the OB twins, One of the OBs will have to be lifted off the transom to replace the cylinder, which they are recommending due to the corrosion at the fittings, Brass, into the aluminum cylinder. The good news part of that is that I will get both OB's raised one inch, which will put them up to 1/2 below where they should be.

Well, now it will be good for another 10 years, at least.

Harvey
SleepyC Moon

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timflan



Joined: 16 May 2006
Posts: 541
City/Region: Seattle
State or Province: WA
C-Dory Year: 2005
C-Dory Model: 22 Cruiser
Vessel Name: Two Lucky Fish +1
Photos: Two Lucky Fish
PostPosted: Tue Apr 19, 2016 12:40 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Took Two Lucky Fish +1 out for a little shakedown today. Launched in the Ballard ship canal and crossed the channel to Fisherman's Terminal. The point was to "Launch, Run, & Retrieve", hoping everything worked right. Great day for it; it ain't often we get 85° in April!

So all went well, except steering fluid needed topping even though I topped it yesterday. Hmm...weird. And then tonight I took another look and...hey it's low again! So I started puzzling it out, and it didn't take long...you can see the fluid drip out of the end of the cylinder as you spin the wheel. Woops!

So I guess I'll be doing this. Mine's the Baystar HC4600 variant, and the Gland Kit 'A' runs over $80! Whoah! It probably only needs the wiper and shaft seal. Ballard has about half a dozen hydraulic shops. So...I think I'll try to do this the cheap way. Any tips? Wish me luck!

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Jack in Alaska



Joined: 17 Aug 2004
Posts: 1190
City/Region: Anchorage/Ninilchik
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C-Dory Year: 2005
C-Dory Model: 26 Pro Angler
Vessel Name: HIGH TIDE II
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PostPosted: Tue Apr 19, 2016 3:05 am    Post subject: seals Reply with quote

the part no's for the seals are iin my post above in this thread.
$28 for all 4.
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timflan



Joined: 16 May 2006
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City/Region: Seattle
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Vessel Name: Two Lucky Fish +1
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PostPosted: Tue Apr 19, 2016 12:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks Jack. Here's a picture of the end that's leaking.

Let me ask a noob question: Is there some clever way to replace the wiper and shaft seal WITHOUT taking the entire end gland apart from the cylinder?

I ask because there's a tiny hole in the bottom of the end gland, opposite the side where the hydraulic fitting threads in. You can see it in this picture:



What's that for? No magic shortcut for me there, perchance?
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Jack in Alaska



Joined: 17 Aug 2004
Posts: 1190
City/Region: Anchorage/Ninilchik
State or Province: AK
C-Dory Year: 2005
C-Dory Model: 26 Pro Angler
Vessel Name: HIGH TIDE II
Photos: HIGH TIDE II
PostPosted: Tue Apr 19, 2016 1:49 pm    Post subject: seals/rings Reply with quote

I believe those holes are for the spanner wrench used to remove the end cap. The spanner wrench circles the cap and a pin on the wrench fits into those holes.
If you buy the whole kit for approx. $100 a wrench is included along with the seals and "o" rings as well as the tapered sleeve that allows you to slide the seals/rings on w/o damaging them.
My thought for you is to buy the kit this time and learn how to do the job. Then next time you can just buy the new seals/rings and do it yourself. I used my old end caps as spares by installing new seals/rings on them and putting them in a safe place for next time.
I hope I helped.

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On the HIGH TIDE-II, wife Carolyn and I.....Another summer fishing on the HIGH TIDE II in the Cook Inlet at Cape Ninilchik, Alaska.

HIGH TIDE-II; 2005 26' ProAngler; 2003 200 Honda / 2009 9.9 Honda high thrust
No. CD026021I405; AK-5008-AK
MSSI No. 338143486(cancelled)

HIGH TIDE; 1983 Angler Classic 22'; 90 Honda/ 9.9 Tohatsu-sold 2009 to son Dan (flatfishfool)
Stolen & stripped in Aug. 18
Bare hull & trailer sold in Nov.
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Darkwater



Joined: 12 Feb 2008
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City/Region: Fort Bragg
State or Province: CA
C-Dory Year: 2008
C-Dory Model: 22 Cruiser
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PostPosted: Tue Apr 19, 2016 4:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Last year I found one end of my SeaStar ram was leaking fluid onto the splash well. Disappointing for a boat with only 80 hours on it (2008 model). Both shafts looked very shiny and like new and the seals looked very new also. I contacted SeaStar Solutions technical help and they were very helpful. They said seal failure is often caused by corrosion on the shaft, due to salt water caught around the seal by surface tension, and the boat sitting idle for long periods. Then when the boat is used, the corroded area makes tiny cuts in the seal. They advised that replacing only the seals may be a very temporary solution if there is shaft corrosion. Would need all new or rebuilt ram.

