How about...a Marinaut 25?

Les Lampman · Posted: Wed Sep 28, 2011 7:30 pm Post subject:

Here's a teaser. This is NOT the final design, in fact it's just the preliminary concept:

One of the main changes would be a lower cabin top and this one was drawn at 25' 5" rather than 25'.

Les

Rob & Karen · Posted: Wed Sep 28, 2011 8:54 pm Post subject:

Les,

Tell us about the 27. Maybe that is the one I need to wait for.

Rob

Grumpy · Posted: Wed Sep 28, 2011 9:40 pm Post subject:

Yes!!

I guess the mention of 27 was a "freudian slip". It certainly makes your end objective very much clearer for me. Cool

and I honestly hope that your sales / income projections for the current model will allow you to progress to the 24.999 and a 27 without diluting your potential for any model. Right now I imgine you have a significant investment to show some ROI on.

Having spent my life "adjusting" NPV calculations to convince investors and board members that we really needed to make product "x", NOW, I feel for ya!!

I very much like your concept of a baseline plus modular options and you certainly have a good range of background data to work from if you compare RF's with Ranger and CD's. It's easy to see where the top and bottom of the equation are but it's a PITA to figure out the sweet spot in the middle is (or rather, where it will be when you bring the product to market).

Dylan said it right... (Bob Dylan that is, Not Dylan Thomas)

Merv

Will-C · Posted: Thu Sep 29, 2011 7:27 am Post subject: How about...a Marinaut 25?

I'm not sure many of the guys with the older pickup trucks have a 100k to drop on a new 25 1/2'er. They might buy it used when its ten years old. I'd quit half stepping and build the full blown 27. I would think you want to be shooting for the guys who can afford new pickup trucks. You know the ones that Ranger is selling to. Besides you don't want you new design sitting by the side of the road behind a broke down used up tow vehicle.Just my 2 cents. I have a 23 I would want to to move past a 25 if it was right and it was still trailerable. The Rangers are two tall for my taste. I would love to see a 27' that sits as low as a 22 or a 215 does in the water. You know like a cross in between a C-Dory and a Bertram Build it they will come.
D.D.

Les Lampman · Posted: Thu Sep 29, 2011 10:29 am Post subject:

Les Lampman · Posted: Thu Sep 29, 2011 10:40 am Post subject: Re: How about...a Marinaut 25?

Les Lampman · Posted: Thu Sep 29, 2011 10:56 am Post subject:

I'm conflicted. (Sheesh...sounds like a sitcom.)

I started down the path of a larger Marinaut thinking about just making the 215 about 30" longer to accommodate a head compartment, and that would have made the boat about 24' in length.

The next iteration was to give it a bit more length, split between the v-berth and cockpit, and to make it 6" wider. That's about where we are with the M25.

Now some seem encouraged by the thought of an M27.

I'm beginning to suspect that having just one more model isn't going to address all the needs/desires out there. But at this time I can't address two models at once so I've got to pick one model and go with it (for now).

What do you think folks are looking for in general? I'm not so naive that I think there's really a single answer but I wonder if there's a specific part of the market that's not being addressed and where some demand exists.

So the three choices, at least as I see them now, are:

1) A slightly larger 215 that would essentially be the same boat but would have a head compartment. Call it an M24 or M246.

2) A larger boat that would compete (at least space-wise) with the C-Dory 25, the Ranger Tug 25, and (to some degree) the RF-246. Call it an M25 or M256.

3) An even larger boat with full long range cruising capability and would still be towable (and 8' 6" wide). Call it an M27.

Keep in mind that the goal (for me) is to keep any model looking like a Marinaut; that is, with a low profile and pleasing proportions. Due to our construction method the goal is also to keep the boats light (for their size), keep the horsepower requirements low, keep the handling characteristics that the M215 has, and to build them to a high quality standard.

I'd love to hear what folks would choose (even if you're happy with and going to keep your current boat).

Thanks much,

Les

nymariner · Posted: Thu Sep 29, 2011 11:31 am Post subject: M27

My vote is for a fully cruise ready M27 to do the Great Loop with.
Hopefully it will be lighter & more fuel efficient than the Rosborough 246 & the Ranger Tug 27 and have better
handling.

