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Reverse Polarity Light - Red
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crowleykirk



Joined: 05 Jul 2019
Posts: 93
City/Region: Friday Harbor
State or Province: WA
C-Dory Year: 2020
C-Dory Model: 23 Venture
Vessel Name: C-Life
Photos: C-Life
PostPosted: Mon Dec 06, 2021 8:44 pm    Post subject: Reverse Polarity Light - Red Reply with quote

Hello y'all:-)
Have our '23'C-Dory Venture at a slip this week. Hooked up shore power tonight. She is a new boat. First times I've connected shore power.

On the double switch, at the panel I'm getting a green light and a red light on the Reverse Polarity.

I don't think that is normal. Tried a different slips shore power, same thing.

I beleive we should be getting 2 green lights. Maybe something is hooked up backwards.

Thoughts?

Thanks
Kirk

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pcg



Joined: 31 Aug 2018
Posts: 405
City/Region: Sherwood
State or Province: OR
C-Dory Year: 1999
C-Dory Model: 22 Cruiser
Vessel Name: C-Quest
Photos: pcg
PostPosted: Mon Dec 06, 2021 9:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I would start by isolating the problem - is it your boat, your cable/adapter, or the marina outlet. The red light on your boat is connected between neutral and ground, which are bonded together at the shore power transformer, but not on your boat (while you are connected to shore power). If hot and neutral are reversed somewhere at the marina then you will have 120 V between neutral and ground on the boat and a well-lit red light. I would begin by unplugging your shore power cable from the marina outlet and using a voltmeter to measure the difference between neutral and ground at the marina receptacle you were plugged into. If it's close to zero then the problem is either on your boat or your cable or any adapter you have on your cable.
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Last edited by pcg on Mon Dec 06, 2021 10:00 pm; edited 7 times in total
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ssobol



Joined: 27 Oct 2012
Posts: 3362
City/Region: SW Michigan
State or Province: MI
C-Dory Year: 2008
C-Dory Model: 22 Cruiser
Vessel Name: SoBELLE
Photos: SoBelle
PostPosted: Tue Dec 07, 2021 11:53 am    Post subject: Re: Reverse Polarity Light - Red Reply with quote

crowleykirk wrote:
... I beleive we should be getting 2 green lights. Maybe something is hooked up backwards. ...


Don't know about your panel, but usually it is just one green light if things are ok. The reverse polarity light (mine is red) should not be on.

Unless you made your own shore power cable, I'd bet that the problem is in your boat.
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smckean (Tosca)



Joined: 18 Jan 2014
Posts: 974
City/Region: Guemes Island (Anacortes)
State or Province: WA
C-Dory Year: 2005
C-Dory Model: 25 Cruiser
Vessel Name: Tosca
Photos: Tosca
PostPosted: Tue Dec 07, 2021 4:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Be very careful.

There are situations where the polarity light is on (red light) that are not particularly dangerous and likely easy to fix (e.g., polarity light is wired wrong), but that light can mean, and often does mean, that there is 120v full power on the neutrals (white wires) in your boat. If so, then the switches in, or to, any appliance will not stop the power going to the appliance when the appliance is switch off. Therefore there can be power at the appliance and the user won't know since the user turned off the switch (note the appliance does turn off when the switch is off thereby "fooling" the user, but appliance components will is still be energized via the voltage on the neutral which is not switched).

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Purchased Tosca in 2014
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crowleykirk



Joined: 05 Jul 2019
Posts: 93
City/Region: Friday Harbor
State or Province: WA
C-Dory Year: 2020
C-Dory Model: 23 Venture
Vessel Name: C-Life
Photos: C-Life
PostPosted: Tue Dec 07, 2021 5:04 pm    Post subject: Issue figured out Reply with quote

This is a new 2021 Venture 23. Turns out it was not with the boat at all. I "borrowed" another boats shore power cord, looked like it had been thru the wringer. Plugged it in and NO reverse polarity light.

So, just a bad "brand new" shore power cord supplied by the dealer.

Mike at the factory also said they tested it for several days with their dirty old power cord and all was good. The new one must of come from China. No way to take it apart for a repair. So I'll have to get. anew shore power cord.

Thank you all for the replies.

We are really on the fence about keeping her here in SoCal. Our plans really changed this year from the PNW to SoCal to help my wife's dad. Just not having the time to use her like we had hoped. And I've done so many modifications. Been fun last few days though:-)
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thataway



Joined: 02 Nov 2003
Posts: 20779
City/Region: Pensacola
State or Province: FL
C-Dory Year: 2007
C-Dory Model: 25 Cruiser
Vessel Name: thataway
Photos: Thataway
PostPosted: Tue Dec 07, 2021 7:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

That Shower power should be covered by the factory if it is a new one supplied by the factory or dealer responsible if supplied by dealer.

