Permatrim---thumbs up or thumbs down?

[SENSEI]

first of all, welcome Phillip to the C-Brats and thank you for posting about the your experience with the permatrims.

secondly, watch out ya"ll, the OFFICE ****'S are at it again

[digger]

I believe if the permatrim rests at a level equal to the bottom of the boat, cavitation problems will not occur. It is possible that the prop hub is spinning. I'd try another prop before coming to the conclusion that the permatrim is causing problems. I had one on my 22 and with it I was able to raise the motor one hole higher without problems. Ron

[dotnmarty]

Welcome Phillip. I agree with you about the Permatrim. I love what it does but equally, what it is-it has no moving parts and it's simple to install. It's elegant, the best $100 item on my boat.

[TyBoo]

It really saddens me that such a valuable thread is now likely to be closed because a few people are unable to hold back impulsive comments. For the good of the community, if you have something to prove and feel it best proven through a biting remark, kindly remove the C-Brats.com link from your list of favorites and post your remark somewhere else.

Mike

[marvin4239]

Seabeagle I expect your permatrim may be to low and your cavitation problem may be something related to the prop itself perhaps a spun prop. If you look at the picture of Lizzies permatrim while it't hard to tell at rest the permatrim appears to be pretty high. I had the permatrim on both my previous 16 and my current 22. On the 22 when I first installed it I noticed a slight decrease in top speed and RPM. I raised the motor until the permatrim was parrallel with the bottom of the boat and it was about 1/4 inch above the bottom. In my case this was one hole. This restored my preformance and actually enhanced it from before the permatrim. I never experienced cavitation with either boat. The only adverse change I found was at anchor on the 22 in a two foot wind chop I was hearing a strange poping sound. It turned out to be the permatrim seemed to hold the transom down in the sea and made this wierd poping sound as the waves splashed against the bottom of the swim step. This only happens if conditions are just right. It's hard to do but it may help to operate the boat at WOT and examine the position of the permatrim in relation to the water surface. You don't want it out of the water but as close to the surface as possible.

[wannabeowner2]

Frankly, Tyboo, speaking as an internet poster on several business forums out there the level of discourse even on your more "unruly" threads is much higher/politer than average.

Steve

PS Trust me, everyone is a big man on the internet when they are typing on a keyboard and hiding behind a computer monitor.

[lloyds]

I finally purchased a permatrim last month for my 16' cruiser and installed it last week and tested it this weekend. Install was really easy, took all of a half hour. When I tested it I discovered some other problems in that the tach isn't working and neither is the tilt/trim indicator but I went for a ride anyway. The permatrim is much more effective than the dolefin that was on the boat. (if someone wants a dolefin for a honda 50 you can have it for the price of postage). It comes on plane with almost no bow raise. Turns just fine, without cavitation, planes somewhat easier and at a little lower rpm. Have to get the tach working so I can see just how much better but it is substantial. I did notice that if you trimmed all the way in apparently you can almost make the bow plow, as the steering starts getting pretty heavy. But it does exactly what they claim. Couldn't be happier with it.

[SEA3PO]

One really interesting thing....before I installed the Permatrims I could not get the motors up to full rpm.... once installed I found that by triming the motors I could get much better rpm and speed.... it was not off by much....but was much easier to trim with the Permatrims and everything seemed easier... I am not sure if my motors were just to forward before or what...I just never noticed much difference...now I really notice..
Well worth having..

Joel
SEA3PO

[Sea Wolf]

Joel-

Very interesting observation!

Might be that the extra planing surface added by the twin Permatrims allowed the boat to ride higher in the water at speed and reduced the drag enough to let them wind up for a little more rpm(?).

Just guessing!

Joe.

[lloyds]

I also gained about a knot of speed. Might even be better if I hadn't been burning last years fuel.

[flrockytop]

I finally got around to installing the Permatrim on my Suzuki 115 and CD22. I found no difference in rpm or top speed but Oh what difference on getting on plane. Mine does as Lloyds, It comes on plane with almost no bow raise. Turns just fine, without cavitation. I now use the trim tabs only to level left to right. In short, well worth the $. IMHO.
I wish that I had installed before the Western Grand Slam trip but I wanted some hours with out so I could compare. Looking back now. It would only take 5 min with and without to know it is a winner.


Roger

[rogerbum]

I had permatrims installed in Sept. on the twin 40's I have on my 22. Les at E.Q. did the install. So far, I like them. The boat definitely gets on plane quicker and I didn't see a loss in RPM or top end speed. With twins, the permatrims make it fairly easy to do lateral trimming also. The only downside I see is that lateral trim is pretty sensitive at speed and it's easier to get myself in trouble if the engines are too different in height at high speed. E.g. unless I have things evenly trimmed, the handling gets a little squirrelly at at the top end.

[Rick from Maine]

I don't have trim tabs.

I installed a Permatrim this summer after reading on this site that it smoothed out the ride in choppy water, which isn't unusual in ME coastal areas.

I definitely can cruise faster without pounding in a a chop. The Permatrim is a huge improvement at keeping the bow down and smoothing the ride in chop.

I didn't notice any change in top speed or WOT RPM.

But...., there's often a but. I did experience a downside. When cruising at high speed, if 2 -3 people run to one side to check out a seal, eagle, or other sight, the boat will swerve and turning the steering wheel normally will not correct it. It seems as though the heeling due to the weight shift makes the Permatrim act like a rudder and causes the boat to turn on its own.

I had experienced some minor slews when Carol ran to take photos during our downeast cruise, but didn't recognize the cause. While cruising with another couple on board, the current seemed to be setting us to port toward a buoy in Hockamock Bay. I turned the wheel to stbd. 3 people then suddenly went to the stbd side to check out a seal, causing the boat to go to port toward the buoy. I had to really crank the wheel to veer away from the buoy. I never experienced anything like that before the Permatrim.

So, from my experience it seems like the Permatrim can act like a rudder during heeling situations at high speed.

Rick from Maine

[thataway]

Rick,
your experience is not unique. This is why the Permatrim is a great addition to boats which have the trim tabs--they will prevent what you noticed.

[C-Hawk]

Installed the permatrim and took the boat out for a couple hours today.
I noticed a huge difference in being able to get on plan quicker and the fuel monitor showed better fuel economy the before
Also noticed better handeling at slow speeds in the harbor- didn't wander as much.
With the twin 40s on the old boat there was no wandering at slow speeds, but I noticed quite a bit with the single 90 on the new boat. It now tracked better with the permatrim.