Anchor Types and Uses

[cbadmin]

From: Mike (Original Message) Sent: 11/25/2002 10:05 PM
A discussion of anchors, and conditions for which the various types are best suited. Which style of anchors have you tried, and what style works best in the conditions you most often encounter?

From: Mike Sent: 11/25/2002 10:06 PM
B~C -

Have you had a chance to test out your new Fortress aluminum anchor since removing the mud plates? I am curious as to how well it works on the sandy Cloumbia River bottom. The galvanized fluke anchor I am using has worked every time for me, but I am wanting something a little lighter and less cumbersome to pull up through the bow roller with the windlass. It usually takes two or three tries to get the anchor to seat properly in the roller when retrieving. I do not like the clanging and banging it does as it comes over the hump at the roller. It looks like the Fortress, with the reduced weight and the narrow tapered shank would be a lot easier to stow.

Did you get the Fortress FX11 or the FX16? Any regrets?

Thanks,

Mike

From: kenonBlue-C Sent: 11/26/2002 6:23 AM
I bought the FX-16 which is rated for 33-38' boats so I figgured the durn thing should hold good without the mud palms on it, and it has. Besides being light weight and slender, it doesn't obstruct the view over the bow near as much as the old unit. The only down side is when the day comes that it gets fouled and I loose it, I'll be very sad.

From: Redƒox Sent: 11/26/2002 9:10 AM

The # one rated for the Prince William Sound is the CQR. Yes I want one, sort of a thing of beauty to me, it's made in Scotland, like part of me (Davidson Clan!) I settled for the much cheaper and shorter shanked Delta Plow style, it's sorta pretty, and the sigle fluked design is the least likly to get fowled by the anchors chain or other stuff down there! here is a little more on the CQR....
Proven Hurricane Hold Anchor
The CQR has very high holding power, proven both by independent tests and boaters around the world in extreme weather conditions where other anchors have dragged or failed altogether. Choosing the best ground tackle is inexpensive insurance for any boat, and will give you peace of mind in the most exposed anchorages and foul weather.
Chosen By Experts
In a recent survey of the Ocean Cruisisng Club, 87% of members chose CQR as a primary and storm anchor, based on thousands of mile of practical bluewater experience. The CQR is the best anchor suitable for most seabeds and weather conditions.
Only problem is, one cannot use it with a windlass because of its super long shank. If any of you guys plans on doing the Inside Passage, I would look into the Bruce or Plow designs and nothing else! They are the best for various types of sea beds.
greg


From: Mike Sent: 11/26/2002 5:38 PM
Greg -

If I had one of them CQR anchors, I think I would tie it to the boat and toss the windlass over. Now then, look at these test results (granted, they are on the Fortress web site).

I would like to have one of the light Fortress anchors, for the reasons stated previously But because I leave the boat at the marina for long spells during the tourist season, I will probably just keep using the $35 galvanized clunker I have now. It has never let me down, and it always comes back.

Mike

From: Redƒox Sent: 11/27/2002 8:48 AM
Do you think for a monent I will let that info go unchallenged! Mike that is agressive marketing on those (mud anchors) That is about all they are good for on these small boats. Maybe on some really big boats they have there place in various sea beds because of the anchor wieght and size, but the small ones better leave to the real anchors. (Bruce and Plow styles) And as far as a lite wieght anchore goes, same thoughts, I hope it's sand or mud your anchoring in, if you going to be anchored in a good blow. The problem is they pivot and don't have enough wieght in their flukes to bite into harder surfaces, so they just sort of skim along the bottom and don't get a good set. (that's my experience with them) They are mostly used in the rivers up here, or for anchoring set-nets here in the Cook Inlet. It is probably the best choise for the Columbia where your at though.

I had been blown off anchore when useing that style here in Alaska. just see how well they work in rounded rocks, in short they dont, but the bruce and plow designs do. True that stle has more holding power per pound than the others, but that is in mud. One is not always so blessed to anchore in those conditions all the time. So for these C-D size vessels that are going to be cruising the Inside Passage, beware.

From: Mike Sent: 11/27/2002 4:26 PM
Greg, The only reason I would toss the windlass over instead of the CQR anchor is because the windlass is probably cheaper! Nothing wrong with the anchor, I just wouldn't be able to afford to lose it.

Like I said, though, because it would be so easy to swipe an anchor on a moored boat, I'll probably just leave the galvanized cheapy hanging out front.

The Bruce style looks cool, and it most likely would launch and retrieve over the roller the best of any. Does anyone use one of those regularly in the Columbia or other sandy river bottom areas?