You can just put a new end on it, if you want. It will be much cheaper. I have made up new shore power cords, using new fittings with longer cords. Marinco new plugs run $57. (wow--a new cord is about $87...So may not be worth it. I have adaptors from China which were fine.

I sure would want to see where the problem was in the cord--you can do that by measuring continuity in each wire from plug to plug.

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Thataway
Thataway (Ex Seaweed) 2007 25 C Dory May 2018 to Oct. 2021
Thisaway 2006 22' CDory November 2011 to May 2018
Caracal 18 140 Suzuki 2007 to present
Thataway TomCat 255 150 Suzukis June 2006 thru August 2011
C Pelican; 1992, 22 Cruiser, 2002 thru 2006
Frequent Sea; 2003 C D 25, 2007 thru 2009
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Home port: Pensacola FL
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ssobol



Joined: 27 Oct 2012
Posts: 3362
City/Region: SW Michigan
State or Province: MI
C-Dory Year: 2008
C-Dory Model: 22 Cruiser
Vessel Name: SoBELLE
Photos: SoBelle
PostPosted: Tue Dec 07, 2021 11:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

thataway wrote:
That Shower power should be covered by the factory if it is a new one supplied by the factory or dealer responsible if supplied by dealer.

You can just put a new end on it, if you want. It will be much cheaper. I have made up new shore power cords, using new fittings with longer cords. Marinco new plugs run $57. (wow--a new cord is about $87...So may not be worth it. I have adaptors from China which were fine.

I sure would want to see where the problem was in the cord--you can do that by measuring continuity in each wire from plug to plug.


Depending on where the problem is, if you end up repairing the cord I'd look into SmartPlug. You can change the boat end of the cord and the boat receptacle. I find the SmartPlug way better than the Marinco twist type.
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journey on



Joined: 03 Mar 2005
Posts: 3593
City/Region: Valley Centre
State or Province: CA
C-Dory Year: 2005
C-Dory Model: 25 Cruiser
Vessel Name: journey on
Photos: Journey On
PostPosted: Wed Dec 08, 2021 12:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The SmartPlug is a good unit, I installed it on Journey On.

That said, let me comment on two issues. One is that you're only changing the boat end; the dock end is the same as before. I had most of my problems with the dock connection, so using a SmartPlug doesn't fix that. I usually tie the dock plug in.

Second, if one stores the boat at home, the normal thing (for me, at least) is to use a standard 15 amp house extension cord to power the boat. That means buying or making up an adapter. Since the adapter sells for ~$170, I made one. So, add in the cost of another SmartPlug at ~$90, cable and 115 connector.

Boris
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thataway



Joined: 02 Nov 2003
Posts: 20779
City/Region: Pensacola
State or Province: FL
C-Dory Year: 2007
C-Dory Model: 25 Cruiser
Vessel Name: thataway
Photos: Thataway
PostPosted: Wed Dec 08, 2021 1:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Since the adapter sells for ~$170, I made one. So, add in the cost of another SmartPlug at ~$90, cable and 115 connector.


A 15/20 amp male to 30 amp marine adaptor is only $24 at Amazon (I carried two of these and two of the 30 amp female to 14 amp adaptors also). To loan to other boaters...Just plug your 30 amp smart cord into the adaptor,. Yes, you have too tie a piece of line to hold all of this together, but I do that any way...Or tape over the connection..
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ssobol



Joined: 27 Oct 2012
Posts: 3362
City/Region: SW Michigan
State or Province: MI
C-Dory Year: 2008
C-Dory Model: 22 Cruiser
Vessel Name: SoBELLE
Photos: SoBelle
PostPosted: Wed Dec 08, 2021 2:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

journey on wrote:
.... Second, if one stores the boat at home, the normal thing (for me, at least) is to use a standard 15 amp house extension cord to power the boat. That means buying or making up an adapter. Since the adapter sells for ~$170, I made one. So, add in the cost of another SmartPlug at ~$90, cable and 115 connector.

Boris


Or you can just get a standard 3 prong male to 30 amp female adapter, put a SmartPlug on it (or not), and just use a 20 amp extension cord to the shore power post. Most power posts have 20 amp plugs (and CBs) on them. If necessary you can get a 3 prong female to 30 amp male connector to connect the extension cord to the 30 amp outlet on the post.

The only time my boat pulls more than 15 amps from shore power is if the battery charger is on (and batteries depleted) and the AC is running. Almost never happens.

The 20 amp extension cord is lots easier to handle and store than the standard 30 amp shore power cord. I can't remember the last time I used it.
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smckean (Tosca)



Joined: 18 Jan 2014
Posts: 974
City/Region: Guemes Island (Anacortes)
State or Province: WA
C-Dory Year: 2005
C-Dory Model: 25 Cruiser
Vessel Name: Tosca
Photos: Tosca
PostPosted: Wed Dec 08, 2021 3:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
The only time my boat pulls more than 15 amps from shore power is if the battery charger is on (and batteries depleted) and the AC is running.

