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Foggy
Joined: 01 Aug 2013
Posts: 1526
City/Region: Traverse City; Northern Lake Michigan
State or Province: MI
C-Dory Year: 2014
C-Dory Model: 26 Venture
Vessel Name: Boatless in Boating Paradise
Photos: W B Nod
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 Posted: Sat Aug 01, 2015 9:33 pm Post subject: |
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As with most alcohol, be careful what you do with it.
Internally, with moderation, well you know...
I almost became a statistic years ago 'borrowing' my
dad's Sea Ray with a pressurized alcohol stove I figured
was the best way to cook a fish I caught. No instruction
manual. No experience. Just pumped'er up, tuned the dial
and light a match...
Well, I'm glad to be here to tell you that was one of the most
frightful experiences* I've encountered on board as I swore
I was dancing with the Grim Reaper Himself in Dante's Inferno.
Short story even shorter, I put it out with only burned cabin
carpet headliner and smelled like a burned chicken from my
singed body hair.
No. No. No, alcohol stoves for me.
Aye.
* I've come close to repeating that nightmare experimenting
with grilling 151 rum soaked goodies on my Big Green Egg.
Grandma used to say, "Play with fire and you will get burned."
_________________
"I don't want any cake" - said no one ever.
If someone tells you they don't eat cake, unfriend them. You don't need that kind of negativity in your life. |
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Sunbeam
Joined: 23 Feb 2012
Posts: 3990
City/Region: Out 'n' About
State or Province: Other
C-Dory Year: 2002
C-Dory Model: 22 Cruiser
Photos: Sunbeam
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| Posted: Sat Aug 01, 2015 10:33 pm Post subject: |
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| Foggy wrote: |
I almost became a statistic years ago 'borrowing' my
dad's Sea Ray with a pressurized alcohol stove ...
No. No. No, alcohol stoves for me. |
One note though is that the Origo alcohol stoves are non-pressurized. Of course one should exercise caution with any fuel/flame combo, but the non-pressurized stoves are not nearly as "exciting" as the pressurized ones. |
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kennharriet
Joined: 22 Jan 2009
Posts: 512
City/Region: Grangeville
State or Province: ID
C-Dory Year: 1999
C-Dory Model: 22 Cruiser
Vessel Name: Lochsa
Photos: Lochsa
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| Posted: Sun Aug 02, 2015 12:47 am Post subject: |
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| Agreed Sunbeam. The risk associated with using the Origo stove would be similar to that of handling a can of sterno. ken |
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smittypaddler
Joined: 30 Jun 2004
Posts: 337
City/Region: Neenah, Wisconsin
State or Province: WI
C-Dory Year: 2004
C-Dory Model: 22 Cruiser
Vessel Name: Na Waqa
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| Posted: Sun Aug 02, 2015 10:53 pm Post subject: I replaced Wallace Stove with a 2-burner Origo |
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| I replaced my Wallace Stove, which, when it worked, was great, but always broke at the worst of times, like when it was 45 degrees out, damp and raining, and with half a pound of raw bacon in the skillet. Each time I had to ship it back to the manufacturer for repairs. I wonder who dreamed up a circuit board for an onboard stove? I replaced the Wallace with a 2-burner Origo alcohol stove, and I couldn't be happier. It has two moving parts, and if it ever breaks I'm confident I can fix it myself. I use 180-proof rum for fuel. I also keep on board a Coleman propane camp heater that works fine, but I don't trust it enough to keep the windows closed when it's in use. It doesn't heat the cabin as well as the Wallace did, but I won't have to ship it back to the factory if it breaks; it's cheap enough, I'll just buy a new one. |
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localboy
Joined: 30 Sep 2006
Posts: 4664
City/Region: Lake Stevens via Honolulu
State or Province: WA
C-Dory Year: 2007
C-Dory Model: 25 Cruiser
Vessel Name: 'Au Kai (Ocean Traveler)
Photos: 'AU KAI
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| Posted: Mon Aug 03, 2015 2:57 pm Post subject: |
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I've been contemplating this switch over: alcohol stove & diesel heater. But at this point we decided to just hold onto the Wallas until I retire in 5-7 yrs. We don't cook enough on it now, so it fits the bill. We have never had "an issue" with it...yet.
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"We can go over there...behind the 'little one'....."
