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Location of Electric over Hydraulic Actuator

 
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colbysmith



Joined: 02 Oct 2011
Posts: 4523
City/Region: Madison
State or Province: WI
C-Dory Year: 2009
C-Dory Model: 25 Cruiser
Vessel Name: C-Traveler
Photos: C-Traveler and Midnight-Flyer
PostPosted: Tue Nov 17, 2020 6:58 pm    Post subject: Location of Electric over Hydraulic Actuator Reply with quote

It appears that Loadrite will only install the EOH actuator on top the trailer tongue. In the process of ordering a new trailer with EOH disc brakes, I've been pushing to have them raise the actuator. Problem being shallow launch ramps at places like Lake Powell, and a few other lakes I go to occasionally. I got no where via the dealer, and so wrote directly to Loadrite my self. This is the reply I got:

Colby,
Here is the reason I got from our engineers.
Increasing the bracket by 6" and raising the pump into the air creates a lever arm effect.
This push and pull on the bend of the bracket from starting and stopping the trailer with the weight of the pump higher in the air will take an excessive toll on the bracket. Leading to a failure.
This is something that Load Rite is not interested in doing.
Dave Swiger
Inside Sales and Warranty Manager
215-949-0500
Dswiger@loadrite.com

Now I'm not sure what they think folks are towing their boats with, but I don't see much more air behind the tailgate of my pickup with only 6" of lift on the actuator... Nor do I know what kind of flimsy bracket they were thinking of. Anyway, I know Tom on C-Otter has a real nice bracket (S/S or aluminum?) that seems pretty solid, that raises his actuator a bit off the tongue. Where do others have their actuators mounted, and how have they worked out in that location? Any photos appreciated. My new trailer will come with the actuator on the tongue, but sometime before launching at Lake Powell again, or a few other places where the tongue ends up in the water, I'll need to figure out how to keep the actuator from being submerged, or at least figure out how much of it can be submerged... Colby
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thataway



Joined: 02 Nov 2003
Posts: 20778
City/Region: Pensacola
State or Province: FL
C-Dory Year: 2007
C-Dory Model: 25 Cruiser
Vessel Name: thataway
Photos: Thataway
PostPosted: Tue Nov 17, 2020 7:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

On this trailer mine was mounted on the front of the A frame. But I may raise it. The E/H unit is in a battery box along with the U1 battery. It is sealed on the bottom. The bottom got wet on several launches, and the boat floated with the trailer during Sally. There was no water in the box. No problem with the E/H.

There is a bracket which I bought for the 22 trailer when I put E/H on it. I looked for photos and a part but cannot find it. It was like a winch post. Plates welded on both top and bottom about 8" high as I recollect. It bolted to the tongue. I'll look around and see if I can find photos or a source.

I wonder what the "engineers" were smoking. It's hydraulics. What about the "lever arm" of the winch post? No reason that a properly built either steel or aluminum winch post type of structure cannot hold the E/H unit and battery etc.
My guess is they didn't want to have a new structure fabricated. Any good machine shop can make an aluminum bracket--it may not be cheap. But the materials and labor shouldn't be more than a couple of hundred dollars.

_________________
Bob Austin
Thataway
Thataway (Ex Seaweed) 2007 25 C Dory May 2018 to Oct. 2021
Thisaway 2006 22' CDory November 2011 to May 2018
Caracal 18 140 Suzuki 2007 to present
Thataway TomCat 255 150 Suzukis June 2006 thru August 2011
C Pelican; 1992, 22 Cruiser, 2002 thru 2006
Frequent Sea; 2003 C D 25, 2007 thru 2009
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Home port: Pensacola FL
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colbysmith



Joined: 02 Oct 2011
Posts: 4523
City/Region: Madison
State or Province: WI
C-Dory Year: 2009
C-Dory Model: 25 Cruiser
Vessel Name: C-Traveler
Photos: C-Traveler and Midnight-Flyer
PostPosted: Tue Nov 17, 2020 7:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
My guess is they didn't want to have a new structure fabricated. Any good machine shop can make an aluminum bracket--it may not be cheap. But the materials and labor shouldn't be more than a couple of hundred dollars.


My guess too. A couple hundred dollars compared to the new cost of a submerged EOH actuator... I think 6" would pretty much keep the unit dry. With warranty requirements, I'll probably leave well enuf alone when I get it. Then raise a ruckus with them if I have to replace the unit because it got wet! Colby
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jkidd



Joined: 23 Oct 2006
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City/Region: Northern, Utah
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C-Dory Year: 2007
C-Dory Model: 22 Cruiser
Vessel Name: Voyager
Photos: Voyager (JK)
PostPosted: Tue Nov 17, 2020 8:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Colby here's how mine turn out raised it 3" hasn't hit the water at Yellowstone or Lake Powell (Bullfrog) Every thing works just fine.


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KE7WNG
Northern, Utah

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Discovery



Joined: 08 Dec 2003
Posts: 1239
City/Region: LOA, UTAH
State or Province: UT
C-Dory Year: 2006
C-Dory Model: 255 Tomcat
Vessel Name: Discovery
Photos: Discovery
PostPosted: Wed Nov 18, 2020 9:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Colby,

Put it as high as you can. It gets wet, it's toast. I put Discovery's on the second step of the TomCat trailer. I put the battery up there also.


