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Wood Zeppelin
Joined: 09 Feb 2016
Posts: 333
City/Region: Seattle
State or Province: WA
C-Dory Year: 1997
C-Dory Model: 22 Angler
Vessel Name: C-Creature
Photos: Childhood Dream
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 Posted: Fri Nov 24, 2023 6:47 pm Post subject: |
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| thataway wrote: | You can get a parts diagram for your motor by google. That will tell about the bolts.
You will most likely have to go to salvage yards or E bay to find the "used but in good shape" lower unit. You should always do a run out dial caliper on one of these to assure that the prop shaft is not damaged. If it is out of true, send it back. |
Yes, thanks for that reminder!
About the "bolts", let me refine my question... what I am wondering is: if there is an updated design on later models that replaces the internally threaded bearing retainer nut (with two bolts).. Because if so, I'd want to get one of those lower units? Anyone know?
_________________
James Salay - Real Estate Broker / Investor, Engineer, Artist, Fisherman, Canyoneer, Outdoor Enthusiast
Current boats:
1997 22' Angler - "C-Creature"
1988 16' Angler - "E-fishn-C"
1997 16' Cruiser - "Wet-a-Net"
Also:
14.5' Drift Boat - "Wood Zeppelin" |
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Wood Zeppelin
Joined: 09 Feb 2016
Posts: 333
City/Region: Seattle
State or Province: WA
C-Dory Year: 1997
C-Dory Model: 22 Angler
Vessel Name: C-Creature
Photos: Childhood Dream
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ssobol
Joined: 27 Oct 2012
Posts: 3483
City/Region: SW Michigan
State or Province: MI
C-Dory Year: 2008
C-Dory Model: 22 Cruiser
Vessel Name: SoBELLE
Photos: SoBelle
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| Posted: Sat Nov 25, 2023 11:14 am Post subject: |
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| Wood Zeppelin wrote: | ...
(c) What does the "D" in BF40D stand for?
...l |
"D" models are fuel injected. |
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Hunkydory
Joined: 28 Mar 2005
Posts: 2716
City/Region: Cokeville, Wyoming
State or Province: WY
C-Dory Year: 2000
C-Dory Model: 22 Cruiser
Vessel Name: Hunkydory
Photos: Hunkydory-Jay-and-Jolee
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| Posted: Sat Nov 25, 2023 12:02 pm Post subject: |
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The design changes occurred in 2008 & the new design with the o-ring & 2 bolts vs the screw into case will not fit the older ones such as you have. Mainly the shifter connection using a smooth rod in the pre 2008 with a splined shaft shifter in the 2008 & up prevents the interchange. There could also be other changes made that could prevent it.
_________________
Jay and Jolee 2000 22 CD cruiser Hunkydory
I will not waste my days in trying to prolong them------Jack London
https://share.delorme.com/JuliusByers |
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Wood Zeppelin
Joined: 09 Feb 2016
Posts: 333
City/Region: Seattle
State or Province: WA
C-Dory Year: 1997
C-Dory Model: 22 Angler
Vessel Name: C-Creature
Photos: Childhood Dream
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| Posted: Thu Nov 30, 2023 12:49 pm Post subject: |
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Ah, thanks... Good to know. That leaves me thinking my best options are:
(1) reconditioned or new
(2) a used one (preferably closer to 2008)
(3) a used one from freshwater |
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Wood Zeppelin
Joined: 09 Feb 2016
Posts: 333
City/Region: Seattle
State or Province: WA
C-Dory Year: 1997
C-Dory Model: 22 Angler
Vessel Name: C-Creature
Photos: Childhood Dream
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| Posted: Wed Feb 07, 2024 2:24 pm Post subject: |
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| srbaum wrote: | WZ,
Give a call to Atlantic Marine, they are wonderful people and truly Honda outboard experts. They specialize in selling and installing Honda's to the military, as well as to commercial and recreational boaters. They are also the go-to for rebuilt or new lower units.
