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USCG Announces New Engine Cut Off Switch Law
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smckean (Tosca)



Joined: 18 Jan 2014
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 25, 2021 5:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

So Tom, if a young man whose only family is a destitute single mother in Appalachia rides down the highway on his motorcycle without a helmet, and he flips the bike giving himself a head injury such that he becomes a vegetable requiring life long institutional care at the public expense......his actions haven't affected you and me??
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Robert H. Wilkinson



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PostPosted: Thu Mar 25, 2021 10:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

In 2011 I was doing a wot run in my Stingray. At 53mph I lost steering and went into a full lock turn to starboard. I was not wearing my lanyard. I considered myself VERY lucky that my hand was on the throttle and I was able to pull it off before being violently thrown across the boat by the g force of the turn. Do I wear it now? Do bears shit in the woods?

Retired now(yaaa!) after working 47 years in the collision business. Can you make everything right with people your actions have hurt? This is one accident that happened in my neck of the woods about 5 years ago - https://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/toronto/suspected-drunk-driver-in-fatal-crash-had-seven-non-criminal-offences/article26581709/

The vehicle Mr. Muzzo was driving killed 3 children and their grandfather. Mr. Muzzo's estate is listed at 1.7 billion - #52 of the 100 most wealthy Canadians. He has also spent the last 5 years in jail. Has his apology and 5 years repaid the woman who lost her 3 children and father because of his actions?

Guess what I'm trying to say is - our freedoms are not a license to do whatever we want because our actions can and do affect the lives of those around us and we cannot always undo those effects no matter how good our intentions or how deep our pocketbook.

Regards,

Rob

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starcrafttom



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PostPosted: Fri Mar 26, 2021 4:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

oh my god the " what it " platoon is out in force.

So I can play to, and this is my last post as I do not want to hi jack this post. so you get in your car and like a dumb ass you run a red light. despite your seat belt helmet and air bags you still end up with a head injury. How are you any different then the guy on bike with no helmet??? You should not have left the house. zyou should be limitied to a state owned bus. Hell you should be forced to walk and only with permission. So the only question is where do you draw the line on my freedom? You all own boats you have no need to own and are burning gas that you have no need to burn and pollute my air and warm my planet. You only have a desire to have a boat made of oil ( fiberglass ) . You only have a desire to go boating , You have no need other then your freedom.

So the answers to your question is easy. Have insurance or die from lack of care. I do not, even thru the force of the government, have a responsibility to take care of you. But we do take care of people and we ALL pay taxes to do so. And just remember that you are more then likely to DIE with out a helmet then with one and be a vegetable. So non helmet wearers are really saving us money.

But The real question should be what is the purpose of speeding laws, seat belt laws , helmet laws, tether laws, etc safety laws that are supposedly to protect us from us?? It revenue generation. Hey if I speed an it CAUSES an accident then charge me with being responsible for the wreck with heavy fines and or jail. but until then its none of your business. If I don't have a helmet on and I wreck and suffer a head wound then that is between me and my insurance company. which can charge me a higher premium if they wish, just as they do if you have speeding tickets. The government should have no responsibility to protect me from me. Only to protect me from you directly.

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starcrafttom



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PostPosted: Fri Mar 26, 2021 4:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
if a young man whose only family is a destitute single mother in Appalachia


Add a 3 legged dog and pick up and you got a country song
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smckean (Tosca)



Joined: 18 Jan 2014
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 26, 2021 7:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I hesitate to post this, but I can't resist. It too will be my last post along these lines in this thread since we are hi jacking it......

Tom, I have to congratulate you...you are a true libertarian! I'd be one too if I thought it works, but it doesn't (I'll PM you on this.)

Quote:
But The real question should be what is the purpose of speeding laws, seat belt laws.........

Since you are so committed to the "I do not...have a responsibility to take care of you" principle, I presume in your perfect world there would be zero (or near zero) driving regulations: no speed limits, no stop signs, no school zones, no rights of way generally. Do you really want to drive in that world?

Quote:
Hey, if I speed and it CAUSES an accident then charge me with being responsible for the wreck with heavy fines and or jail. but until then its none of your business.