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Brent and Dixie,
1984 22' Classic sold 2003
2003 24' TomCat sold 2005
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https://share.delorme.com/FBrentBetenson
"Free men do not ask permission to bear arms." ~ Thomas Jefferson
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SnowTexan



Joined: 08 Aug 2019
Posts: 185
City/Region: Carlton
State or Province: WA
C-Dory Year: 2006
C-Dory Model: 22 Cruiser
Vessel Name: Miss Maria
Photos: Miss Maria
PostPosted: Sun Nov 22, 2020 12:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I put that same hydrastar unit on my trailer but mounted it low. Has anybody Here toasted one? Seems like the brain of the operation is mostly up in the cab and it would fry a fuse and maybe the battery charger. PITA to make it right I have no doubt, but does anyone have first hand experience submerging one of these setups?


Thanks!

Edit: sorry it was a hasty pre-coffee read. I realize The actuator and battery are a combo unit and would get smoked by saltwater. Was thinking more about the pump
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thataway



Joined: 02 Nov 2003
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Vessel Name: thataway
Photos: Thataway
PostPosted: Sun Nov 22, 2020 6:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Looking at my photos of the height of the water during hurricane Sally, and the the boat floating with the trailer, I suspected that the battery box which contains the pump, U1 battery, and the "heavy duty Brains" of the Titian E/H pump, had water in the box. The positive ring terminal #12 wire,( but not marine grade wire or terminal) had significant corrosion. I cut the wire several inches up, and it was bright copper. I then put in both new adhesive lined shrink wrap terminal's, and covered the whole joint with another layer of shrink wrap. The reservoirs were a little low, but no water in them. I filled the reservoir, backed the truck up, and checked with both the brakes and manual controller. The system worked fine.

So in this case, the pump, battery and brains were probably under water for less than 4 hours, but still seem to work. We will take a "Test" road trip before we head for Hontoon.
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SnowTexan



Joined: 08 Aug 2019
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City/Region: Carlton
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C-Dory Model: 22 Cruiser
Vessel Name: Miss Maria
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 23, 2020 12:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thank you Bob. One more data point in my calculated risk index for that day I find a ramp that will submerge my EOH unit.
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Dreamer



Joined: 01 Jan 2006
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PostPosted: Tue Nov 24, 2020 1:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

[/img]

Load Rite engineers seem to be a little cautious I think. If done right, it can be very sturdy.

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Once a C-Brat, always a C-Brat

Dreamer- Sold 25 Feb. 2013
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san juanderer



Joined: 12 Aug 2014
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C-Dory Year: 1990
C-Dory Model: 22 Angler
PostPosted: Tue Nov 24, 2020 2:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

They are working within a defined "box", surely by directions from engineers,insurers, and the legal people !

Sad day as usual, that reasonable minds can not prevail.
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colbysmith



Joined: 02 Oct 2011
Posts: 4523
City/Region: Madison
State or Province: WI
C-Dory Year: 2009
C-Dory Model: 25 Cruiser
Vessel Name: C-Traveler
Photos: C-Traveler and Midnight-Flyer
PostPosted: Tue Nov 24, 2020 3:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

And yet I made a cheap bracket 10000 miles ago on my current trailer that hasn’t budged! Maybe their engineers are planning more for an accident than normal driving!
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Cview



Joined: 07 Sep 2008
Posts: 64
City/Region: Phoenix
State or Province: AZ
C-Dory Year: 2006
C-Dory Model: 25 Cruiser
Vessel Name: C-VIEW II
Photos: C-VIEW
PostPosted: Fri Nov 27, 2020 12:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The picture shows what I believe is the standard Load Rite EOH actuator mounting. I've launched multiple times at the shallow ramps at Lake Powell without any issues. The black bottom part of the EOH actuator is the hydraulic reservoir so the water would have to get to the white part housing the electronics before there is any issue. The battery pack is mounted lower. There are holes in the bottom so any water that gets in will drain out. Most ramps are steep enough such that there are no concerns. It is probably not the best arrangement, but in 5 years of ownership, there have been no issues. I mostly boat in fresh water and the ramps I've used in salt water have always been relatively steep.




The biggest problem I've had with the Load Rite trailer for my C-Dory 25 is centering the boat between the fenders. Despite having 'goal posts' getting the boat to load between the fenders was an issue. I lowered the fenders a little and added the side guides shown in the picture to solve the problem. It took a few adjustments to get everything to work.



Tony
C-View II
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colbysmith



Joined: 02 Oct 2011
Posts: 4523
City/Region: Madison
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C-Dory Year: 2009
C-Dory Model: 25 Cruiser
Vessel Name: C-Traveler
Photos: C-Traveler and Midnight-Flyer
PostPosted: Fri Nov 27, 2020 2:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks for that info Tony. Regarding centering on bunks, sometimes they are better at self centering if you don't back in quite as far. That does require power loading however, and I know some places frown on that, or it's completely illegal. Colby
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