This triggers an issue in my mind that I've never fully understood. I've made some assumptions about the issue, but I'd love to get some confirmation that my assumptions are correct, or equally valuable, that I am full of s**t Wink .

At C-Brat Gatherings, I've always wondered why I see all these 30 amp cords running from C-Dorys to the power pedestal on the dock. On my CD25 the main breaker on the AC panel is 15 amps. I can easily trip that breaker if I run 2 power hungry appliances (e.g., the microwave, and the hot water heater) since they add up to more than 15 amps. So why do we all have 30 amp cords? What would be wrong with 20 amps cords (or even 15 amp cords) since that 15 amp breaker limits the total draw to a measly 15 amps. My assumption has always been that docks tend to have 30 amp outlets available, and boat builders are just used to installing those ubiquitous 30 amp receptacles on boats.

Any ideas?
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thataway



Joined: 02 Nov 2003
Posts: 20779
City/Region: Pensacola
State or Province: FL
C-Dory Year: 2007
C-Dory Model: 25 Cruiser
Vessel Name: thataway
Photos: Thataway
PostPosted: Wed Dec 08, 2021 3:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
I can easily trip that breaker if I run 2 power hungry appliances (e.g., the microwave, and the hot water heater) since they add up to more than 15 amps. So why do we all have 30 amp cords? What would be wrong with 20 amps cords (or even 15 amp cords) since that 15 amp breaker limits the total draw to a measly 15 amps. My assumption has always been that docks tend to have 30 amp outlets available, and boat builders are just used to installing those ubiquitous 30 amp receptacles on boats.

Any ideas?


Yes it is sort of a "standard"--the 30 amp cord. There are times one will exceed a 15 or 20 amp draw, in the Normal business of a C Dory. There are only lighter duty 15/20 amp plugs--made for trolling motor chargers--such as I have on my 18'CC catamaran. The factory buys these cords and fittings at 60 to 70% less than retail price. There are a few boats which are using the boat end of Smart Plug or the EEL of Morinco

Not all marinas have the 15/20 amp plug--but most do. The major issue however remains the power cord. The 30 amp is sized to carry the 30 amps. Most extension cords are #14 wire--few are 12 and even less 10. I have a 50' 10 gauge extension cord rated at 20 amps, for my RVl. But I had to hunt for that. Thus I feel that the 30 amp cord (even if many don't use it-I do especially with the 25.
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smckean (Tosca)



Joined: 18 Jan 2014
Posts: 974
City/Region: Guemes Island (Anacortes)
State or Province: WA
C-Dory Year: 2005
C-Dory Model: 25 Cruiser
Vessel Name: Tosca
Photos: Tosca
PostPosted: Wed Dec 08, 2021 4:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
There are times one will exceed a 15 or 20 amp draw, in the Normal business of a C Dory.

Can't on my boat.....at least not through the AC panel because, as I said, there is a 15 amp main breaker in the panel. It trips pretty close to 15 amps too (I know from much experience Wink Laughing)
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ssobol



Joined: 27 Oct 2012
Posts: 3362
City/Region: SW Michigan
State or Province: MI
C-Dory Year: 2008
C-Dory Model: 22 Cruiser
Vessel Name: SoBELLE
Photos: SoBelle
PostPosted: Wed Dec 08, 2021 4:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

thataway wrote:
Quote:
I can easily trip that breaker if I run 2 power hungry appliances (e.g., the microwave, and the hot water heater) since they add up to more than 15 amps. So why do we all have 30 amp cords? What would be wrong with 20 amps cords (or even 15 amp cords) since that 15 amp breaker limits the total draw to a measly 15 amps. My assumption has always been that docks tend to have 30 amp outlets available, and boat builders are just used to installing those ubiquitous 30 amp receptacles on boats.

Any ideas?
... Most extension cords are #14 wire--few are 12 and even less 10. I have a 50' 10 gauge extension cord rated at 20 amps, for my RVl. But I had to hunt for that...


Got mine at Home Depot. 20 amps is usually 12 ga. A number to choose from.
For a 22, 20 amps seems plenty. Maybe on a 25 you'll find higher loads.
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smckean (Tosca)



Joined: 18 Jan 2014
Posts: 974
City/Region: Guemes Island (Anacortes)
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C-Dory Year: 2005
C-Dory Model: 25 Cruiser
Vessel Name: Tosca
Photos: Tosca
PostPosted: Wed Dec 08, 2021 5:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
20 amps is usually 12 ga.

Yeah, when wiring a house 12 ga is rated for 20 amp circuits (and 14 ga for 15 amp; 10 ga for 30 amp). But the manufacturers always seem to rate these "construction" type extension cords lower. I assume that's because these cords typically come with household NEMA 5-15 connectors which are rated at 15 amps. Perhaps what Bob is talking about is a cord with NEMA 5-20 connectors; in which case, I think it would be quite hard to find such a thing.
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