Wife to her husband pointing @ us...from the bow of their 50-footer; Prideaux Haven 2013 |
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Leon
Joined: 21 Nov 2011
Posts: 30
City/Region: Terrace
State or Province: BC
C-Dory Year: 2011
C-Dory Model: 23 Venture
Vessel Name: Sea Nile
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| Posted: Mon Aug 03, 2015 5:17 pm Post subject: alcohol fire |
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| Water should dilute the alcohol and put out the fire, that is suppose to be one of the good points of using alcohol stoves on a boat. |
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Sea Wolf
Joined: 01 Nov 2003
Posts: 8650
City/Region: Redding
State or Province: CA
C-Dory Year: 1987
C-Dory Model: 22 Cruiser
Vessel Name: Sea Wolf
Photos: Sea Wolf
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| Posted: Mon Aug 03, 2015 6:53 pm Post subject: Re: alcohol fire |
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| Leon wrote: | | Water should dilute the alcohol and put out the fire, that is suppose to be one of the good points of using alcohol stoves on a boat. |
LEON- From the post a few days ago:
| thataway wrote: | | kennharriet wrote: | Alchohol is very safe in that it can be extinguished very easy by smothering or with water.
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Be cautious with water and an alcohol fire. The alcohol is lighter than water and floats on top of the water spreading the fire. I had to board a boat to help out with a fire (pressurized alcohol, spraying and they had thrown water on it--spreading the fire thru the cabin. It was a chartered boat, and the occupants were medevaced to a burn unit, and the charter company told to come and pick up what was left of the boat! |
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Sea Wolf, C-Brat #31
Lake Shasta, California
  
"Most of my money I spent on boats and women. The rest I squandered'. " -Annonymous |
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B~C
Joined: 31 Oct 2003
Posts: 2865
City/Region: Bend
State or Province: OR
C-Dory Year: 1999
C-Dory Model: 22 Cruiser
Vessel Name: Blue~C
Photos: Blue~C
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| Posted: Mon Aug 03, 2015 9:55 pm Post subject: |
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Big D, I sent you a pm
_________________
Ken
1999 22' boaterhome |
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Karl
Joined: 15 Apr 2008
Posts: 210
City/Region: NORTHERN
State or Province: NY
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| Posted: Tue Aug 04, 2015 7:37 pm Post subject: |
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| kennharriet wrote: |
Denatured alcohol is ready available in any hardware store, Walmart, etc. It runs about $15 per gal. |
This makes little sense to me...I must be missing something.
You can buy E85 "gasoline", which is 85% alcohol for just over $2/gal.
Why should 100% alcohol cost $15 gallon? Based on gasoline costs (without ethanol), the alcohol content in E85 should be about $1.50/gal., not 10x that amount.
As far as I know, denatured alcohol is ethanol, with additives to prevent its consumption as a beverage, and thus exempt from liquor taxes.
Also, I believe motor fuel ethanol subsidies have ended, so that wouldn't explain the 90% difference in cost either.
Also, wondering if E85 would be safe in an alcohol stove, or, if not, is there a simple way to remove the 15% gasoline from E85%?
Or, is my math a little rusty? |
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rogerbum
Joined: 21 Nov 2004
Posts: 5922
City/Region: Kenmore
State or Province: WA
C-Dory Year: 2008
C-Dory Model: 255 Tomcat
Vessel Name: Meant to be
Photos: SeaDNA
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| Posted: Tue Aug 04, 2015 8:13 pm Post subject: |
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| Karl wrote: | | kennharriet wrote: |
Denatured alcohol is ready available in any hardware store, Walmart, etc. It runs about $15 per gal. |
This makes little sense to me...I must be missing something.
You can buy E85 "gasoline", which is 85% alcohol for just over $2/gal.
Why should 100% alcohol cost $15 gallon? Based on gasoline costs (without ethanol), the alcohol content in E85 should be about $1.50/gal., not 10x that amount.
As far as I know, denatured alcohol is ethanol, with additives to prevent its consumption as a beverage, and thus exempt from liquor taxes.
Also, I believe motor fuel ethanol subsidies have ended, so that wouldn't explain the 90% difference in cost either.
Also, wondering if E85 would be safe in an alcohol stove, or, if not, is there a simple way to remove the 15% gasoline from E85%?
