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thataway
Joined: 02 Nov 2003 Posts: 20814 City/Region: Pensacola
State or Province: FL
C-Dory Year: 2007
C-Dory Model: 25 Cruiser
Vessel Name: thataway
Photos: Thataway
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Posted: Fri Feb 03, 2017 12:57 pm Post subject: |
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A couple of questions about the on land salmon farms. Does not the sea water return to the nearby body of water? If so, is there not contamination of this water?
In my mind the farm raised salmon do not have the same texture as the "wild" salmon--probably due to the more use of muscle tissue in the wild salmon. Any comment on that issue? (It has been noted in other species).
There seem to be more healthy levels of Omega 3 in the Wild salmon.
Thanks. _________________ Bob Austin
Thataway
Thataway (Ex Seaweed) 2007 25 C Dory May 2018 to Oct. 2021
Thisaway 2006 22' CDory November 2011 to May 2018
Caracal 18 140 Suzuki 2007 to present
Thataway TomCat 255 150 Suzukis June 2006 thru August 2011
C Pelican; 1992, 22 Cruiser, 2002 thru 2006
Frequent Sea; 2003 C D 25, 2007 thru 2009
KA6PKB
Home port: Pensacola FL |
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hardee
Joined: 30 Oct 2006 Posts: 12633 City/Region: Sequim
State or Province: WA
C-Dory Year: 2005
C-Dory Model: 22 Cruiser
Vessel Name: Sleepy-C
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Posted: Fri Feb 03, 2017 3:26 pm Post subject: |
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From what I know of only one on land farm, the waste is collected, filtered from the water and composted. I believe the water was recycled, but don't know the particulars.
I suspect that the Omega3 might be less because the feed for the farmed salmon is geared more towards protein than fat, with added color components.
Harvey
SleepyC
_________________ Though in our sleep we are not conscious of our activity or surroundings, we should not, in our wakefulness, be unconscious of our sleep. |
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thataway
Joined: 02 Nov 2003 Posts: 20814 City/Region: Pensacola
State or Province: FL
C-Dory Year: 2007
C-Dory Model: 25 Cruiser
Vessel Name: thataway
Photos: Thataway
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Posted: Fri Feb 03, 2017 3:31 pm Post subject: |
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Harvey,
The Protein is about the same in the Wild vs farmed, but the fat is higher in the farmed (according to one source at least). (and gives the farmed more calories)
Of course the color is given by the Krill which the wild eat, so the farm raised have to be fed a dye. |
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Larry H
Joined: 02 Nov 2003 Posts: 2041 City/Region: Tulalip,
State or Province: WA
C-Dory Year: 1991
C-Dory Model: 22 Cruiser
Photos: Nancy H
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Posted: Fri Feb 03, 2017 4:01 pm Post subject: |
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Here is a link to Alexandra Morton's blog.
http://alexandramorton.typepad.com/
Alexandra has written extensively about her attempts to stop fish farms in Canada. When she was younger, she studied the Orca whales in the Broughton Islands area. Then the fish farms moved in and drove the whales away with loud underwater noise designed to scare seals away from the pens. Alexandra then started studying the fish farms.
Here is a link to a post about farmed fish's influence on human health, from her blog.
http://alexandramorton.typepad.com/guide_to_safe_salmon/
A friend of mine was born in and has lived in the Broughtons his whole life. He says that the wild salmon began to decline when the fish farms moved in. The wild salmon populations have declined steadily ever since the 1990's. Greed for profit is destroying a food resource that has fed humans, bears, eagles, crabs, prawns, seals, and trees for over 10,000 years. _________________ Larry H
A C-Brat since Nov 1, 2003
Ranger Tug 27 ex 'Jacari Maru' 2017 - 2022
Puget Trawler 37 ex 'Jacari Maru' 2006-2017
1991 22' Cruiser, 'Nancy H'--1991-2006 |
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Riverjohn
Joined: 08 Nov 2016 Posts: 34 City/Region: Portland
State or Province: OR
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Posted: Fri Feb 03, 2017 4:32 pm Post subject: Bad idea!! |
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Very bad idea with clear consequences.
Sea lice infest pen salmon with virus's.
Sea Lice die in fresh water, however they thrive is a pen with multiple targets swimming around.
Natures plan is the correct blueprint. _________________ Looking for a 22' or 23' |
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Larry Q
Joined: 17 Mar 2006 Posts: 231 City/Region: Rochester, Wa
State or Province: WA
C-Dory Year: 2006
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Vessel Name: C-ya
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Posted: Fri Feb 03, 2017 4:51 pm Post subject: |
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I worked for a division of Campbell Soup for ten years in the DomSea division. We raised Coho salmon and some Kings in the early years.
We had two large fresh water sites in Rochester Washington and three net pen sites in Puget Sound.
My job was to build and maintain the freshwater sites. Our hatcheries were capable of holding around twenty million eggs.
After the second generation of fish we had our own brood stock that we took the eggs from.
Our smolts were transferred from from fresh water to salt water when they reached about 100 grams in size. We photo adjusted the fish by raising them in a light controlled environment so they would smolt when we needed so we could ship fish year round, not just around the summer solstice.
In the 1980's all fish farms used single pass water that we sent through three settling ponds. Now the farms recycle 90 percent or more of their water.
Our net pens were located between Bainbridge Island and Manchester in Puget sound, this is a high current area. I dove many times to rest cables and anchors on these pens. It was cleaner under these pens than under any city dock on the sound.
The feed was made to our speck using crab and cray fish shells to get the "natural" color.
Correctly done there is nothing wrong with fish farming. Over crowding and poor location along with greed are the real culprits.
I left the industry when Campbell soup sold out to a Norwegian company
Global Aqua in 1989. I still know several people in the industry.