In my case (shaft looked great), they advised me to very closely inspect the shaft for any tiny bits of corrosion, feeling for sharp points with finger or a piece of nylon stocking. Tiny areas of corrosion can be smoothed by gently working a very fine file, and you might not have to buy a whole new ram. Don't over-file. Sure enough, I found a single sharp point on each side of the ram, which could be felt but barely visible to the eye. I bought new glands with the special tool for about $80, smoothed the 2 sharp points, and so far so good.

They told me, after each saltwater use, good to rinse the ram while turning the wheel side to side, to minimize salt water left on the shafts. Also while boat is in storage periodically turn the steering wheel side to side.

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Darkwater Doug
Fort Bragg, Calif
Boat and fishing obsessed...
C-Ray 230DA sold Aug 2013
Retired Dec 2013
2008 C-Dory 22 Cruiser (unnamed) Jun 2014
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timflan



Joined: 16 May 2006
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City/Region: Seattle
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C-Dory Year: 2005
C-Dory Model: 22 Cruiser
Vessel Name: Two Lucky Fish +1
Photos: Two Lucky Fish
PostPosted: Wed Apr 20, 2016 12:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

OK, so there ARE some little hairline scratches in the chrome surface of the ram. Everybody says my seal replacement will be a short-term fix.

And not cost effective when the "seal kit" cost me almost $100 and a brand new entire cylinder assembly is only about $300. I'm going to replace the entire cylinder.

My big question now is: Can I replace my HC4600 with its designated replacement, HC4645H? Seems like that's the route, but I sure would love to hear from somebody who has made this upgrade.

Clarity: I'm replacing this...


with this...



Also, has anybody dealt with Fred Warner of Marysville, WA? He sells on eBay and has a website at http://www.fredwarner1.net/. Good price, and nearby, but I've never done business with him.
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timflan



Joined: 16 May 2006
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City/Region: Seattle
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Vessel Name: Two Lucky Fish +1
Photos: Two Lucky Fish
PostPosted: Thu Apr 21, 2016 6:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Part is ordered. Disassembly proceeding well.
By the way, there sure are a LOT of ways to sprinkle hydraulic fluid onto the clothing one's wife warned one not to wear while working on the boat.

Look ma! No steering!

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Kushtaka



Joined: 17 Dec 2013
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 22, 2016 1:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

If you have miles of tubing you can run your bleed hoses back to your helm and don't have to worry about the hydro fluid dropping too low in your funnel as you bleed. Just don't go so fast that the bubbles in the bled fluid can't rise before pulled into the helm. Also if you have old fluid that needs replacement, don't do this!
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timflan



Joined: 16 May 2006
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City/Region: Seattle
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C-Dory Year: 2005
C-Dory Model: 22 Cruiser
Vessel Name: Two Lucky Fish +1
Photos: Two Lucky Fish
PostPosted: Fri Apr 29, 2016 12:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks for the support, folks. I got the new cylinder today, and test-fit it. I LIKE the compact format they've adopted. The cylinder is exactly the right length, with about 1/4 leftover on each end when the engine pivots to it's mechanical stops. The instructions for my engine specify inverting the pivot plate, which was easily accomplished and helps maintain generous clearances at all engine tilt angles.

Anyway, this is proceeding well, so far. My next challenge is new tubing without spending $100 on the "kit" with a pair of 20' hoses. I need about 6-foot lengths to get to my autopilot pump. I'm going to drop by my local hydraulic shop with the cylinder tomorrow and ask how much to cut mine to length and put the proper fittings on the ends. Hard to imagine it would cost $100.
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Jazzmanic



Joined: 07 Feb 2005
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City/Region: Seattle
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PostPosted: Tue May 03, 2016 4:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

So I need to bleed my SeaStar Hydraulic Steering system. Having read the various threads and not having done so myself, I have a (dumb) question. Do I have to buy a 3/8" compression fitting with a bleed nipple in order to bleed the system or should it already be on my system. I don't recall seeing any bleed nipples. If I need to purchase, where do you recommend I buy from?

Peter
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journey on



Joined: 03 Mar 2005
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PostPosted: Tue May 03, 2016 5:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

If you're talking about the fittings at each end of the steering cylinder, they should be there. If not there should be caps, but I don't know why. If there are no caps there are no holes into the cylinder and I don't know that you can bleed the cylinder.

Any where they have the fittings is a good place to buy. A hydraulic shop is a good place to buy. Or you could try Teleflex.

Boris
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