Mike

From: Redƒox Sent: 11/28/2002 10:48 AM
Anchors are indeed a big subject, and I'm sure it could draw quit a lot of opinions including mine.. hehe. I really agree with you about having a few hundred into a piece of art (CQR anchor) just sitting on the bow temting the temptable to make off with! There is a substitute one that looks almost exactly like it though, a 17 or a 15 pounder to, I think it was under 50. bucks!, verses the one from Scotland 200. some.
I also wanted to add here, another crucial feature of the Bruce and Plow designs... they have a place on the front to shackle the chain onto, so they can be tied with a piece of ganion twine on the shank, incase one snags it on the rocks and has to bust it out with a windlass or the boat. photo's explaining this feature will be posted latter.
Greg

From: Redƒox Sent: 11/28/2002 10:57 AM

Mike, I think Dale, on the C-Dogs, uses the same anchor I do, he has a windlass and the Delta anchor works fine on his C-D with a pivoting bow roller,(self launching) I know also the Bruce works well with them to, I believe that is one of the desirable features of those designs.

From: Fun Patrol Sent: 11/29/2002 5:22 PM
Yo Brats.....

My favorite is the Bruce, or Bruce knockoff. After literally thousands of nights (and days) at anchor, I found the Bruce held well and more importantly....reset well with a change in the wind direction, better than my CQR.

For straight line holding they all have their strong points. I like a Danforth ....or the expensive Danforth, the Fortress for a stern or 2nd hook. Lightweight, great unidirectional pull. But...these types almost always foul when the direction of pull changes and the rode tangles the anchor, as with a wind shift. Usually the "tests" don't deal with this very important aspect.

I have heard great reports on the Delta, a plow type without the swivel, but have not tried one yet.

They all have their weak points. The Bruce might pick up a "Bruce rock", one that fits inside the claws, effectively negating the burrowing action. You neutralize this by backing down firmly when you set. If you have a rock, it will not set. The CQR or Delta can hit a beer can or chunk of wood with the tip. The Danforth trips out.

One thing that seems to be universally true is that bigger is better. I use a 22 lb Bruce on Fun Patrol and sleep well.

Later....Roy

From: Mike Sent: 12/1/2002 3:17 PM
Roy -

I kind of like the looks of the Bruce anchor. It looks like it would always land on the bow roller with the heavy side down. The fluke style anchor comes up any old way it wants to, and takes some fiddling with the windlass switch to get it to stow properly. Simpson Lawrence makes one they call a Claw anchor that looks pretty much the same as the Bruce. It's a whole bunch cheaper, and I'm wondering if it is a good copy as far as efficiency goes? It also has an eye already in the shank for hooking it up with one of RF's suggested breakaway twine lash ups.

If I recall correctly, Dale (FishWisher) uses a fixed bow roller, and he added an additional wheel to it to facilitate self-launching of his Delta anchor. He seems happy with the Delta, but he uses all chain in his rode, so that may add to the anchors setting ability.

The Bruce or Claw would probably self-launch off of just about any type of roller. It might need to be held out a bit further to keep the points off the hull, but the pivoting roller I use would do that just fine.

I don't know - maybe I'll just keep using the old fluke style until it gives me fits for some reason. It is one size bigger than my boat length calls for, and it has worked everytime. Even holds its set through tide and current direction changes.

Mike

From: Fishtales Sent: 12/5/2002 8:01 PM
Before Fishtales arrived, I spent a lot of time looking at other boats in my area. 90% of them have a bruce type anchor. I went with the bruce. I have yet to drift while anchored, even with another C-DOG side-tied to me all night. You do have to be careful in rocky areas.

Roger

From: Fun Patrol Sent: 12/15/2002 9:27 AM
Mike:

Re: the Bruce anchor...

The "Claw" is a knockoff Bruce at half the price. The Bruce is not made of any particular "Space Age" alloy, and in this case, the knockoff performs just as well in my experience. The only caveat would be if you put them to a destruction test, it could be that one or the other would last longer with a buzillion pounds of pull. I think half-price for the same thing makes pretty good sense to most people.

Bringing a Bruce into a fixed bow roller is not a sure thing. I watched mine come up hundreds of times on the big boat, and 50% of the time it would be upside down, and I would have to manually turn it. The CQR with it's long shank, would turn properly almost all the time. Both anchors were shackled directly to 3/8 chain with no swivel. I think that with a good-working swivel, if one exists, you could play with it just as it comes into the roller and as soon as there was a little angle to the pull, ie not straight up, it would turn. Even with the self-launching roller, you may need to play with it a little as it comes over the hump. The Delta seems to be designed much better in regard to retrieval characteristics. The bend in the shank is their secret.

