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Tortuga
Joined: 01 Apr 2008 Posts: 318 City/Region: Ventura
State or Province: CA
C-Dory Year: 1994
C-Dory Model: 22 Cruiser
Vessel Name: Tortuga
Photos: Tortuga
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Posted: Sat May 23, 2009 9:03 pm Post subject: Fuel Conditioner... what type?? |
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I know there has been lots of discussion on this in the past, but when I went to pick up a bottle today I came away stumped. Do I get fuel stabilizer? water absorber? ethanal treatment? all three?
My boat doesn't sit for more than a few weeks, but the gas can last for several months between fill-ups. I don't have any problems, but with the ethanal issues I've become a bit concerned. Is there a good basic stabilizer that accommodates ethanal?
Thanks for any suggestions.
Matt _________________ Tortuga
Ventura, CA |
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Dreamer
Joined: 01 Jan 2006 Posts: 1764 City/Region: Really Sunny SaddleBrooke
State or Province: AZ
Photos: Dreamer
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Posted: Sat May 23, 2009 10:44 pm Post subject: |
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Matt,
Without having your own lab, I'm not sure how you can tell for sure what's best for you. Here's what I use in the boat and their PRI-D for the truck. http://www.priproducts.com/pdfs/Flyer%20-%20PRI-G.pdf _________________ Roger
Once a C-Brat, always a C-Brat
Dreamer- Sold 25 Feb. 2013 |
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thataway
Joined: 02 Nov 2003 Posts: 20875 City/Region: Pensacola
State or Province: FL
C-Dory Year: 2007
C-Dory Model: 25 Cruiser
Vessel Name: thataway
Photos: Thataway
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Posted: Sat May 23, 2009 11:07 pm Post subject: |
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Stabil is the "standard". I have also used the Pri G (or D) and Startron (Soltron). They all seem to work to some degree, and certainly prolong the useful life of gas. But you cannot make gasoline out of water....I have been adding all three recently, since I have some 6 month old fuel in the C Dory and probably will not use that for another few months. I used this combo in my 18 foot CC and it seems to work well. _________________ Bob Austin
Thataway
Thataway (Ex Seaweed) 2007 25 C Dory May 2018 to Oct. 2021
Thisaway 2006 22' CDory November 2011 to May 2018
Caracal 18 140 Suzuki 2007 to present
Thataway TomCat 255 150 Suzukis June 2006 thru August 2011
C Pelican; 1992, 22 Cruiser, 2002 thru 2006
Frequent Sea; 2003 C D 25, 2007 thru 2009
KA6PKB
Home port: Pensacola FL |
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Comfortably Numb
Joined: 30 Aug 2007 Posts: 146 City/Region: Greenville
State or Province: IL
C-Dory Year: 2008
C-Dory Model: 22 Cruiser
Vessel Name: Comfortably Numb
Photos: Comfortably Numb
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Posted: Sun May 24, 2009 12:07 am Post subject: |
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Sea Foam (www.seafoamsales.com) has been a magic elixir for me. If I could drink it, I would...but, I shouldn't...so, I won't....drink it, I mean. _________________ Mark
Comfortably Numb
Governor Bond Lake
Greenville, Illinois
“For this is how the suicide of nations begins, when sentimentality prevails over sense.”
- Roger Scruton |
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Tortuga
Joined: 01 Apr 2008 Posts: 318 City/Region: Ventura
State or Province: CA
C-Dory Year: 1994
C-Dory Model: 22 Cruiser
Vessel Name: Tortuga
Photos: Tortuga
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Posted: Sun May 24, 2009 12:22 pm Post subject: |
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Thanks for the suggestions.
