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Single Vs. Twin Engine Pro/Com
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smckean (Tosca)



Joined: 18 Jan 2014
Posts: 974
City/Region: Guemes Island (Anacortes)
State or Province: WA
C-Dory Year: 2005
C-Dory Model: 25 Cruiser
Vessel Name: Tosca
Photos: Tosca
PostPosted: Thu Apr 20, 2023 2:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

colbysmith wrote:
Sandy, I think you would be surprised how much power that the kicker would provide. As long as you have less than 5 kts of current, it'll move you.

Understand. However, it's not speed thru the water that I am referencing; it is sea state. I was a bit surprised coming down the west coast of Vancouver Island how much power it required to "drive up" large swells; and even more so, how I had to use the throttle to "dance" in chaotic large wind waves. When the wind waves were 6 or 7 feet high, and especially when they came from multiple directions, I had to accelerate and decelerate strongly and constantly to maintain control. I just can't believe I would have had a chance with a 10 horsepower engine.

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Sandy McKean
Purchased Tosca in 2014
Re-powered to Yammi 200 in 2015
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Hunkydory



Joined: 28 Mar 2005
Posts: 2652
City/Region: Cokeville, Wyoming
State or Province: WY
C-Dory Year: 2000
C-Dory Model: 22 Cruiser
Vessel Name: Hunkydory
Photos: Hunkydory-Jay-and-Jolee
PostPosted: Thu Apr 20, 2023 2:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

smckean (Tosca) wrote:
colbysmith wrote:
Sandy, I think you would be surprised how much power that the kicker would provide. As long as you have less than 5 kts of current, it'll move you.

Understand. However, it's not speed thru the water that I am referencing; it is sea state. I was a bit surprised coming down the west coast of Vancouver Island how much power it required to "drive up" large swells; and even more so, how I had to use the throttle to "dance" in chaotic large wind waves. When the wind waves were 6 or 7 feet high, and especially when they came from multiple directions, I had to accelerate and decelerate strongly and constantly to maintain control. I just can't believe I would have had a chance with a 10 horsepower engine.


Yep!

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Jay and Jolee 2000 22 CD cruiser Hunkydory
I will not waste my days in trying to prolong them------Jack London
https://share.delorme.com/JuliusByers
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chromer



Joined: 27 Jan 2006
Posts: 952
City/Region: Anacortes
State or Province: WA
C-Dory Year: 2006
C-Dory Model: 19 Angler
Photos: Checkpoint II
PostPosted: Thu Apr 20, 2023 4:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Harvey on SleepyC is the twin guy.

I really like twin Yanmars on my B-28. Since the props are spread out, i really get the benefit of turning on axis. I've heard twin outboards being closer together, the benefit isn't as strong, but still there.

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Checkpoint II (SOLD 10/2020)
Alure Bertram 28
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DayBreak



Joined: 16 Jul 2017
Posts: 838
City/Region: Monmouth, Or.
State or Province: OR
C-Dory Year: 2018
C-Dory Model: 23 Venture
Vessel Name: DayBreak
Photos: DayBreak
PostPosted: Thu Apr 20, 2023 4:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sandy, great example in what you describe. It takes a lot of power to climb up a steep wave and to maintain control. In this situation, having twins would be better than having a kicker as long as at-least one twin motor is operational.
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Gary F
DayBreak, 23 Venture, 2018 - present
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bridma



Joined: 13 Sep 2011
Posts: 1155
City/Region: Comox
State or Province: BC
C-Dory Year: 2009
C-Dory Model: 22 Cruiser
Vessel Name: Nomad
Photos: Nomad
PostPosted: Thu Apr 20, 2023 5:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

As a test to myself to prove that I could do it with twins. I entered my marina, did a 90 degree right turn, straight ahead for about 200 ft, 90 degree left turn, then 50 ft straight, followed by a 90 degree right turn into my slip. All this was achieved without me touching the steering wheel once. Such is the manouverability with twins.

Martin.
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alainP



Joined: 07 Oct 2016
Posts: 194
City/Region: TUCSON
State or Province: AZ
C-Dory Year: 2011
C-Dory Model: 25 Cruiser
Vessel Name: deja la
PostPosted: Thu Apr 20, 2023 6:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

wind or no wind?
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bridma



Joined: 13 Sep 2011
Posts: 1155
City/Region: Comox
State or Province: BC
C-Dory Year: 2009
C-Dory Model: 22 Cruiser
Vessel Name: Nomad
Photos: Nomad
PostPosted: Thu Apr 20, 2023 10:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

No wind.

Martin.
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djy887



Joined: 22 Feb 2008
Posts: 31
City/Region: Bainbridge Island
State or Province: WA
C-Dory Year: 1999
C-Dory Model: 24 Tomcat
Vessel Name: Still un-named (yeah, I know)
Photos: djy887
PostPosted: Sat Apr 22, 2023 12:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I can't imagine a situation where someone would say "Damn, I wish I had only one motor". I 've had to motor home on a kicker on a Bayliner (yup, I deserved that one...a slow roll to nowhere) and paddle home a sailboat when my little 2-stroke 3hp Tohatsu died with no wind.