OK. So how does my 13 year old daughter get her left leg back after you and your speeding car run a stop sign and crash into the passenger side of my car where she is sitting? Even if we do put you in jail and take big money from you, is there a settlement big enough that my daughter would consider trading her left leg for that cash?
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ssobol



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PostPosted: Fri Mar 26, 2021 8:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

smckean (Tosca) wrote:
Quote:
Hey, if I speed and it CAUSES an accident then charge me with being responsible for the wreck with heavy fines and or jail. but until then its none of your business.

OK. So how does my 13 year old daughter get her left leg back after you and your speeding car run a stop sign and crash into the passenger side of my car where she is sitting? Even if we do put you in jail and take big money from you, is there a settlement big enough that my daughter would consider trading her left leg for that cash?


And supposing the 13 year old does put a price on losing her leg, what happens if you do not have the financial resources to pay it. Even with insurance, the amount they will pay is not infinite (only how much coverage you choose to buy). Of course, you could write some regulation that requires everyone to carry X amount of insurance to cover these sorts of situations. But then you have the whole "government telling me what to do" thing again.
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colbysmith



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PostPosted: Fri Mar 26, 2021 10:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I suppose we could all just live in an unregulated and lawless society. Each doing their own kind of thing. Then again, I look at the stupidity amongst us, and glad we have some regulation! Just my two cents. Ok, back to thoughts on the kill switch? As I read it, the USCG and other LE is tired of trying to fix stupid. You know, the folks that fall off their boats for whatever reason, and then search and rescue has to come out to rescue them or chase down their boats that hopefully haven't caused damage to other property! Rolling Eyes
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ssobol



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PostPosted: Fri Mar 26, 2021 10:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yeah, stupid or unfortunate incidents like this.

https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-england-cornwall-22431326
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journey on



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PostPosted: Sat Mar 27, 2021 2:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I've ridden a motorcycle since 1953. Started without helmets, went to helmets when they became available. The club I raced with charged you $1 every time you got on a bike without one. Started wearing seatbelts when they covered my chest, with our 1988 Camray. They save lives.

And, BTW, in a car, I'm the one with the kinetic energy advantage. That's why I quit riding on the street years ago. San Diego has one M/C killed per week, because they did something stupid.

Now that we all agree that they serve a safety purpose, let's look at their regulation, the laws that require you to wear them. As soon as one leaves the house/apt/tent you're using public space, i.e. the street and you're going to a public store/park/etc. You follow traffic laws, because they keep traffic safe. Think what would happen without them. Now we know that accidents happen, through no fault of yours, right? That's especially true with motorcycles vs Volvos. So, what if you, without a helmet, get head trauma? On the public highway? Once you're brain dead, the public suffers: the person who hit you, the cops who respond to the accident, the guy who sweeps you off the street and (we hope) your relatives. So you're not the only one involved. Don't forget the lawyers.

And that's why we have traffic laws, which include helmets and seat belts. And also driving too fast, not stopping for stop signs and a bunch of other things. And I admit we have traffic accidents in spite of all the laws; but think of all the accidents that would happen without those laws.

Just presenting the logic for helmets and seatbelts; not questioning your right to freedom.

Boris
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localboy



Joined: 30 Sep 2006
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 29, 2021 5:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
I suppose we could all just live in an unregulated and lawless society. Each doing their own kind of thing.


This already exists. It's called "Seattle".

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smckean (Tosca)



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PostPosted: Mon Mar 29, 2021 8:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Damn, I blew that! I was dumb enough to think it was Miami Beach. I'm losing it (just had my 76 b-day!).
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Marco Flamingo



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PostPosted: Tue Mar 30, 2021 10:58 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

One of the scenarios that makes me most cautious and not whimper about various CG regulations is the idea of me going over and my wife singlehanding a MOB recovery. I'd be scared as hell and she would be terrified. My fear mighty only last a 15 minutes in cold water. She would relive the terror the rest of her life. The claim that "being an adult" means that your decisions don't affect others is nonsense.
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