Quote: | I have been adding all three recently, since I have some 6 month old fuel in the C Dory and probably will not use that for another few months. I used this combo in my 18 foot CC and it seems to work well |
Does this mean that they can all work in tandem without counteracting each other or otherwise diluting the fuel? |
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Levity
Joined: 02 Nov 2003 Posts: 204 City/Region: Shippensburg
State or Province: PA
C-Dory Year: 2003
C-Dory Model: 22 Cruiser
Vessel Name: Levity
Photos: Levity
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Posted: Sun May 24, 2009 4:33 pm Post subject: |
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Matt,
My boat sat from mid November '08 until mid April '09 with two half full tanks of an ethanol/gas mixture stabilized with Startron. Either I was lucky or the stuff worked cause those two half tanks have been run through the engine without incident.
Mike "Levity" |
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thataway
Joined: 02 Nov 2003 Posts: 20875 City/Region: Pensacola
State or Province: FL
C-Dory Year: 2007
C-Dory Model: 25 Cruiser
Vessel Name: thataway
Photos: Thataway
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Posted: Sun May 24, 2009 4:48 pm Post subject: |
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I looked at the chemistry (and I have been following Startron for some time--it susposedly is enzymatic)--and I don't see anything which will interact adversely. Each seems to work slightly differently.
There are other additatives, which I use--such as Ring Free in my Yahama 115.
As for SeaFoam, I have not used it. I see it used directly into the intake, into the crank case oil, into brake lines in cars, into the gas in high concentrations etc. I have thought it was for decarboning and cleaning, but I suspose that it may also help with older gas? Heck, I might throw some into my diesel truck just for good luck~! |
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journey on
Joined: 03 Mar 2005 Posts: 3598 City/Region: Valley Centre
State or Province: CA
C-Dory Year: 2005
C-Dory Model: 25 Cruiser
Vessel Name: journey on
Photos: Journey On
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Posted: Sun May 24, 2009 6:26 pm Post subject: |
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I'm also wondering what additives to dump into Journey On's fuel tank. Now, we have E-85 which has alcohol, and we all clearly understand that alcohol absorbs water. Going up to out-of-the-way places, the gas probably comes in at the start of the season, and that's what you get, even if it's 6 mos old. So it seems prudent to use something.
And outboard manufactures have recommendations. Here is Mercury: Mercury Marine Fuel Discussion. And here is Evinrude, etc.: Evenrude Fuel Rest assured they don't like the new fuel, but don't offer specific guidelines except have a filter and use their fuel stabilizer.
Now this discussion is on fuel treatment seems to be focused of stabilizers such as Stabil, and other stabilizers. I've used Stabil for years when the fuel was sitting for months, such as in the bike's tank. And that worked well. But E85 not only can gum up/destabilize, but the alcohol can absorb water. Reading the label on Stabil for Ethanol, it says nothing about emulsifying (or absorbing) water. It stabilizes and conditions E85, as well as rebuilds your engine, but nothing about water which can and has killed EFI.
One recommendation is to seal the tank. This certainly isn't feasible; around here you'd have a collapsed tank. So I've been adding STP gas treatment every once in a while, since this has always worked for me in the past, albeit with regular fuel. I also religiously check the fuel filter/settling bowl that C-Dory has graciously supplied.
Anybody have any other ideas about how to combat water in the tank? I'd love to hear them.
Boris |
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Rob & Karen
Joined: 24 Nov 2006 Posts: 353 City/Region: Franklin
State or Province: TN
C-Dory Year: 2007
C-Dory Model: 22 Cruiser
Vessel Name: Life of Riley
Photos: Life of Riley
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Posted: Sun May 24, 2009 7:42 pm Post subject: |
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Boris,
This is from the Star Tron description:
The enzyme package in Star Tron disperses water derived from normal condensation into microscopic clusters, and allows the water to pass through the fuel system and engine harmlessly, preventing the buildup on the tank bottom that can contribute to poor performance, fuel gelling and corrosion. If large amounts of water are already present it will be de-emulsified and drop out of the body of the fuel, improving overall fuel performance. Over a period of time, with fresh gas loads treated with Star Tron, even large accumulations of water will be totally eliminated.