Twins...every day of the week and twice on Sundays!
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starcrafttom



Joined: 07 Nov 2003
Posts: 7878
City/Region: marysville
State or Province: WA
C-Dory Year: 1984
C-Dory Model: 27 Cruiser
Vessel Name: to be decided later
Photos: Susan E
PostPosted: Sat Apr 22, 2023 1:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
"Damn, I wish I had only one motor"


It happens when you are trying to troll and even one motor at idle is .5 mph to fast and you are not catching a dam thing. If you dont troll then no problem.

The other time is when you hit something in the water and take out both props or lower units. Now you are dead in the water. If you have a single and kicker you are not stuck in the water. You can get to saftey if not home. but safety is better.

With cdorys twins being so close together you are more likely to get both motors on a log or reef then not.

As I have said the question should be twins vs single with a kicker.. but no one is going to change thier minds.. I mean some people still drive eletric cars regardless of all the facts.... even chevy EVs. I need a pop stirring emoji

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ssobol



Joined: 27 Oct 2012
Posts: 3358
City/Region: SW Michigan
State or Province: MI
C-Dory Year: 2008
C-Dory Model: 22 Cruiser
Vessel Name: SoBELLE
Photos: SoBelle
PostPosted: Sat Apr 22, 2023 4:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

djy887 wrote:
I can't imagine a situation where someone would say "Damn, I wish I had only one motor". ...


When the service interval is reached and you get the bill.
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bridma



Joined: 13 Sep 2011
Posts: 1155
City/Region: Comox
State or Province: BC
C-Dory Year: 2009
C-Dory Model: 22 Cruiser
Vessel Name: Nomad
Photos: Nomad
PostPosted: Sat Apr 22, 2023 4:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I had twins plus a outboard for the dinghy onboard every where I went. Any advance on 3 engines on a C-Dory ?

Martin.
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T.R. Bauer



Joined: 17 Nov 2007
Posts: 1726
City/Region: Wasilla
State or Province: AK
C-Dory Year: 1993
C-Dory Model: 22 Cruiser
Vessel Name: C-Whisperer
PostPosted: Sun Apr 23, 2023 12:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

bridma wrote:
I had twins plus a outboard for the dinghy onboard every where I went. Any advance on 3 engines on a C-Dory ?

Martin.


I often do too. Somewhere in that dialog above was to buy the best boat you can find regardless if it has twins or a single. I completely agree.
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bridma



Joined: 13 Sep 2011
Posts: 1155
City/Region: Comox
State or Province: BC
C-Dory Year: 2009
C-Dory Model: 22 Cruiser
Vessel Name: Nomad
Photos: Nomad
PostPosted: Sun Apr 23, 2023 4:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I agree. Buy the best condition boat you can find, regardless of power. When I was searching for a C-Dory I had already made that decision. Mine came with twins, I was super happy. I would have been just as happy if it had come with a single. I do not fish so I never had to give a thought to a kicker for trolling speeds.
I did have a kicker bracket that I was going to put on the stern but I sold the boat before I got around to it. I kept my dinghy outboard on a homemade bracket on the deck. It fits nicely in that gap between the gunnel and the cabin door when the door is in the open position and latched. My thinking being if the twins both crap out at the same time, the little outboard will get me somewhere. A bonus being a fisherman (or woman) could use it for trolling.

Martin.
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Hunkydory



Joined: 28 Mar 2005
Posts: 2652
City/Region: Cokeville, Wyoming
State or Province: WY
C-Dory Year: 2000
C-Dory Model: 22 Cruiser
Vessel Name: Hunkydory
Photos: Hunkydory-Jay-and-Jolee
PostPosted: Sun Apr 23, 2023 11:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

As posted before, I personally prefer the twins over a single with kicker, though I do agree with there being pros & cons to each, but as for the con of taking a hit so hard on both of the twin motors hard enough to disable both props or motors to be a exceedingly rare event. If in known shallows & if possible, as when current is low enough, I proceed on one motor & it sometimes slightly tilted up. But going against the seemingly conventional wisdom here, I believe in normal running, rare enough for me, so as to not qualify on the con, for twins, especially on a boat with the speed capability of a C-Dory. Perhaps others have a long list, but I’ve yet to hear of anyone running twins on a CD 22/25 or even other boat in the CD22/25 normally run speed range taking out both motors by debri or bottom hit. Some may have damaged both props or spun one, but loss of thrust more than the thrust of a kicker only, very doubtful. I’ve spent a lot of time/miles exploring charted & uncharted shallow water at displacement speed & on plane where few boats of the C-Dory type venture with many hits to the props on debris or rocks in the process, ruining a few aluminum props & hitting rocks hard enough to take out a skeg on one motor, when running both at higher speed, but never damaged a motor on either twin or damaged both props at the same time or even spun a single prop, let alone both. Outboard motor manufacturers, especially mercury, test their lower units by purposely having them hit or be hit by obstructions to see what the lower units can withstand without damage to motor or the boat. Big difference when hits are made at very high speed, beyond the capability of the usual speed for a CD 22/25.

Jay
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