Or, is my math a little rusty? |
There's no simple way to remove the 15% gasoline from the E85. Fractionation by distillation would get you there if you know what you're doing and have time to mess with it but there are much cheaper sources of ethanol around. 85% of $2 = $1.70 so the math is just a tad rusty but close enough for government work and the point you were trying to make.  You can buy denatured alcohol in 5 gal drums for about $30 but the shipping on them is another $50. The extra cost of shipping flammable materials is what helps to drive up the price.
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Roger on Meant to be |
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anchorout
Joined: 03 Jul 2013
Posts: 357
City/Region: Lake Charles
State or Province: LA
C-Dory Year: 1999
C-Dory Model: 22 Cruiser
Vessel Name: EZ DUZIT
Photos: EZ DUZIT
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| Posted: Tue Aug 04, 2015 8:19 pm Post subject: ethanol |
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As for alcohol floating on water, perhaps the alcohol spray was igniting before merging with the water. The whole reason for alcohol being safe to use on a boat is that when water is introduced to an alcohol fire it dissolves into and smothers the fire. I thought this was a chemical fact. Please advise.
Why take a chance, these wick type stoves are safe and do a great job of cooking, though they do add moisture to the cabin.
I need some help on this E15, E10 blend. My understanding, and apparently the US Government's as well is that the 15% is the alcohol in the blend, not the amount of gasoline. https://www.fueleconomy.gov/feg/ethanol.shtml
Again, please advise.
OBTW: I also use rum in my alcohol stove.
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I DON'T KNOW WHAT I'M LOOKING FOR - That's what makes the search so exciting!
Last edited by anchorout on Tue Aug 04, 2015 8:46 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Karl
Joined: 15 Apr 2008
Posts: 210
City/Region: NORTHERN
State or Province: NY
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| Posted: Tue Aug 04, 2015 8:40 pm Post subject: Re: ethanol |
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| anchorout wrote: | | Am I not correct in saying E85 is 85% gasoline and 15% alcohol. |
Negative. E85 is 85% ethanol and 15 % gasoline (AKA "Flex Fuel").
My math was slightly off due to the wide local discrepancy between E10 and E85 pricing, and the fact that so few stations even offer E85...I can't easily monitor E85 pricing because no stations nearby sell it...and I used the last remembered price...but E10 has fallen sharply in the past week here in town. No idea what E85 is this week...seems like a poor idea anyhow, due to the poor mileage it produces, and I believe loss of horsepower as well.
The main customer locally is the state govt., trying to prove a point. State police won't touch it, despite their new fleet being mostly flex-fuel.
[anchorout: it appears you have edited you post to delete the portion of it I just quoted...] |
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localboy
Joined: 30 Sep 2006
Posts: 4664
City/Region: Lake Stevens via Honolulu
State or Province: WA
C-Dory Year: 2007
C-Dory Model: 25 Cruiser
Vessel Name: 'Au Kai (Ocean Traveler)
Photos: 'AU KAI
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| Posted: Tue Aug 04, 2015 8:56 pm Post subject: |
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I think it's all a gov't conspiracy. They want us all at home, in the dark with no heat and needing a bike to get anywhere. All the while they party, fly around the globe and laugh...
I'm kidding...sort of. |
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anchorout
Joined: 03 Jul 2013
Posts: 357
City/Region: Lake Charles
State or Province: LA
C-Dory Year: 1999
C-Dory Model: 22 Cruiser
Vessel Name: EZ DUZIT
Photos: EZ DUZIT
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| Posted: Tue Aug 04, 2015 9:08 pm Post subject: E85 |
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Karl: Of course we are right. The E in E15 and E85 does denote Ethanol content. I don't pay much attention as we readily get nonethanol down here and I don't have to worry about it ruining my engine. God help you if you screw up and put that E85 in your OB, or am I wrong?
"We're from the government and we're here to help." |
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Karl
Joined: 15 Apr 2008
Posts: 210
City/Region: NORTHERN
State or Province: NY
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| Posted: Tue Aug 04, 2015 9:55 pm Post subject: Re: ethanol |
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| anchorout wrote: |
OBTW: I also use rum in my alcohol stove. |
Where do you buy rum for under $15/gal? And I think the highest proof is 151, meaning it's about 25% water. The only 151 rum I ever see is Bacardi, and it's quite expensive...guessing over 10x the cost of alcohol stove fuel, maybe even 20X as expensive, unless bought in Bermuda.
Will alcohol stoves burn isopropyl? I believe that's cheap at truck stops. |
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