www.atlanticmarineva.com |
Thank you. I called them and they were significantly more helpful that some of the local dealers in my area! I would also highly recommend them! |
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Wood Zeppelin
Joined: 09 Feb 2016
Posts: 333
City/Region: Seattle
State or Province: WA
C-Dory Year: 1997
C-Dory Model: 22 Angler
Vessel Name: C-Creature
Photos: Childhood Dream
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| Posted: Wed Feb 07, 2024 2:29 pm Post subject: |
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| Hunkydory wrote: |
The design changes occurred in 2008 & the new design with the o-ring & 2 bolts vs the screw into case will not fit the older ones such as you have. Mainly the shifter connection using a smooth rod in the pre 2008 with a splined shaft shifter in the 2008 & up prevents the interchange. There could also be other changes made that could prevent it. |
Hi HunkyDory,
The guys at Atlantic Marine confirmed that these design changes preventing them from fitting the older motors happened in 2008, but they said the fitment changes were on the BF75's 90's, 115's... But NOT on the BF40's and BF50's. They said they swap newer units onto older 40/50 motors quite often. Is it possible you were referring to these larger motors? I want to double check because once I order a new unit I don't think I can send it back..! |
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Hunkydory
Joined: 28 Mar 2005
Posts: 2716
City/Region: Cokeville, Wyoming
State or Province: WY
C-Dory Year: 2000
C-Dory Model: 22 Cruiser
Vessel Name: Hunkydory
Photos: Hunkydory-Jay-and-Jolee
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| Posted: Wed Feb 07, 2024 4:46 pm Post subject: |
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James, I apologize for giving you incorrect information, as it’s worse than none. After rechecking back through this today it does appear your information from Atlantic Marine is correct & the changes weren’t relevant to the Honda 40 & 50. Either, I made the wrong interpretation of information I read or what I read was wrong, when doing my parts research for the water pump exchange on my replacement Honda 60’s, following doing the same on the previous old Honda 40’s.
Jay |
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Wood Zeppelin
Joined: 09 Feb 2016
Posts: 333
City/Region: Seattle
State or Province: WA
C-Dory Year: 1997
C-Dory Model: 22 Angler
Vessel Name: C-Creature
Photos: Childhood Dream
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| Posted: Wed Feb 07, 2024 5:38 pm Post subject: |
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Jay,
Thank you. As it turns out, you've helped.. because if you hadn't replied to my post in the first place, I would not have asked this question to the guys at Atlantic Marine. So by putting our heads together here on the board and contributing from our experiences, we eventually get this kind of valuable information!
It's good to now know a solution to this problem is to swap in a later model lower unit, for this horsepower range and vintage of motors.
Thanks again!
James |
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T.R. Bauer
Joined: 17 Nov 2007
Posts: 1792
City/Region: Wasilla
State or Province: AK
C-Dory Year: 1993
C-Dory Model: 22 Cruiser
Vessel Name: C-Whisperer
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| Posted: Thu Feb 08, 2024 11:54 am Post subject: |
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| It's ironic this came up again. I was just at the Honda dealer dreaming of new outboards and saw the 40 and 50 hp outboards still have lower units just like my 30 year old ones. I don't know if they are the same, but they sure do look the same. BTW new outboards are flipping expensive! |
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Wood Zeppelin
Joined: 09 Feb 2016
Posts: 333
City/Region: Seattle
State or Province: WA
C-Dory Year: 1997
C-Dory Model: 22 Angler
Vessel Name: C-Creature
Photos: Childhood Dream
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| Posted: Mon Apr 15, 2024 4:34 am Post subject: |
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Does anyone know any reason why a lower unit from a 2001 Honda BF50 (part #41100-ZW4-H16ZA) would not fit a 1998 BF40 (41100-ZW4-H13ZA)? I'm just seeing the slightly different part numbers so it makes me wonder if they are the same/interchangeable ?