One note on the Danforth types, especially the Fortress. Some of the cruisers in Mexico and beyond have bent the flukes on their Fortress anchors as a result of only the tips setting in rock(s) and the subsequent pull bending the fluke(s) due to the lever arm involved.

More real world stuff you get at the bar and not in Chapman's! Drink hearty mates!!!!

Roy

From: "Nancy H" Sent: 12/16/2002 9:45 AM
Anchors,
Everybody has their own opinion about which anchor is best, so here are mine.
Bruce,
I use a 17.5 genuine Bruce on the bow and it is my favorite. The Bruce sets fast every time and doesn't drag except in very soft mud.
Claw,
A copy of the Bruce, but its made of cast iron and the Bruce is made of forged steel. I suppose the cast iron could be broken, but I don't think its likely with our small boats.
Fortress,
I tried to replace my old rusting Danforth with a Fortress. I couldn't get the Fortress to bite into the bottom. After trying with the mud plates it still wouldn't bite into the bottom so I returned it to West Marine.
Danforth,
I still use my 13 lb Danforth(slightly rusty, paint helps some) as my stern hook and for soft mud.
I think that a Bruce on the bow and a Danforth for stern anchoring and as a backup is the best combination for the West Coast and Inside Passage.
I use 300 ft of 7/16 line and 30 ft of 1/4 chain on each anchor.
Good anchors means a good nights sleep!!
Larry

From: Redƒox Sent: 12/16/2002 11:51 AM
Larry, that was a great report. I can ad though... Back before I knew about the trip twine idea on the bruce and plow styles, I had snaged my bruce (claw) actally, and had to break it free with the boats power. It did not break but bent. I would have expected the imitation bruce (claw) to break but it didn't suprizingly!
I use the Plow as my Main anchor with 600ft rode, and the bruce, with 300 ft for my stern, since it works well in small rocks that are on so many of the beaches I do. The danforth did not hold well in those condidtions.
So true about anchoring well.... the better your sleep!

From: Redƒox Sent: 12/16/2002 11:55 AM
A trick I have been cotemplating lately is, sharpening the flukes of the bruce and plow anchores I use. I read about it somewhere if one encounters hard sea bed surface, "it greatly enhances the performance of the set".

Anyone hear of this or do it yet??

From: Sea Wolf Sent: 12/16/2002 10:11 PM
Greg- One of the comments made by the manufacturer of the Fortress brand Danforth style anchors is that their anchors are precision machined and have sharper edges and points that make them work better than other Danforth type anchors. Joe

From: Fishtales Sent: 1/29/2003 7:48 AM
OK- Since I've used the BRUCE a few times, here are some thoughts, They do not always come up heavy side down, be carefull in rocky bottoms (they hook real good) and they do not self launch from the factory installed roller. I added a BRM-2 bow roller.
A friend and I went out to the Islands for the weekend and with one set of my hook, I was in for the night. My friend set his hook, and when I got up the next morning, he was stern in to my bow. He had drifted about 100 yards with his Danforth anchor.
When I drop the hook, I will set my rode at about a 3/1 scope and back down a bit to set it. I've never had to reset.

Roger

From: Joni Lynn Sent: 1/29/2003 2:43 PM
My experience with the Bruce anchor has been much the same as Fishtales. Of the many, many times we've anchored at the islands, I almost always got a good set with the Bruce on the first try and never did drag anchor once it was set, even through some pretty hard blows. One exception was when some yea-whoo fouled my anchor by dropping on top of it.....but that's not the anchor's fault. When anchoring bow and stern on crowded anchorages, the Bruce was always my bow anchor and a Danforth was off the stern. As opposed to Fishtales though, I tried to maintain at least a 5:1 scope, and when alone and having plenty of room to swing on one hook, I'd go for 6 and 7:1. If we ever have the occasion again to play out there, the Bruce will be my first choice.
Paul

From: 501-Sealife Sent: 1/29/2003 9:06 PM
I use the 14lb Delta on Sealife, launched remotely by windlass from the helm. I have 30 feet of chain and 250 feet of rode. Also carry a Danforth stored in the motor well for a stern anchor. I think the 14lb Delta is overkill, but feel very secure anchoring with it. Usually let out at least 3:1, more if the anchorage area permits swing, or if crowded, set out my stern anchor to prevent swing. Because of our boat's flat bottom and susceptability to the wind blowing us around, the stern anchor works well. The Delta sometimes comes up upside down, even with the special swivel I have. I've learned to raise and lower it a bit to straighten it, and am thankful that the roller is securely attached, because when it comes up backwards, it drops back down with a bang! I've attached a photo of my setup.

