How about...a Marinaut 25?

[Aurelia]

[b]Anyone figure out the added weight/cost of a full blackwater tank (That should start some discussion).
Merv[/quote][/b]

Thats just one of the reasons why I took ours out. I have dealt with external holding tanks on RVs and boats and hate them. Porta-potti, over-under tank, or composter are all good solutions on boats this size. And pumpout fittings are great as well provided there is space for hose routing.

[Dora~Jean]

I too had my holding tank removed, actually had them not install it in the first place, my porta potti is just fine, actually wonderful for my needs. No shower either, I prefer the sun-shower and let it run overboard out the scuppers. I've tried to keep my boat light.

I VERY satisfied with my CD25, but have made a couple of mods to accommodate my usual 4-7 people per trip (the 7 number is usually with a couple of 8-10 yr olds). The mods have worked out very well for us.

I made alternate/extended positions both of the settee seats towards the aisle by making an "alternate" position for carrying larger groups. I utilized the wasted seat space that tucks under the side walkway/well. We seat 4 adults at the table, the rear seat being a bit tight so we put the smallest people there . You can see this mod in my photo album here starting with the 10th picture: http://www.c-brats.com/modules.php?set_albumName=album664&op=modload&name=gallery&file=index&include=view_album.php.

I also built a new table out of the same materials as factory (melamine on both sides at home depot, 2 ft wide), but extended it's length by 7 inches (I think). Yes, it interferes with the aisle passageway when you have to pass another at the sink/stove area -- but hey, we're all family, right? A better solution would be a folding extension section like Bob suggested.

I'm reluctant to put 2 kids on the dinette at night for fear of one of them falling to the floor (it has happened), or use a bed-guard that can be purchased that tucks under the seat cushions and provides a short barrier -- too much hassle. So I put an adult on that bed, 2 adults up front with 1 or 2 kids, works fine, and another on the floor. If carrying 7, we put 2 adults outside in the cockpit under the bimini on an air mattress, and that works good also here in sunny SoCal.

[Les Lampman]

Hi Steve,

Thanks for the great ideas! I think we can work with the sliding seat top idea quite well. The extension on the table isn't difficult to deal with either.

But...here's another questions for y'all:

Right now (as it's drawn up) the forward seat on the passenger side is a helm seat just like the operator's side. It's the same arrangement we use on the Marinaut 215; the copilot seat swivels and slides fore-and-aft.

My question is...would you give that up (would your co-pilot) to have another double seat there?

Les

[starcrafttom]

Steve have you given any thought to just putting the kids in a tent on the beach. they would love it I'm sure. Wehn ever my son james brought freinds with him thats what we did. they get a little freedom experince the out doors and I get a good nights sleep.

sorry for the side trip back to the boat designs.

[A Fishin C]

I like the idea of the Marinaut 25. It fills the niche between the 23 and 26 Venture. 90% of the time I fish with buddies, 10% of the time I take my wife and kids to play.

I say,

stripped down to keep it light and cost effective
shower, hot water, don't care if the head is pump out or portable
light to tow with my pathy (6000lbs tow capacity)
Dinette and berth for 4 eat/play card and two sleep. double seat copilot

Stefan

[Aurelia]

A double seat with reversing ability like on the 25 cruiser would be fine instead of a single helm-like seat. Be smart on the height so users don't have to sit on a huge booser to see out the front window under way. The height sucks on our 25 and raising that whole side would have increased the storage below as well.

[rogerbum]

I too would like to have table that 4 people could eat at. This is something I would use quite often - especially when on a long fishing trip. I fished 4 guys out of the Tomcat quite often this summer. The way the Tomcat is configured, the forward bench seat is wide enough (just barely) to seat 2 but the aft bench seat is too narrow for that. As a result, at all lunches and dinners, one guy ate standing up or sitting on a chair in the cockpit. That's one of the reasons I was so interested in the jump seat on the prototype M215. Two jump seats like that + a small foldout table extension would have made meals on board much easier. Typically at meal time, everyone but the cook/server is sitting down so the loss of some aisle space isn't a big deal.

Also, I agree that being able to sleep 2 on the converted table berth would be a plus for families with 2 kids. Even in the Tomcat, we can only comfortably sleep 3 - 2 in the main birth and one on the table berth. More than that requires a cot in the cockpit or a tent on shore. Finally, anything you can do to make the back of the bench seats adjustable fore to aft so that a normal human can sit on them would be greatly appreciated. In almost all boats I have seen, the goal of making the seats/table into a bed has over ridden the goal of comfortable seating and the seat bottom cushions are far to deep for comfortable seating. We often wind up sticking an extra 4" + cushion behind our back to make it work.

[tpbrady]

Les,

I understand weight and efficiency are inversely related, but when I moved from a 22 to a 25, the thing I noticed the most was the stability of the 25 in seas compared to the 22. The mass of the 25 prevented 2-4 foot seas from pushing it around very much. Sometimes in my 22 I wish I had a seat belt. Will shaving 1500 lbs from the operating weight cause a significant change in cruising comfort as sea states increase?

[Chester]

[Rob & Karen]

Les,

I was surprised to see that you are not competing with Ranger Tug or CD25, with no shore power, refridgerator, water heater, or the like. I guess I misunderstood the intended mission of the boat. If it is really going to be a CD22 or M215 with a head compartment, then it seems like we are talking about a $20k-$30k head....which is not something I would be willing to pay for. When I think of a larger boat, I am also thinking of something that I will be more comfortable spending extended time on while cruising. I am looking for the comforts that you plan to omit. It sounds like I may not be your target customer.

Rob

[Les Lampman]

[Les Lampman]

[Les Lampman]

By the way you all...this is helping me tremendously. I just wanted to take this opportunity to say THANK YOU!!!

[Will-C]

Why not just make a 26' boat. It should not have to be a deal breaker with the additional weight. It does not have to weigh as much as a Rossie. The boat could be sold stripped or loaded. One of the things about Ranger Tugs is they had almost all the options people would want available through the factory. With an extra foot you could carry more fuel maybe have a generator compartment that if it was not used it could be used as storage or for additional water. I'd grab the extra foot and work on being able to provide the boat in a couple standard configurations. Having the extra room for options like inverters, solar panels, extra batteries stuff cruisers need. Maybe instead of a larger dinette make a fold out table option for the cockpit. I mean Ranger has done alright selling the new 27' models and they sell for 200k. I'm thinking for the difference in price above the 215 you have the chance to build in things that will make people want folks to make the leap up to the 26' boat. A stripped fishing scow in that size has a pretty limited market. Why cut yourself short?
D.D.

[Les Lampman]