I am noticing that from 1998 to 2001 (3 yrs) the part number changes from H13ZA to H16ZA (also by 3)... so maybe the only difference in the parts number is that they change by the year? |
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ssobol
Joined: 27 Oct 2012
Posts: 3483
City/Region: SW Michigan
State or Province: MI
C-Dory Year: 2008
C-Dory Model: 22 Cruiser
Vessel Name: SoBELLE
Photos: SoBelle
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| Posted: Mon Apr 15, 2024 10:29 am Post subject: |
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| Wood Zeppelin wrote: | Does anyone know any reason why a lower unit from a 2001 Honda BF50 (part #41100-ZW4-H16ZA) would not fit a 1998 BF40 (41100-ZW4-H13ZA)? I'm just seeing the slightly different part numbers so it makes me wonder if they are the same/interchangeable ?
I am noticing that from 1998 to 2001 (3 yrs) the part number changes from H13ZA to H16ZA (also by 3)... so maybe the only difference in the parts number is that they change by the year? |
Gear ratio might be different. |
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Wood Zeppelin
Joined: 09 Feb 2016
Posts: 333
City/Region: Seattle
State or Province: WA
C-Dory Year: 1997
C-Dory Model: 22 Angler
Vessel Name: C-Creature
Photos: Childhood Dream
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| Posted: Mon Apr 15, 2024 2:10 pm Post subject: |
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| T.R. Bauer wrote: | | It's ironic this came up again. I was just at the Honda dealer dreaming of new outboards and saw the 40 and 50 hp outboards still have lower units just like my 30 year old ones. I don't know if they are the same, but they sure do look the same. BTW new outboards are flipping expensive! |
I do know that they have upgraded the lower unit design to eliminate this problem. It's a much better design. Rather than an inside-concentric locknut, there is a different geometry with two regular bolts inside.
And this upgraded lower unit is available for older motors, for about $1500. |
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Wood Zeppelin
Joined: 09 Feb 2016
Posts: 333
City/Region: Seattle
State or Province: WA
C-Dory Year: 1997
C-Dory Model: 22 Angler
Vessel Name: C-Creature
Photos: Childhood Dream
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| Posted: Mon Apr 15, 2024 2:12 pm Post subject: |
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| ssobol wrote: | | Wood Zeppelin wrote: | Does anyone know any reason why a lower unit from a 2001 Honda BF50 (part #41100-ZW4-H16ZA) would not fit a 1998 BF40 (41100-ZW4-H13ZA)? I'm just seeing the slightly different part numbers so it makes me wonder if they are the same/interchangeable ?
I am noticing that from 1998 to 2001 (3 yrs) the part number changes from H13ZA to H16ZA (also by 3)... so maybe the only difference in the parts number is that they change by the year? |
Gear ratio might be different. |
AHHH, Good point! Same lower unit for BF40's and BF50's, but maybe different gear ratios for the two different horsepowers..? |
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Salmon Fisher
Joined: 07 Aug 2009
Posts: 831
City/Region: Arlington
State or Province: WA
C-Dory Year: 2004
C-Dory Model: 25 Cruiser
Vessel Name: Kim Christine
Photos: Kim Christine
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| Posted: Mon Apr 15, 2024 8:27 pm Post subject: |
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IMHO I believe it is best to just purchase a lower unit, period.
It will fit. Gear ratio is of no significance when your motor is 40/50 hp on a 16 C-Dory.
I hope you don't take this wrong, not trying to offend, but try to avoid, at all costs, "Analysis Paralysis." It has bitten me in the ass more than once. I am in the midst of purchasing a new 175 hp outboard to replace a 20 year old Honda 150. I am getting the info and making the decision in one week.
Good luck in your journey!
_________________
Patrick and Kim Walker
2004 25 Cruiser-Present
2000 22 Cruiser 2009-2014 (Sold)
2006 25 Cruiser 2014-2019 (Sold)
1985 22 Classic -2019 (Sold)
1991 19 Arima Sea Ranger-2019-2021 (Sold)
2015 27 Ranger Tug-2019-2023 (Sold)
1987 22 Cruiser -2021-2023 (Sold)
Honey, this REALLY will be my last boat, honest! |
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