Mike - Sealife
Anchor-3.jpg

From: tonka Sent: 2/2/2003 4:07 PM
A question to those of you using a Bruce. I want to store an 11 lbs Bruce on the bow. The standard C-Dory anchor roller is intended, I understand, for Danforth type anchors only. Is there a way of making it work for a Bruce or must I install a BRM-2. I plan to manually launch and retrieve. Thanks for your thoughts.

Duane

From: 501-Sealife Sent: 2/4/2003 5:47 PM
Duane,

See message #18 in this thread from Fishtales.

Mike - Sealife

From: Fishtales Sent: 2/8/2003 9:01 PM
Duane,
I used the factory bow roller with my bruce for about six months. When I took it off, it was tweeked pretty good. I might add that I also use a Horizon 600 windlass. The bruce got hung on some rocks and I had to give it a go from several different angles before it came lose. 1) if I had been raising it by hand, it would not have tweeked the roller 2) if I had been raising it be hand, I would not have raised it!

Roger

From: C-ATTL-Angler85 Sent: 10/7/2003 9:39 PM
Lots of great advice, but only a couple of comments on the size. From all I've read, sounds like the Bruce is the way to go off the bow, with the Danforth in the back. I have a 22ft Angler, and want to be able to stay overnight in the SanJuans. Recomendations on anchors sizes and rope length welcome. I bought 200 ft, but sounds like that is really not enough to stay overnight securely. I was shopping at West Marine, and they had and expensive Danforth for 85, and a cheaper copy for about 40 I think. The biggest difference I saw was the more expensive version was welded down the middle, and the cheaper one had each side bent in an opposite direction. On my '85, there is no anchor locker in the front, so I'm also wondering the best place to store all that rope. Oh yeah, and how much chain also, I was thinking about 12-15ft of 3/8.
Thanks in advance,
Vic

From: Mike Sent: 10/7/2003 10:06 PM
I use the cheaper copy of the Danforth on my 22' Cruiser. It works really well in the Columbia river, even in strong currents, where the bottom is sand/mud most places. I am not sure about the bottom type in the PS, so that is best answered by the northern folks.

I have 300' of 1/2" rope and 15' of 1/4" chain. The most rode I have ever used was about 250' in 60' water with a strong current.

Before I got the electric windlass, I used an old fashioned plastic milk crate sitting on the bow and held in place with some light rope. It worked pretty good to stand up through the front hatch with me feet in the v-berth to pull the anchor in and coil the line into the crate.

Mike

From: C-ATTL-Angler85 Sent: 10/7/2003 10:34 PM
Thanks Mike,
What size anchor do you have? I also have several of the old dairy crates, which are tough plastic with all the holes for the rope to dry out; great idea.
Vic

From: Mike Sent: 10/7/2003 11:02 PM
I use the No. 13 anchor. I guess that means 13 pounds, but it sure feels heavier than that. It is rated for a 35' boat, the next sze up from the one sized for our boats, but the guy at the local marine store recommended that size for the river current.

Yep on the dairy crates. The one I found had a metal bar around the top, and I shackled a snap hook to it to clip onto the chain to hold the anchor up. To protect the deck, I found a long rubber floor mat and cut it to fit the bow, with a cutout for the cleat and around the bow roller. It ran from the point of the bow back to under the crate. That way, the chain never touched the gelcoat.

Unless you're a young man, the windlass is the only way to go. The guy on Raven (another 22 Angler without the anchor locker) is going to put a bulkhead in the nose so he can use a windlass. It would be easy to do. It doesn't need to be structural, so a peice of any old thing you can seal to the sides and floor inside the point of the berth will work. It only needs to go half way from the floor to the underside of the deck. Then, of course, you'll need a locker drain through the hull. Here in the river, if a guy wants to go sturgeon fishing by himself, a windlass is almost a must because someone has to be at the helm when the anchor pulls free. A good way to get a windlass quicker is to injure yourself just to the point where you can still fish but your wife has to take anchor pulling duty. The same folks who look at you funny while she is up front struggling with the anchor will look at you with envy when you pull the anchor yourself from the helm seat.

Ain't boats fun?

Mike

From: Chuck S Sent: 10/8/2003 4:09 AM
Assuming I can borrow a 1/2" drill I'll be putting the anchor line hawse pipe fitting on the bow of my 16 Cruiser this weekend. The bulkhead is there on this model, I just need to remove part of the styrofoam floation to allow a place for the line. Looks like an hour project -- once the right tools get here.

-- Chuck

[Redƒox]

Anyone ever try sharpening their anchor fluke on a plow style anchor? Well I have, and I'll report here, it's a big advantage!!