Campbell soup was a great company to work for and were VERY environmentally conscious. |
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hardee
Joined: 30 Oct 2006 Posts: 12633 City/Region: Sequim
State or Province: WA
C-Dory Year: 2005
C-Dory Model: 22 Cruiser
Vessel Name: Sleepy-C
Photos: SleepyC
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Posted: Fri Feb 03, 2017 5:46 pm Post subject: |
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Hi Larry,
It was good to see you two at the SBS CBGT. Sorry we didn't get to visit more.
Thanks for your insight on the fish farms. Interesting. I keep wondering why the Norwegians aren't doing their fish farming at home. Nothing against the Norwegians, just the fish farm tactics, I guess.
Harvey
SleepyC
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Riverjohn
Joined: 08 Nov 2016 Posts: 34 City/Region: Portland
State or Province: OR
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Larry H
Joined: 02 Nov 2003 Posts: 2041 City/Region: Tulalip,
State or Province: WA
C-Dory Year: 1991
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Photos: Nancy H
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Posted: Fri Feb 03, 2017 6:31 pm Post subject: |
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Interesting article, thanks for posting.
I don't think any of the positives in the article apply to the Norwegian farms in BC Canada, except the reduction in forage fish used as feed. Question is, what are the farms replacing the fish used in feed with? It would be interesting to see the actual ingredients used in fish feed. |
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Riverjohn
Joined: 08 Nov 2016 Posts: 34 City/Region: Portland
State or Province: OR
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Posted: Fri Feb 03, 2017 7:53 pm Post subject: |
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Larry H wrote: | Interesting article, thanks for posting.
I don't think any of the positives in the article apply to the Norwegian farms in BC Canada, except the reduction in forage fish used as feed. Question is, what are the farms replacing the fish used in feed with? It would be interesting to see the actual ingredients used in fish feed. |
If I had the decision it would be a solid NO to using pens anywhere native stocks reside. |
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Marco Flamingo
Joined: 09 Jul 2015 Posts: 1155 City/Region: Seattle
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Posted: Fri Feb 03, 2017 8:55 pm Post subject: |
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thataway wrote: | I think some are missing the elephant in the room. Overfishing |
Worrying about overfishing may be missing the herd of Argentinosaurs in the room. Overpopulation seems to be the looming problem. Of course, Argentinosaurus is now extinct. There's probably a lesson there somewhere.
Mark |
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Riverjohn
Joined: 08 Nov 2016 Posts: 34 City/Region: Portland
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Posted: Fri Feb 03, 2017 10:05 pm Post subject: |
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Marco Flamingo wrote: | thataway wrote: | I think some are missing the elephant in the room. Overfishing |
Worrying about overfishing may be missing the herd of Argentinosaurs in the room. Overpopulation seems to be the looming problem. Of course, Argentinosaurus is now extinct. There's probably a lesson there somewhere.
Mark |
Certainly true in many lakes that have Kokanee, overpopulation only stunts growth. |
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thataway
Joined: 02 Nov 2003 Posts: 20814 City/Region: Pensacola
State or Province: FL
C-Dory Year: 2007
C-Dory Model: 25 Cruiser
Vessel Name: thataway
Photos: Thataway
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Posted: Sat Feb 04, 2017 12:13 am Post subject: |
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Always hard to know the truth--probably even harder now with the internet. I am not directing this comment toward any one article, or way of thinking--because I don't really know the truth.
Many years ago, I was seated next to the Long Beach Ca. Press Telegraam's science editor. He had written some articles which were factually incorrect. I asked him why he wrote what he did. Answer " My job is to sell newspaper, not always to tell the truth."
People have views to peddle. I think in the Salmon fisheries there is some of that on both sides. I do know that salmon is good for you. I know that I really enjoy a good fresh caught fish, better than any I get at the fish market.
As for over population and food--currently there is more of a distribution problem, than a food shortage. Many populations are shrinking--especially in first world countries. There is concern that population will keep up with demands for workers--in some areas. |
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Pandion
Joined: 02 Oct 2013 Posts: 274 City/Region: Kenmore
State or Province: WA
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Vessel Name: Osprey
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Posted: Sat Feb 04, 2017 11:03 am Post subject: |
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thataway wrote: | Always hard to know the truth--probably even harder now with the internet. |
Like Bob, I don't profess to know the truth. But that doesn't mean the truth is unknowable. When I read Tamar Haspel's Seattle Times article I was struck by its one-sidedness. There is no one quoted in the article from the anti-fish farming side of the argument—such as Alexandra Morton, for example—only enthusiastic supporters of just how far fish farming has come, by golly.
There are no reader comments at the bottom of the story, and all we have to go on is what Tamar Haspel tells us. So, we need to find out a little more about her and about how impartial her reporting is. The editors at The Times should have done that before printing the article. But they have busy jobs and it's a lot of work getting a paper out every day. The good news is that with the magic of Google we can do some of the editors' work for them.
I want to emphasize, again, that I don't know the truth here. But the lack of balanced reporting in this story made me smell ... something fishy. A very quick search on Tamar Haspel's name found the following two stories (c'mon Times editors, do your homework):
From TruthWiki: Tamar Haspel – Washington Post columnist
And from Natural News: Meet the sleazy Monsanto operatives pretending to be journalists for Discover, Slate, The Washington Post and the New York Times
I would like to hear a more diverse range of opinions weighing in on Ms. Haspel's Times story, and will attempt to share this information with Alexandra Morton and the authors of the two critical articles mentioned above. It's not too late to go to the comments section at the bottom of The Times story and present a different viewpoint. _________________
Andy Ryan
Last edited by Pandion on Sat Feb 04, 2017 11:15 am; edited 1 time in total |
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Pandion
Joined: 02 Oct 2013 Posts: 274 City/Region: Kenmore
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