Rob |
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thataway
Joined: 02 Nov 2003 Posts: 20875 City/Region: Pensacola
State or Province: FL
C-Dory Year: 2007
C-Dory Model: 25 Cruiser
Vessel Name: thataway
Photos: Thataway
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Posted: Sun May 24, 2009 8:47 pm Post subject: |
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The scientific data on Startron (or the various other names) is pretty thin.
There is lots of testimonial material. The MSDS shows that over 99.5% of the compound is aliphatic petroleum distillates. and less than 0.5% of the enzamatic chemical propeirtary organic chemicals...which is the core of the Startron.
Some of the companies own studies show that a ratio of 1 oz for 16 gallons, a one hundred gallon tank will be protected for ONLY up to 5 oz of water. This is not much "protection"--
I used it for over year in my diesel trawler (twin Cat 3208's). Zero difference in fuel economy or visiable smoke.
The only story I have personal knowledge of, is a friend had some 20 year old diesel which had geled (a small built in tank which had been forgotten) He had what we think is Startron put in the tank in Spain, and then sailed across the Atlantic. Upon arriving home, the diesel was liquid enough to be pumped out of the tank. It was not just that passage, since the boat was on its second circumnavigation.
So does it really help or not? I don't know--but I doubt if it absorbs much water. Enzematically breaking down fuel hyrdocarbon chains? I wonder. Could be. |
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Rob & Karen
Joined: 24 Nov 2006 Posts: 353 City/Region: Franklin
State or Province: TN
C-Dory Year: 2007
C-Dory Model: 22 Cruiser
Vessel Name: Life of Riley
Photos: Life of Riley
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Posted: Sun May 24, 2009 9:04 pm Post subject: |
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Right now I am using Mercury Fuel Treatment & Stabilizer, which runs about $0.26 per gallon of gas. Star Tron, Sta-Bil and PRI-G run between $0.04 and $0.08 per gallon of gas, so I am thinking of switching when I run out of my current supply. Between the three brands, is it just a toss of the coin?
Rob |
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Comfortably Numb
Joined: 30 Aug 2007 Posts: 146 City/Region: Greenville
State or Province: IL
C-Dory Year: 2008
C-Dory Model: 22 Cruiser
Vessel Name: Comfortably Numb
Photos: Comfortably Numb
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Posted: Sun May 24, 2009 11:06 pm Post subject: |
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Hey, Dr. Bob -
Did you read the narrative on Sea Foam ("Why It Works") at
http://www.seafoamsales.com/motor-treatment/why-it-works/index.html ? This sort of discussion may make more sense to a fellow like you (as opposed to a fellow like me).
I know this stuff has a following on the Great Lakes, too. It is supposed to be good at combating the effects of ethanol, but I have no proof...just good results using it primarily (as to intention) as a fuel stabilizer. My Jet Ski has been a great test of this, I think.
I have no financial interest of any kind, direct or indirect, in Sea Foam.
Regards,
Mark |
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rogerar
Joined: 10 May 2008 Posts: 146 City/Region: SW FL
State or Province: FL
C-Dory Year: 1999
C-Dory Model: 22 Cruiser
Vessel Name: Duck
Photos: Duck
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Rob & Karen
Joined: 24 Nov 2006 Posts: 353 City/Region: Franklin
State or Province: TN
C-Dory Year: 2007
C-Dory Model: 22 Cruiser
Vessel Name: Life of Riley
Photos: Life of Riley
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Posted: Mon May 25, 2009 9:46 am Post subject: |
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Roger,
Can you share the results of the test? No need to copy the whole article, but showing how they ordered the five products would be helpful.
Thanks,
Rob |
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El and Bill
Joined: 08 Nov 2003 Posts: 3200 City/Region: Lakewood, CO
State or Province: CO
C-Dory Year: 2000
C-Dory Model: 22 Cruiser
Vessel Name: Halcyon
Photos: Halcyon
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Posted: Mon May 25, 2009 9:50 am Post subject: |
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I use Stabil and it works fine for me. Cheers Bill _________________ El and Bill (former live-aboards)
Halcyon 2000 CD 22 Bought 2000 Sold 2012
http://cruisingamerica-halcyondays.com/ |
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