Will-C · Posted: Thu Sep 29, 2011 11:34 am Post subject: How about...a Marinaut 25?

I wonder why Ranger built a 27' when they already had a 25'? And they seem to be selling. No wider than 8.5 so it's still trailerable. I'm thinking slightly bigger galley, a little more counter space hey how about an oven plus a slightly larger cockpit so you could entertain like six people? I'm sure there are a lot more reasons, spots for an inverter, diesel heater, not a wallas, diferent stove options maybe a propane locker.
D.D.

Don and Brenda · Posted: Thu Sep 29, 2011 11:46 am Post subject:

I agree on a cruise ready 27. Definately a larger head with a sink, remember the women will definately have ideas. For the PNW Wesbasto heater, larger water capacity, as in the Cutwaters they have propane cooktop and small propane tanks in the cockpit. Microwave/convection oven combo, hanging closet. Not sure if a walk through transom can be added with an outboard and kicker configuration.

Matt Gurnsey · Posted: Thu Sep 29, 2011 12:09 pm Post subject:

There you go Les- you've opened Pandora's box!

I wonder what a 27 would have over a 25 if it didn't have a bigger beam. We sold quite a few Shamrock 270 Mackinaws and that was a very nice boat. Number one request- berths for four.

Which gets back to the double wide dinette. My gut instinct is that if you were going to go 27, you should go wider. lots of guys towing 9' to 9.5' boats down the road. If you're going to go 27, then go all the way with a full blown cruiser, and weight be damned.

Then the 25 becomes the "just right" for many of the buyers, with the 215 being "too small" and the 27 being "too big".

Of course that would mean a 27 that would be pushing the $160 to $170 mark, and it will need to be a very refined boat. bare fiberglass interior probably wouldn't cut it at that price point.

Which brings to mind the Venture 29. Which I thought was a neat little boat, and certainly a different direction for C-Dory when they tried it, but I think the boat with very few changes could have worked. I think it could have been a decent seller, just not to the existing C-Dory owner group. It would ahve required a whole new marketing plan to bring in new buyers.

I don't envy you this- there is no right or wrong answer here. Although the four person dinette seems to be a huge request. Wink

The next big question- is anyone ready to get a checkbook out and order one?

Dene · Posted: Thu Sep 29, 2011 12:27 pm Post subject:

Les,

Loving this conversation. Having owned a 22' and a 27 footer, let me throw in my two bits.

1. I think having a 4 person dinette is a waste if it involves eliminating storage or passage room. On the Devlin and Campion, the table sits in the garage. We used tv or laptop trays. With guests, we go to the cockpit and use deck chairs.

2. I wouldn't go with a 27 footer and a 8.5 beam. Looks funky. Also, the handling could be whacked. I'd go with a 24 or 25 foot length and keep it trailerable. The CD 29' was a mess, in my opinion.

Consider Tollycraft. Their best seller was the 26 footer. It's gone and so is the Venture 26, which is my favorite CD. Replace them and you could find a real solid marketing niche. I wouldn't consider the Ranger boats serious competition. They are slow boats...not suitable for fishing or fast cruising.

What size would be the berth on a 25 footer-ish boat?

-Greg

rogerbum · Posted: Thu Sep 29, 2011 12:33 pm Post subject:

If you were going to do a 27' Marinaut, I'd look for something that's quite a bit different and go with a layout and design that's similar to the (one-off?) 27' C-Dory that Aviq has. That's a completely different boat and I can't think of a competitor to it in the current marketplace. I and several others here have lusted after this boat. I don't quite know exactly why, I just think it's a cool cabin design that provides for a lot more room.

Dene · Posted: Thu Sep 29, 2011 12:35 pm Post subject:

Some sort of settee with a table would be easy to do. In fact it would be easy to have a settee along the port side with a nice copilot seat forward of that. Depending on how much aft port locker (closet) you felt you'd have to have the settee could be long enough to be a comfortable berth. Or a place to stretch out, melt into a corner, and read. Lots of things are possible without a lot of expensive custom work.

Les[/quote]

Yep...the L-shaped settee you describe is on my Devlin and we loved that. It gave us lots of options. Double berth....lounging....dining for two...or a table for the laptop. For me, the forward facing Admiral seat is a must too. Nice to have two sets of eyes looking forward.

-Greg