honda BF90D surging in mid RPMs

skiptowns98033 · Posted: Wed Jan 14, 2015 11:26 pm Post subject:

I'm in the middle of trying to resolve this exact same problem. Both Carl at EQ and the mechanic at Cap Sante Marine think it's the ECM. What's disappointing to me, a 1st time Honda owner with an engine that IS out of warranty but only has 400 hours, is that
1) There's no definitive test to point to the ECM. It's a process of elimination. In my case even a 400 hour service didn't solve the issue tho Honda continues to suggest that it needs further investigation.
2) If I DO replace the ECM and the problem isn't solved, Honda won't allow a return of the the unit
3) There are no trial units that could be plugged in to see if that does solve the problem.
4) They won't even consider selling it at anything less than full retail.

What this means is that spending $1,000 on a new ECM may or may not solve the problem, there's no way to know in advance and Honda is going to profit on fixing their own faulty equipment.

I am VERY unhappy with Honda for the way they have handled this issue and can't imagine a repeat purchase of a Honda in my future.

ssobol · Posted: Thu Jan 15, 2015 7:44 am Post subject:

There is a service bulletin from Honda that says to replace the ECM for this problem. I think the number is 61. You might try pointing out that their own company says this it's the issue. I might try calling the regional service manager.

In my case they probably spent way more money eliminating all the other possibilities before changing the ECM than it would have cost them just to do it in the first place. Honda should have a couple of company ECMs that they can sent around to service centers for test use when diagnosing this problem. The internal cost of the ECM to Honda is peanuts compared to other things in the company. It's not like replacing your ECM or having a few for test use is going to break the company.

I was fortunate to get mine repair a couple of months before the warranty expired.

20dauntless · Posted: Thu Jan 15, 2015 8:28 am Post subject:

Sea Wolf · Posted: Thu Jan 15, 2015 11:20 am Post subject:

Question:

Can an ECM be switched around from motor to motor w/o issues?

I know some record data all the time, such as hours run, rpm, temperature, oxygen levels, fuel consumption, etc. (At least my Yamaha 90 does.)

Does the ECM know what motor it's on? Does it know it's been switched?

When switched back, will it still work normally?

Can you just switch out an ECM like an ignition coil or something else simple?

Maybe that's why Honda doesn't provide ECM's to substitute test with???

Just wondering ............? Disgust

Joe.

ssobol · Posted: Thu Jan 15, 2015 11:49 am Post subject:

I'm sure the ECM records a lot of stuff. But there must be a mechanism to set/reset it for installation on a different engine. I don't think that willy-nilly swapping between engines is a good idea. However, Honda should have a "test" ECM that they can use for diagnostic testing. It would probably just need to be reset or initialized when put on a different engine.

Link to the service bulletin (you'll need to register on the site): http://www.hondapartsus.com/forum4/service-bulletin-61-a-th2199.html

skiptowns98033 · Posted: Thu Jan 15, 2015 12:00 pm Post subject:

Thanks for the offer of the ECM but I 'd be worried that something would happen. I agree they [i]should[/i] have some units available to definitively diagnose the problem but they don't. I get that I am out of warranty but would have liked to believe that at 400 hours, there could be some accommodation made for price. There is an online company, www.partspak.com that has them priced much more reasonable and will allow returns.

"Honda marine" has been added to my list of companies to avoid in the future.

BrentB · Posted: Thu Jan 15, 2015 1:16 pm Post subject:

Honda parts at
http://www.hondapartsus.com/forum4/service-bulletin-61-a-th2199.html

has the bulletin online for registered users

\Sorry I cant access it

ssobol · Posted: Thu Jan 15, 2015 3:03 pm Post subject:

Honda SB61 now in the C-Brats document library

http://www.c-brats.com/viewtopic.php?t=22540

The SB does say

skiptowns98033 · Posted: Sat Jan 31, 2015 3:15 pm Post subject:

After repeated pleas to Honda for some consideration on an out of warranty engine with only 400 hours on it; a test unit to confirm the problem, a discount to their cost (seems unfair they would profit on a known issue), the option of returning it if a new ECU wasn't the issue, they adamantly refused to help.

A new ECM from partspak.com DID solve the problem. Cost was 40% less so I saved about $400 and they DID have a return policy discounted for a restocking fee.

I'm glad Plan C is ready to go, I am VERY unhappy with Honda's customer service!

ssobol · Posted: Sat Jan 31, 2015 4:10 pm Post subject:

Maybe some tweeting is called for. Seems that this gets a pretty quick response from some companies.

If you tweet that you are very unsatisfied with Honda's customer service, the part of the company that sells cars might take some notice and might help resolve your issue, rather than take the chance your comments might affect some car sales. The BF90 is based on the engine in the Fit car.

RobLL · Posted: Sat Jan 31, 2015 9:21 pm Post subject:

Honda does many things very well, so very well it always seems surprising with the number of things they do very poorly.