Anchor Drum Winch

[Donald Tyson]

For overnight I do plan to anchor only along the route, we have always liked this. We also fish a lot so it is nice to be able to move sites quickly. I prefer the 'concept' of drum windlasses. But I've never personally used one. I have used many a winch in both Capstan and spool while logging or other. It seems this will work great...in concept.

Thanks for the tip of using netting for the spare anchor rode stored in the deck pipe.

[Donald Tyson]

By the way, a little vote here. When all the chips are down,what is the smallest diameter rode that feels okay in hand. Is it 3/8, 7/16 or 1/2”? In an imperfect world, which would be the smallest you would be comfortable with?

[ssobol]

[Donald Tyson]

On this Drum Windlass, the GX-1, I realized why the anchor rode is not tied off....maybe over-night, certainly not when hopping around during the day. Inside the motor the drive gears are made of a metal which is claimed to be many times stronger that the normal bronze gears. The gears are worm gears that stop turning the minute you stop pushing the button.

[thataway]

Yes the worm gears hold the line--just as the worm gears will hold a 14,000 Lb boat on my boat lift. (7,000 per side way more than any anchor will hold.

Back to shock absorbing: how are you going to manage that?

I had a Danforth HT 12 with 300 feet of 3/8" nylon double braid. I have also had some 3/8 inch sheets and halyards on my racing sailboats. No problem, although I tend to wear gloves with using the smaller lines, or lines which might run fast for some reason. Winches take the ultimate load with the sheets and halyards.

[Donald Tyson]

Great observations using the lift as an example.

I really am not sure how to handle shock. That is new to me. Never needed it before but suspect I'll need some sort of shock absorbers in some of the more exposed anchorages on the loop.

I may just use 3/8" line. It only holds 130'+/-. That is good for 16-20'. Perhaps the very few times I'd find us in deeper water I could just add another 3/8 rode inline. I bet that on The Loop, with such a shallow draft vessel, I'd never add the extra rode.

Please give me some time to learn more. Perhaps the need for dampening cannot be overcome and that would not be so nice, I guess. Thanks you so much for your observations.

Am I close in saying that on The Loop there are very few times that we would anchor in water deeper than 16-20'?

[thataway]

If you are going to use the drum winch, then the synthetic line with chafe guard, and heavy chain or Kellet for shock absorption. This is sub optimal but may the best if that is the way our go.

With thousands of nights a anchor all over the World, I have never felt the need for a reel or drum rode. The problem is that it is very difficult to add more line for those times you have to anchor in deeper water. I have only done about half of the loop give or take--not the Hudson River to Illinois river--and the Tenn-Tom Bigbee water water. There are going to be few anchorages deeper than 20 feet on the ICW's and most rivers, but I suspect as you get up into the upper waters in Canada etc there will be deeper anchorages. One of the advantages of the C Dory is getting in close to shoal areas, but There may be that unusual anchorage. However I don't feel that you should limit yourself that much--there may be other places you want to go.

In the PNW and Channel Islands there will be many harbors which are deeper than 20 or so feet. The deepest I have consistently anchored in, is slightly over 100 feet--and that was with 200 feet of G4 chain, and 400 feet of nylon rode. The heaviest winds I have anchored in were about 90 knots. That is a wind you cannot stand up against. There have been nights I have put out 3 different types of anchor--and what had been holding when I set the anchors, was not necessarilly holding the next morning. When in heavy winds, we always have a person up and watching for our boat dragging or other boats dragging into our boat- or anchoring gear. It is not unusual, fot a boat which had anchored to weather of you, to drag over your anchor rode and trip your main anchor so now both of you are adrift. I have had that happen with C Dorys, on the St. Johns river.

Solution: wake the occupants of the other boat up--and disengage your anchor--go and re-anchor some where else. Just because you have good anchoring gear and technique does not mean that other boats do. I like some anchor like a Spade, Mantus, Valcun, etc. A large Danforth/Fortress type, for low cohesive mud and sand, Finally a fluke type of anchor (fisherman or Northhill pattern for grass or kelp where you have to get thru the grass into the bottom. I carried all 3 of these types on the bow ready to deploy in our long distance cruisng motor sailers. Each had a separate rode--the main rode was mostly chain--at least 150 to 200 feet and on a combination windlass chain wheel/gypsy. The others had short chains--no more than 30 or so feet--some less, and used a secondary windless, winch or capstan to bring the anchor up.

[Donald Tyson]

The owner of the G-1 Land Star winch said that he has sold many to halibut fishermen and they often fish while anchored in 2-300'. They use 4mm or 6mm Dyeema type line. For this deeper water they add a 600' piece on. At the end there is 25' of 8 or 10 mm piece of nylon which is for abrasion and then 20 or more feet of chain onwards to the anchor. Ironic. After Looping I will spend most of my time from Albany south and east in shallow water mostly.
I'm learning...

[Punkin Drublic]

Some great discussion/information here certainly to consider.

For me its ease of use anchoring multiple spots in a day between overnighting and various fishing locations. Often in cool, wet weather.

