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Aurelia



Joined: 21 Aug 2009
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City/Region: Gig Harbor
State or Province: WA
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PostPosted: Wed Dec 29, 2010 2:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I agree and could easily live with the 55%. With dual permatrims out back, I can get some serous bow steerage with my current tabs deployed much less than 100%. A can actually do it with the Permatrims alone as well. I am like Tom and mainly need it for side to side and a little bow tuning sometimes. The QL design would have the added benefit of saving me a set of Zincs multiple times per year and also shave a foot of length off my bottom service every three months becuase the current tabs collect the most growth.

Less weight
Better control panel
Likely better following seas handling
Possibly better backing handling
cleaner stern for fishing (if I ever get around to it)
less marine growth issues
simpler maintenance and reduced complexity of system

Some negatives exist no matter what you do and the reduced overall trimming potential could be addressed by increasing the width or number of interceptors if space is available.

I think that comparison document was comparing two types of the same width so the overall trimming potential could be increased with wider/more interceptors. Depends on the boat and use of course.

Anyone know off-hand how wide the trim tabs are on the standard 25?

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Aurelia - 25 Cruiser sold 2012
Ari - 19 Cruiser sold 2023
currently exploring with "Lia", 17 ft Bullfrog Supersport Pilothouse
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Sea Wolf



Joined: 01 Nov 2003
Posts: 8650
City/Region: Redding
State or Province: CA
C-Dory Year: 1987
C-Dory Model: 22 Cruiser
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PostPosted: Wed Dec 29, 2010 2:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Tom-

Sounds like we've come to some agreement! Hug Rose Hug

As you know, the engineer & science types are never satisfied until they think they've got it all figured out, quantified, and designed and engineered with a 400% safety margin, and , finally, all the $$$ accounted for an in the bank! (overstated only slightly) Wink

Besides the gas weight issue, you probably have some torque tilt from the engine/prop twist.

If you really only need the extra lift on one side, why not put both tabs one the same side? Laughing

Or just forget the trim tabs/adjusters and get a second, additional wife (a really big one!):
She should also be good a baiting hooks, netting fish, and raising crab pots and anchors, too!
What's not to like? Smile

Joe. Teeth Thumbs Up

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"Most of my money I spent on boats and women. The rest I squandered'. " -Annonymous
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starcrafttom



Joined: 07 Nov 2003
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City/Region: marysville
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PostPosted: Wed Dec 29, 2010 4:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
additional wife (a really big one!):
She should also be good a baiting hooks, netting fish, and raising crab pots and anchors, too!
What's not to like?



the really big part Shocked

in the words of my lovely wife. " I dont care what you look at but anything of yours that touchs is subject to removel... Shocked" besides she can fish bait clean drive and trailer the boat.

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http://tomsfishinggear.blogspot.com/
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Aurelia



Joined: 21 Aug 2009
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City/Region: Gig Harbor
State or Province: WA
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 20, 2011 7:07 pm    Post subject: Not gonna do it Reply with quote

Well, with the boat needing a haulout soon for some motor work, the opportunity is presenting itself to switch tabs but I am not going to do it.

Why?

I still think they are likely a great product and would do the job for our boats but after much thought and more importantly some reflection on our local boating conditions, I am sticking with traditional tabs.

The reason is debris in the water. We drive through small debris all the time in the puget sound and no matter how hard I keep watch, there seems to be an occaisional larger bit that contacts the boat as well. We have coasted over a 30ftX 6inch piece of wood and very recently got a boomerang shaped piece about 5 feet long and 4 inches in diameter hooked on the transoms at speed. I can tell you that was a strange feeling and it makes me fear for the health of a pair of interceptor trim devices on my boat at least the way we are using it thus far.

I think a good chunk of wood could easily torque one of those tabs and knock off the alignment enough to cause binding issues and I am not pulling it out of the water just to fuss with that. I have this fear because I have read reports of their sensitivity to mis-alignment.

Smooth stainless it is for now simply for durability sake. Good discussion and thanks for your willingness to fight my persuasions.

Greg
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hardee



Joined: 30 Oct 2006
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 20, 2011 7:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Gregg,

I think you are onto something there. The T-tabs are sure less likely to get ripped off by some piece of flotsam. This thread has gotten me to thinking I might need to look into the Permatrims though.

Thanks,

Harvey
SleepyC Moon

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rogerbum



Joined: 21 Nov 2004
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 20, 2011 10:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

hardee wrote:
Gregg,

I think you are onto something there. The T-tabs are sure less likely to get ripped off by some piece of flotsam. This thread has gotten me to thinking I might need to look into the Permatrims though.

Thanks,

Harvey
SleepyC Moon

Harvey, I went for years without the permatrims on my 22 and only added them when Les suggested them as a solution to fixing a missing piece of my starboard engine's cavitation plate (it got knocked off a few summers ago when a down rigger ball launched off the back in big seas).
After i had them installed, I wished I had done it much sooner. The two things you'll immediately notice are:
1) an ability to push the nose down some when going into modest chop - this smooths out the ride considerably. Is it great like a deep V? No, but it's much better than before especially at those "awkward speeds" between 10 and 16kts where the boat transitions to planing.
2) A MUCH faster transition to being on plane. W/o the permatrims, there's considerable bow rise prior to it rolling back down as you get on plane. With the permatrims, the bow rise is minimal.

The cost wasn't too much if I recall - around $200/ea and a fairly minimal install fee. Give EQ Marine a call and ask for a quote. You'll be happy with this mod.

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digger



Joined: 02 Nov 2003
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City/Region: Spokane
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 20, 2011 10:39 pm    Post subject: Trimming the boat (side to side) Reply with quote

Funnythat no one mentioned the need for trimming the boat when dealing with side forces of wind. Many of the worse trim conditions I've encountered was when I was tacking against a port or starboard wind. That would cause my boat to have many trim difficulties that I'd address with tabs...however, as I tab to flatten the boat it had the effect to exacerbate the steering requirement (sort of like dragging one foot on a sled or ski to steer in that direction). Gusts were the worse. Anyway, since this subject seemed to be coming to closure, it only seemed fair to throw another log on the fire. Ron Smile
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starcrafttom



Joined: 07 Nov 2003
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 20, 2011 11:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

it looks I too will go with the standard tabs. after a lot of looking and figureing and tape measure work I dont think the QL's will fit the boat. I would have to alter the the plug on the tabs or alter the boat. I feel fine doing both but it makes susan queasy when I stand to close to the boat with the welder or the grinder.
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Yellowstone



Joined: 07 Feb 2006
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 21, 2011 1:01 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Joe mentioned lengthing the hull in effect with standard tabs, and I believe that is a valid point. My sense is that tabs take up some of the shock when going into chop, not just the bow. Another feature that tabs have when fully extended at slow speeds is to reduce hull speed ever so slightly when docking which almost always is helpful.

John

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