For halibut fishing I currently use a set up with a quick release line from bow to the release at a stern cleat so I can get off the hook in a hurry if need be. I utilize a buoy and rings for retrieval and to reconnect.

So maybe a drum isn't worth it.

More thought the drum would be handy when jigging and moving around various places lots but again, I've given a lot of consideration to 'spot lock' capable motors for this purpose. Easier than carrying different hooks for changing bottoms.

More to think about.

[Donald Tyson]

Punkin, did you see this?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t66J1uhBpMI

This guy sells specific to the Halibut fishery. Call the Owner. I have his Cell Number if you need it.

[Punkin Drublic]

Nice video.

Where/when I anchor for hali, not sure, but most likely will continue to use my stern release system for safety but also avoid tangling with the rode playing the fish. I also like to attach chum bag to my anchor so leaving it down is best.

The motor failure in video was certainly interesting. Wonder if that was a 1 off failure or if a truly poor design flaw.

In house testing but clearly a winner and runner up. Thanks for the phone # offer, but not ready yet, need the new boat first lol.

[thataway]

Interesting video--did not include reel winches by Lewmar or Muir who are mainstream windlass/winch builders. I probably have not included some of the commercial--many of those are hydraulic and used on fishing boats.

Salt water and electricity? The motor on the Lemar 700 etc are sealed and no electrical parts above deck.

How about level wind vs bunching up of line? No chain on these drums? 6 meter boats= 20'

Clutter of deck--see photo and consider that anchor rode (chain) would bang on deck--solution may be teak or SS tray for chain to lie on when not pulling, or be disconnected, but then you loose a primary function of an easily deployable anchor from the helm--to deploy in an emergency. I have not had to deploy an anchor in an emergency, but I have had to on larger boats, when there was loss of power or steering in a tight situation to keep the boat from crashing into other boats or ashore (on rocks).

Cost = 3 to 4 times of a Lewmar Horizontal axis? That is the most common windlass used on C Dory.

Here is a photo of what I believe is an EZ puller (?); my apology I don't remember the name of the C Dory


The anchor ball method of raising an anchor is quick and used frequently in many areas. There is a safety issue. I am aware of several deaths and injuries from a foot or leg being tangled in the anchor rode as the boat applies power (speed) to raise the anchor, and the person was thrown overboard, injured or killed. I don't have the citation at hand, but I believe I saw these on The Hull Truth a few years back. That should be preventable, but....

[colbysmith]

Speaking of anchoring and watching out for the other guy, something I passed along at Hontoon, and I'll mention here. When anchoring with other boats nearby, consider both wind and current, and then your DRAFT! Our boats don't draft much and will be more affected by wind than current. Other boats, with deeper drafts will be affected more by current. I learned this one night when the winds and currents were in opposite directions, and even though I thought I had put enough space between me and another bigger boat, it was fortunate that I woke up in the middle of the night, and gandered out my window to see that I was getting very close to the other boat. Not long after that, I pushed our boats apart before they touched and pulled anchor and went back to the dock. (Fortunately, I had my track in my chartplotter back to the dock. There was no way I would be able to re-anchor in the dark, among all the other boats. This is worth consideration, even if you plan ahead of time, as someone else could come in after you, and not consider how shallow our draft is, and anchor thinking we'd all be swinging the same way!

[Donald Tyson]

Colby, The beginner that I am, with reel boats, makes me glad that I have for 30 yrs chosen to use 8:1 scope for extra sleep. This allows me and has allowed me the benefit of pulling ahead in a crowded anchorage as another boat bears down on me while swinging. Most vacation boaters simply don't watch. I've been where you were at there and it is scary.

Ssobol, I tend to agree with the 3/8 as being the limit of what is comfy.

Punkin here is another video. Being from the tree industry I've always spliced my own backsplises, Eyes and joint splices. Never wanted to have from someone else's work. I always wondered how riggers spliced Dyneema and here is a video of this magic: https://youtu.be/UpkqJ4GRfSg

Bob, Where do you get all this info and experience, a young pup like you are. Very informative and helpful. This is a great post you made showing some of the shortcomings of the drum style. I had completely forgotten that there were hydraulic versions.
I had completedy forgotten about the Kellet and how testimonials for their use were so favorable. I'd think dyneema would benefit from such an item since it floats. That would be no matter which winch or windlass was chosen.

[Punkin Drublic]

For anyone else wondering what I was talking about re: quick release anchor system.
https://www.riteanglefishing.com/product-page/complete-halibut-anchor-system-6000
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=alnxr9itfVk

Theres other videos explaining and some variation to them. One thing I'll add is that the slide ring I added hose to it to avoid marking the hull and I also have a sock over the stern release snap for the same reason. An old wool sock that I can feel and open the release snap without fumbling the sock back/off.

And be sure when using a ball to retrieve, when you motor the anchor up, be sure that its up and the chain is through. Or else the anchor drops again lol. Ask me how I know, took me a few practices to get the hang of it in shallower water.